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Clone Wars Gregor (Season 5 spoilers)

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Coric, Sep 3, 2012.

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  1. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    The voice was familiar, the face even more so.
     
    Mia Mesharad likes this.
  2. Humble_Jedi

    Humble_Jedi Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2004
    there was a voice behind my back
    the face, I could not see it clear
    the voice was so familiar though
    I knew my enemy was near
     
  3. QuangoFett

    QuangoFett Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Except Darman never had to be reminded that he was a clone in the Republic military.

    Though in retrospect, that would have been helpful. :p
     
  4. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    I'm still growing weary of the blind patriotism of the clones and how they get treated by others.

    I'm getting the impression that if Cut were ever discovered, that an officer could just scan his arm and remind him that he's a soldier of the Republic and that his "country needs him" and that he'd just pick up his rifle and get back to work.

    If Gregor forgot who he was, then that's pretty much a means through which Gregor has forgotten his training/brainwashing to be loyal to the Republic and fight and die for it. Unless he's like a sleeper agent and he's receiving some kind of trigger to remind him of his mission, then I would not think that being told you are a clone and a soldier raised to die for a political entity he probably doesn't remember he cares about is going to make him want to drop what he's doing and go back to being a commodity of the Republic.

    And on the other end of things, I would have expected more officers (at least non-Jedi officers) to have more of a Krell mind-set toward the clones. They are just a product to be bought from Kamino, and they have been bred for the sole purpose of fighting and dying in this war, apparently because a Jedi foresaw it. Yet, they keep getting treated like normal humans. I see a moral dilemma there. On the one hand you are looking at a living human and might feel the compulsion to treat them as such, but on the other hand if you see them as human then the whole situation that they've been forced into should be all kinds of messed up and you can't treat them as a commodity (i.e. slave) at the same time as trying to treat them with the same respect as a normal human. Anakin doesn't even make any kind of bond/sympathetic connection to the fact that he's serving with troops that were sold to the Republic and forced into compulsory service, just as he was sold to Watto and forced to work, lest he be blown up if he tried to escape.

    If Gregor has forgotten who he was, then he should be seeing things with a clarity that the other clones don't when approached by Slug-Man.

    I know the films didn't have time to address such matters, but I figured TCW would.

    I was expecting something deeper about the ethics of the cloning for war situation, such as was the case in the episode Similitude of Star Trek: Enterprise.

    The premise of which is that the Earth has been attacked by an alien super weapon that doesn't do as much damage as intended and the Enterprise is on its way to the aliens' world to stop the weapon from being launched again. On the way the Enterprise gets stuck in an anomaly that is shutting down the ship's systems and the engineer gets into an accident and goes into a coma, but only he can solve the problem. So they raise a clone of the engineer that will live its entire life cycle in 15 days, for the sole purpose that it will be used in a tissue transplant to bring the engineer out of the coma. As the clone grows he begins to have memories of the engineer's life and realizes that he isn't normal. He is eventually flat out told what his purpose is, and there becomes the issue of the clone desiring to have his own life, albeit for 15 days, while he would need to be harvested before then for the tissue to be compatible. The memories that the clone is having allow him to solve the problem, eliminating the immediate need for the engineer, but the situation brings out the ugliness in the Captain who is willing to force the clone to undergo the operation (and consequently die) if need be, reasoning that the lives of the people on Earth are depending on the success of the mission and the success of the mission requires the engineer, forcing the Captain to consider murder if required.

    Even with Cut, he's apparently broken free and living his own life, though doesn't care enough to see his brothers given the same freedom? Slick and Cut recognized what was wrong. I'd expect at least one clone to stand up and finally say "well, what the hell?" and open someone's eyes like Padme's. Or see enough clones open their eyes and want to leave the army only to see the Republic's response to be to execute them as deserters (or even have Cut be discovered by the Republic and dragged off to his fate while Rex is helpless to intervene. Don't sugarcoat the messed up situation, since the messed up situation can make for a better story IMO.
     
  5. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    I agree! I think Gregor is suffering from the clone disease "Cut's syndrome" where a clone is sick of the Jedi and the Republic and escapes it all.
     
