Lit Han and Leia in the EU - A Discussion Thread (Life Debt spoilers must be tagged)

Didn't Lucas himself use the phrase "Gone With The Wind In Outer Space" at least once?:

And others have commented on the dialogue and poster similarities:

Presumably Lucas moved away from "Han as Rhett" with the carbonite scene, Han asking Chewie to take care of Leia, etc - and even more so in ROTJ.

 

Han Solo ???? Movie????

 

There's a ton of similarities and some blatant copying, not disputing that. But throughout GWTW, Scarlet remains a selfish and spoiled narcissist while Rhett remains a callous jerk. Neither of them change. He also rapes her at one point, which is something I think we can all agree Han would never do to Leia.

In ROTJ, Leia's character changes to put love over duty and rescue Han and commits fully to her relationship with him (volunteering to join him on his mission), while Han develops into a mature and unselfish leader by officially joining the Rebellion and volunteering to lead a dangerous mission. Kasdan in his interviews (along with JJ) just seem to want to ignore all the character development because Han's "cooler" as the rogue in ANH/ESB and Leia's more fiery and "feminist" as a bad ass Rebellion leader sans love interest.

There's documented evidence of the fights Kasdan and Lucas got in over ROTJ, with Kasdan wanting ROTJ to end on a bittersweet note and the three heroes either going their separate ways and/or Han dying and Luke and Leia going their separate ways.

 

"Han and Leia probably did get married," Lucas conceded. "They settled down. She became a senator, and they got a nice little house with a white picket fence. Han Solo is out there cooking burgers on the grill."

While JJ said that Han couldn't settle down and that it could be a betrayal to his character

 

JJ's favourite movie is ANH and he has never said anything good about ROTJ (I think he's one of those ANH and ESB were awesome and then it was downhill since there fans), so I just think he ignores any character development Han and Leia had in ROTJ because he thinks Han was cooler as a single smuggler.

Even between ANH and ESB Han sticks around for 3 years when he really has no reason to so to say he can't stick around seems at odds even with ESB Han.

 

From linkee - "the concept of Han Solo that i developed from the extended universe {legends} was that he was this man who lied, stole, cheated, killed, swindled, and smuggled for a living out of necessity, because of the aggressive and poor and cutthroat environment he was born and raised in, he learned how to fight, and how to be selfish and hard and suspicious, because that was survival, and all throughout that there’s still all these indications that he was trying to find some goddamn stability so he could be the decent person he actually wanted to be (joining the Academy, saving Chewbacca, etc.) – and so when he got to marry Leia, and they had Jacen, Jaina, and Anakin, he was in the place where he was all safe and stable and he had a home and family and it was everything he really had always wanted, he’d just never had the privilege of luxury of striving for it or thinking he’d get it "

First of all, yes. This guy gets it like J. J. Abrams doesn't.

Second of all, it's actually even more complex, more interesting, and more of a credit to Han Solo than that. Han is a man who was raised by criminals but who always had an honest streak and wanted to some day be more, raise himself to honor and respectability. And thanks to a ton of hard work and risk taking, it works out for him when he joins the Imperial Starfleet. But, he quickly discovers that "honest" society sanctions crimes that are as bad as anything he's ever seen among regular outlaws, and because he actually is honest and honorable, he ultimately can't be a part of that either. And goes back to the outlaw life, where he's still in the company of scoundrels, but at least has a little more independence to do things on his own terms.*

Which is noteworthy because it means the uniform isn't just the costume for him that it could easily have been. There's lots of people who, having pulled themselves out of the pit, would cling to their newfound respectability for all it was worth and then some, and simply ignore all the ugly things that were right in front of their eyes - becoming, as Captain Cohl might've said, just a licensed crook instead of a common crook. But Han isn't that guy, which says a lot about how much of a moral center he already has.

(Doesn't mean he's perfect, or that he never does things out of greed or convenience - he's only human, and the environment does encourage that. But still).

I always figured Dewlanna probably deserved the lion's share of the credit for putting him on the path to becoming more than just another Shrike.

* Point of interest: this is also Jack Sparrow's origin story. Yes, because A. C. Crispin wrote a book about him too, but if you watch the deleted scenes from "At World's End," you can see that the basic story was the same long before she got her hands on the character - child of pirates, at some point goes to work for the East India Trading Company, frees a cargo of slaves, and goes back to the outlaw life.

