ST Has TFA started an adult-oriented Star Wars trend?

My son and nephew were with my dad and I when I saw it first... They are 10. They both kinda jumped in their seats when that happened... I felt bad a bit, though they both loved TFA.

 

He drives the crossguard of his lightsaber into Finn's shoulder (onscreen) and we hear Finn's screams of pain/agony. He has an entire village of defenseless people massacred. He brutally mentally tortures Poe and Rey in scenes that are VERY creepy, and in Rey's case there's pretty blatant sexual assault/violation undertones to it. Finn impales a Stormtrooper with a lightsaber, there's mass genocide on a system-wide scale, overt/blatant Nazi imagery/callbacks, etc.

 

I think it's a HUGE mistake - and one made by Lucas himself - to not understand what kids like. There are plenty of entertainment options catered toward little little kids. Star Wars doesn't need to be one of them. The OT wasn't. Kids loved it, but it was a sort of serial sci-fi adventure that wasn't too gritty (Blade Runner) or cerebral (Star Trek). I promise you, when I was 5 years old, I had no problem pretending I was Luke or Han or Darth Vader. I didn't need or want to see a kid 'my age' in the story. I also didn't need poopie jokes. What Lucas did in TPM was a sort of ignorant attempt to patronize children. It was like when Mitt Romney was meeting a black family and sang "who the dogs out, woof woof" (a ~ 20 year old song) because he thought a black family would enjoy what he insultingly believed to be a bit of their culture.

 

Heck I'm older than 10 and I jumped too. Probably for different reasons tho.

 

I think TFA is quite a bit more kid-friendly than the prequels, and the reason is pacing. What keeps my little nieces and nephew the most interested is YouTube videos that are story-less compilations of cute animals or fails. Five seconds, a baby animal. Five seconds, a baby animal. Over and over and over. It's like eating a whole meal of Skittles. The whole idea of a movie with setup, suspense, and resolution is like an imposition for them. When they watch a real movie, as soon as something unresolved comes up, they ask the grownups, "Does he die? Is he bad? Will she get there?" They're used to instant gratification. Every five seconds of the video "pays for itself" in terms of entertainment value. And these aren't stupid kids; they've just been trained to expect a solid mass of immediate payoffs.

You can see a lot of kids' movies adapting to fight back. Jokes, gags, and physical humor packed ever closer together. And the movies that result aren't always bad movies, but they're built around different rules.

The middle acts of TPM and ESB were like gigantic deserts of talking where these kids were concerned, even with humor and interesting creatures/effects sprinkled in. There's not the constant drumbeat of Joke! Joke! Surprise! Surprise! Payoff! Payoff! But TFA kept their attention well. Rapid pacing matters a whole lot to them.

 

For me, the worst SW movies are the ones that are kid-friendly.

Bring on FULL EVIL for me, please. TESB and TFA are very satisfying.

TFA is not so kid-friendly... and I like it.

 

Well, here in Malaysia, TFA was given a PG-13 rating, as compared with some supposedly child-friendly films that got a "G" rating.

Which means that while it's a movie meant for the teenager who's curious as to what the whole SW saga is all about, younger children have to wait until TFA is released on cable or DVD to finally watch it!


Sent from MillenniumFalcon AI using Tapatalk

 

I actually found TFA to be a bit less dark than I had originally anticipated based on the trailers. It had a good balance of humor, adventure, and drama. And the comedy wasn't anywhere close to as immature and awful as in TPM.

That being said, I'd like to see episode VIII get a bit darker. Then again, I may not be the most objective critic, since I would be quite happy with dark, violent, R rated Star Wars films.

 

TFA does feel a bit darkner than ANH and ROTJ, it has shades of ESB. But it's hard to understand the criticisms that the film rips off from ANH when tonally it's much closer to TESB, right down to the rapid fire wittiness and jokes.

 

John Boyega said that the next episode will be very dark. I expect it to be the TESB of the ST.
I can already see people saying it will be a rehash of TESB "because it is darker"....

 

By that token, it'd could also be a "rehash" of The Dark Knight, Avengers: Age of Ultron, The Godfather Part II, Toy Story 2, How to Train Your Dragon 2, Kung Fu Panda 2, X2, etc,

"Darker/more emotional sequels" is just kind of the usual norm, especially when it comes to trilogies.

 

...and it's pretty standard for the protagonist(s) to take it on the chin in the second act. It's almost completely necessary in order to build drama. That's why I think both Kylo Ren and Rey will be much more powerful in e8, but Kylo Ren will be the most so.

 

Absolutely. I can't wait to see their rematch when Rey has some training, underneath her belt, and Kylo doesn't take it as easy on her.

 

And his comment about a droid stealing a ship was a hit humorous or at least ironic.

 

It's interesting to here people talk about how "flawed" Luke was in ANH. Because, no not really. He was a bit whiny early on, but that's about it. And he doesn't really flat-out fail at much in that film. In fact, he succeeds at pretty much everything that he puts his mind to, and ends the movie as the hero of the Rebellion.

ESB, on the other hand, there Luke fails pretty much every single step of the way (and it's mostly his own fault):

-He gets careless, and gets knocked out by the Wampa and then needs Han to save him from freezing to death as a consequence.
-He and the Rebels fail to stop the Empire from capturing the base on Hoth, and has to flee.
-He fails both the X-Wing and cave tests on Dagobah, due to his lack of belief and confidence.
-He doesn't listen to Yoda and Obi Wan's warnings when he flies off to try and rescue Han and Leia. And thusly, he walks right into Vader's trap, utterly fails to save Han, gets his butt handed to him, and ironically needs to be saved himself by Leia and Lando.