  6. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    There's an equivalent to that and it's called "TCW's syndrome." :p
     
  7. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Sounds about right Doctor GG. I like your medical diagnosis.
     
    Darth_Vemonis likes this.
  8. AkashKedavra_93

    AkashKedavra_93 Moderator Emeritus star 4 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Well we got back to Clovis, so you never know...
     
  9. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Difference is that Clovis is still in the war. He just allowed his feelings to get in the way of serving the IGBC which will cost him in S5.
     
  10. Garth Maul

    Garth Maul Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 18, 2002
    Remember DBrennan? Despite some craziness, he did have some interesting views on how the clones were portrayed in TCW. He said they were going way too far with giving them free will and personality differences.

    Certainly this show has gone out of its way to portray the clones as real characters, and if they can just get scanned back to compliance, not really sure if I'll like that. No wait, I definitely won't.
     
  11. Seerow

    Seerow Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 7, 2011
    This would make a hell of an arc.
     
  12. Deputy Rick Grimes

    Deputy Rick Grimes Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Cut and Gregor should team up
     
  13. Seerow

    Seerow Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 7, 2011
    I'd rather Cut be left out of this one. Cut has the potential to be a much deeper characters. If Cut were to return to battle I think it would be much better if battle came to his door step and his guilt got the better of him when the rest of his brothers are losing. I've also ways though Tup's armor would suit Cut well. <<;
     
  14. Garth Maul

    Garth Maul Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 18, 2002
    Not sure I want Cut to return in any form.

    I am sure I don't want Cut to speak to Padme.
     
  15. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Cut is much better than Rex and most other clones on the show.
     
  16. Mia Mesharad

    Mia Mesharad Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    I don't want Cut to ever show up again. And it's not because I don't like him. It's because I really do like him, and I feel like any return he might make would just lead to them killing him off. I love that he's managed to get free, and that he stumbled into this new life where he can settle down and have a family. He's found a little happiness, and I happen to think that every once in a while, it's nice when a character just gets to have that happy ending.

    Also TaradosGon, have you read the Republic Commando novel series? Because if not, you absolutely should. It quite literally has every single thing you were asking for on the issue of the ethics of the clone army.
     
  17. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
    Manclone..

    When I heard that I thought "MANCUB!"

    No more Cut. His arc ended fine.

    Arguable
     
  18. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    At this point after Umbara, every clone is better than Rex.
     
  19. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Why the Republic Commando series is overlooked is beyond me...

    Many people want TCW to show certain aspects of the Clone Wars, when the Clone Wars multimedia project and its derivatives have already covered what they are looking for, and in a far superior manner.
     
  20. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
    Okay.. that's not what I meant.. but now we're having two conversations at once.. yay multi-tasking!

    1. There are other "better" clones. Like Fordo.. Alpha.. to name a few.
    2. How is "every clone better" than Rex after Umbara? And don't give me the "waah, he did kill Krell! The pansy!" treatment.. he stopped the friendly fire, did he not? He covered for the dissent of Fives, Jesse, and Hardcase. He has his faults, but he's not the worst clone to ever pop up..

    Now cardboard Fives on the other hand.. :p
    (I like all clones though, so we will obviously bash heads, Dan.)
     
  21. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Ok... Fordo and Alpha are excellent examples of clones that take charge and do what needs to be done. But are awesome in the fact that they are true clones that follow orders.
    Umbara just showcased how weak of a character Rex is. How he can not carry an entire arc. NOT killing Krell has nothing to do with it.
    He has too many faults for my taste...

    But as CIS fan I generally dislike most clones but I dislike Rex the most!
     
  22. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
    "How can he not carry an entire arc"

    Because if he carried the whole arc by himself that would be showing signs of a gary stuuuuuu :p
     
    KenobiSkywalker likes this.
  23. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    The problem is that he was tasked to carry the arc of Umbara. And yes, he was a Gary Stu!
     
  24. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
    Carry the Umbara arc? There are several characters that can be argued to have carried the arc.. How about Fives? The one who suspected Krell first?
     
  25. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan

    Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Fives was the better character in that arc. That is why I am interested what the future holds for him. Rex - not so much.
     
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