 

http://www.starwars.com/news/star-w...-celebrates-40-years-of-a-galaxy-far-far-away

Oh man, this looks like it could be awesome for fans of the OT. Maybe we can get some perspective of what the Rebels thought of Han and Leia's arguing on Hoth

 

Well, that'll be for the sequel for ESB in 3 years time.

 

Finally a positive article about Han and Leia! And as a bonus it's anti-Reylo http://screenrant.com/star-wars-kylo-rey-romance-reylo/

Isn't it sad that seeing an article where Han and Leia are mentioned in a positive light is like a unicorn nowadays?

 

Yep, I think the whole Reylo concept is indicative ("symptomatic", as we'd say in French) of a deeply twisted view of sentimental relationships that's way too common in what they accurately call the "post-Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey age."

 

FINALLY!!!!!!!!!

 

This is very good and very sad in equal measure:

http://ew.com/movies/2017/04/13/car...nds-with-emotional-john-williams-performance/

 

Maybe will there Han/Leia stuff in Forces of Destiny

• The most interesting of all, considering these are canonical tales, is one that will see Hera Syndulla from Rebels team up with Princess Leia and Han Solo on the forest moon of Endor, which seemingly pretty much guarantees that Hera sticks around for a while in the new Star Wars canon after Rebels and Rogue One.

http://io9.gizmodo.com/star-wars-forces-of-destiny-already-sounds-awesome-1794302358

 

Apparently they just announced a new Leia novel by Claudia Gray at Celebration. Sounds like a Young Adult novel but if Claudia's writing it, then we know we are in for a treat.


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Yep, it'll be good.

 

Super excited about the Leia news in Forces of Destiny and young Leia book! I always felt gypped we never got a pre ANH Leia book in the old EU when I consider her life as a double agent far more interesting than Luke or Han's. I know we're in good hands with Claudia Gray. Do you think she'll give Leia a pre ANH love interest?

Love the tribute to Leia, but like someone mentioned in another forum, it's a little disingenuous of LFL/Disney to be falling all over themselves about what a groundbreaking feminist icon Leia was who little girls looked up to but then in the official material push the anti feminist BS that Leia was a failure as a wife and mother because she had an important career.

 

Do I need say anything more?

 

AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

 

Help me out here guys: can someone explain to me why Reylo shippers hate Han/Leia? Or why Reylo fans would be trying to make Han and Leia's relationship dysfunctional and doomed to fail? I'm sure there's a reason but seeing as I only skim fandom from time to time I don't know what it is.

Isn't it just?!

 

I would guess it's:

"If Kylo's fall was partly due to Han/Leia's dysfunctional relationship - that makes Kylo much more sympathetic, and thus, his redemption by Rey, easier to support"

 

Plus in their mind it makes it easier to justify killing Han...because murder is a totally appropriate response to your father not doting on you enough as a child.

 

Usually Reylo is based on the premise of Kylo being a sympathetic character and it not really being his fault he went to the Dark Side and thus able to be fully redeemed before he can marry Rey. So the easiest way to make him sympathetic is to give him a tragic childhood - in this case having to suffer through Han and Leia screaming at each other constantly and Han walking out on both of them and Han and Leia being abusive parents. That way it's Han and Leia's fault he went Dark, not Kylo's. Most Reyloers don't give a hoot about the OT and only got into SW when TFA came out so they don't really care about crapping all over Han and Leia's characters as long as it makes Kylo look good.

Apparently there was an audio drama of a Han/Leia adventure pre ESB that came out during celebration? Did anyone listen to it? I heard it had a few cute UST moments.

Also, the Han Solo panel had a discussion topic about "Was fatherhood too much of a challenge for Han Solo?" but I think it was just a fan made panel not an official LFL one (if it is, I'll be annoyed).

 

It was definitely a fan panel unicorn. Nothing official. I'm wondering if it will be on YouTube at some point, I'd be interested in watching it. But I think only the big panels were filmed.


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Smuggler's Revenge is the onstage audio drama performed at this year's celebration. I really liked it. It's posted on the Disneyland Experience Youtube Channel.