And this was a GOOD thing, since it makes his awesomeness and ultimate triumph in ROTJ all the more satisfying. And I think that we'll have the same idea with Episode VIII and IX. Not the same movies, but the same principle.

 

I usually march to my own drum. Occasionally I find myself in the majority. For example, being a prequel fan. Having said that, I was disappointed when TPM, apparently in the minority then. It was too much like ROTJ , my least favorite SW film. After ROTS I wound up loving all SW movies.

ANH, ROTJ, and TPM are the most kid friendly SW movies.

TESB, AOTC, and ROTS are more for older audiences.

I tend to like the latter more, though I love all SW films.

Likewise, there are more fantastical 007 films and more realistic 007 films. I love all 007 films, but I tend to prefer the latter.

TFA and Skyfall and Spectre have great balance.

 

By becoming the ESB of the ST, I think we will see several shockers in the plot for Episode 8... Who knows, Rey will turn dark towards the tail end of the film and join forces with Kylo Ren (her supposed cousin), while killing off General Hux at the same time - and she replaced him as Commander of the Fleet?

Whilst the New Republic and Resistance suffer a very demoralizing defeat to the massive and powerful fleet of the New Order in space, resulting in them having to beat a hasty retreat with what they have left... To regroup for another attack at a later date (in Episode 9)!


Sent from MillenniumFalcon AI using Tapatalk

 

My only concern here is whether it is fair to the ST team to assume Ep8 will be 'The ESB' of the ST. I think it conjures up expectations that may not be met, or creates expectations for things Rian and JJ never intended to happen.
ie: What if Rey doesn't outright fail like Luke did in Episode 8, what if she continues her own path, but the setbacks are elsewhere.
What if Finn has force powers after all and the darkness is about him and not Rey.
What if Rey doesn't fail but rather simply becomes a darker character (the so called Grey Jedis)

They can go in so many different directions. After the prequels, I am no longer prepared to assume this new trilogy ought to map to the OT.

I would much rather prefer the ST to be its own thing and be surprised by it, like I was with TFA since I had no expectations going in.

As fans, I think we can't simultaneously note TFA cribs from ANH and expect the next one to be the ESB of the ST.
I can almost see the review headlines now "SW8 disappoints, Empire it is not"

 

Hmmm, you really do have very valid points there... So it's actually fair for Rian and his scriptwriters to come up with something wholly original then, with only minimal references to the OT, and surprise us all with the interesting, one-of-a-kind storyline!

And Finn actually being the turncoat, who eventually returns to the Dark Side and working together with Kylo Ren and Captain Phasma? Now that's something which can be explored, as the mother of all twists, completely different from what we have been talking about all along...


Sent from MillenniumFalcon AI using Tapatalk

 

That's a good plot, although having 2 non-white turncoats in the SW universe may be too much. I'm fine if Finn remains good, I think his arc is to be a good character anyways.
It's also possible they intended for it to be the ESB type film. Dark, full of set-backs ending in a real cliffhanger, rather than the emotional cliffhanger we had in TFA. But the beats and happenings could be completely not what people expect.

Maybe Rey doesn't lose a limb !

I'm just mulling over the idea of Episode 8 being The Empire Strikes Back of the ST and talking out loud and riffing off your thoughts as well.

My hope is that it tops TESB

 

It's a family film, not a film for kids. There's something for everyone. Perfectly done by Abrams.

And TFA, while having some very mature psychological themes of regret and inadequacy and death, is also a whole lot of fun. Rathtars, BB-8, Maz's cantina, comedy from Finn, Han, Chewie, Poe, 3PO, etc. It's really not all that "dark."

 

Brutally? We just see a Lighsaber appear behind Han.

in TPM Maul stabs QG in the stomach, we see the blade coming out his back and Maul slowly drawing it back out.
Then Maul is cut in half and both body parts are seen separate as they fall.
Thats METAL! I mean, brutal.

 

We DON'T see the blade go into Qui Gon (we get a close up of his pained facial expression instead) and the blade being removed is actually quite quick. And Maul has to tamest bi-section that I've ever seen. Compare that to what Kylo does to Finn, and there's not contest. Kylo wins.

 

GL stated that ANH was for 12 year old kids. Kids at that age certainly don't want jokes that their 5 year old siblings would laugh at. And 6 years later, I doubt the 18 year olds they grew up to be appreciated teddy bears. As soon as SW attempts to cater for really young kids, it fails.

 

The funniest thing to me is the "it's true because we have always said so" knowledge of ESB as the darkest or almost darkest Star Wars film. Funny because it's completely wrong, in fact. ESB is the ONLY Star Wars movie where absolutely nobody dies. Nobody. Not even a villain. Oh maybe an extra or two, sure. Oh boo hoo freaking hoo Luke loses an immediately replaced hand. Ok.

The main character of TPM dies horribly in front of his apprentice. Maul dies, too
Jango Fett dies in AOTC.
Padme, all of the Jedi pretty much, Dooku, all of the separatists, and Grievous die in ROTS. Anakin turns.
Luke's aunt and uncle and Obi-Wan die, several horribly, in ANH.
Yoda, Vader, and Palpatine all die in ROTS.
Han dies in TFA.

Yeah, ESB is SUPER dark and way more adult than the rest LOL. Allllright.