Discussion Hasn't the Saga Been Concluded?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by Garrett Atkins, Apr 17, 2013.

  1. EHT Manager: New Films

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    The OP is correct in that the Saga (so far) showed us those things, and that Lucas himself said those are the reasons why no more movies would be made. But as others have said, that is what he said at one stage of his life. At other earlier stages he said he wanted to make this a 9 or even 12 part series of movies. Granted, any story treatments he had for the third trilogy were reportedly squeezed into ROTJ, but I think there must have been more to it than what actually fit there.

    At one point, many people were happy to have Star Wars (ANH) as a standalone movie and thought the story would (or even should) end there. Most of us would agree that it only got better when it became a trilogy, and many of us also think it got better again when it became a six-part series. So as long as they do this right, there is no need to think anything will be ruined. The Saga can grow again and get even better.
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  2. Darth Claire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 21, 2012
    star 4
    Star Wars saga does not end...it simply waits to show itself again....like Chuck Norris waiting to attack. ;)
  3. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
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    Come on, you know the ST will ruin ROTJ with the following:
    - The Empire will be the villians, and will still wreak havoc across the galaxy
    - A villian will be a clone- "The Emperor"
    - Terrible new, annoying Jedi
    - An amazing superweapon that can "out do" the Death Star
    - The Sith will return
    Disney, not Lucas, is making the movies. They and their evil empire will destroy these movies with terrible movies.
  4. EHT Manager: New Films

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    No, we don't know that any of that will happen, or that anything will get ruined or destroyed.
  5. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

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    Feb 11, 2013
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    Then three movies with Luke rebuilding the order and no enemy sound extremely boring.
  6. EHT Manager: New Films

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    Well, as long as you know for sure about all the plot lines or story elements that could possibly be included...

    Edit: To clarify... I'm not saying the Empire won't be back, I just don't think it will necessarily be done in a bad way. Same goes with new Jedi or even new superweapons. But you listed all of those possibilities with negative attributes attached to them as a foregone conclusion, and that is what we don't know.

    Some of those things could be done well, and other possibilities we haven't thought of could also be done well.
    Last edited by eht13, Apr 17, 2013
  7. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    From the top of my head an underworld uprising (Hutts and/or Black Sun) taking over would be something we haven't seen. It's not that hard to create a new villain.

    I admit though that the Sith will get resurrected. But they are something unique from Star Wars and therefore should be in.
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  8. Jedi Comedian Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 27, 2012
    star 2
    Except...

    1. We've already seen our heroes take on the underworld and win.

    2. A crime boss is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy below a super-powered genuis with an entire empire at his command.

    3. It would feel tacked on to the rest of the films, rather than a true continuation.

    I agree with the OP. RotJ is the perfect conclusion to all six films of the Saga. Episodes VII-IX are really, really going to have to have work to top it AND maintain a singular story with a cohesive dramatic arc.
  9. LunarMoth Force Ghost

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    Nov 27, 2012
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    Plans change, and now we get an ST!!!
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  10. Seagoat Force Ghost

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    Jan 25, 2013
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    George also wrote the stories for the ST episodes. You know how frequently he changes his mind about things.

    He had had Maul cut in half to ensure he would not return. He also told TCW to make a Maul revival arc.

    It's like poetry, they rhyme.
  11. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    It was just a suggestion to show different plots are possible. Plus I wasn't talking about a simple crime-boss like Jabba but really someone who leads an extensive and very powerful crime syndicate like Black Sun. Someone who can afford to build armies full of mercs and send them at the Republic. Someone who is in a completely different league than Jabba.

    Point 3 is exactly what I am going at. A continuation of the old plot isn't really possible. Therefore "tacking" a new opponent on is the only real option. Of course that would require quite a bit of effort through buildup and all that. Basically starting from square one except for some of the protagonists.
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, Apr 17, 2013
  12. obi-rob-kenobi4 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2007
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    I just want to say that the fan reactions seem to be half right but also half wrong.

    Your right in that the story is concluded. George Lucas's Star Wars Saga (or "the OS") was Six Episodes and ended with Episode 6 ROTJ. Then he retired right before giving his blessing (and story outline) for other different artists to try making their own storys in his universe. But storys that take place far away from his saga, the OS.

    Your only wrong in that this wont ruin the OS anymore than the EU already does. All the ST and these new movies are is live action EU thats going to come out every 9 months. Thats all.

    With this new news of Disney indefinitely mass producing SW movies one per year, every summer (considering advertisements thats basically a new movie every 9 months) I think that its more clearer than ever that the new Disney trilogy (and spin off films) is being treated as something separate from George Lucas's Original SW Saga. The OS.

    George Lucas told his SW Saga. He is retired now. And his Saga finished with Episode 6.

    This new trilogy is really nothing more than a one movie per year nostalgic curtain call with Luke and the gang "passing on the torch" to "the new generation" another words a new "gang" for all the new ideas that hollywood geeks are going to come up with in order to keep SW going forever much like a live action EU. Thats really a good way to look at it. Its not going to be official George Lucas SW films. Its going to be live action EU that comes out every 9 months.

    And yes I say this knowing full well that GL always originally wanted the Saga to be made up of 3 Trilogys. A trilogy of trilogys. Thats true. And that is also why its nice to know that the story outline for Episode 7 was done by George himself --but its not his baby like the OS was/is. Its simply him giving the SW "universe" a proper sent off now that he will be officially retired. His OS and the ST are just two different things.

    Really thats just the bottom line of all this. Thats all it is. [face_coffee]
    Last edited by obi-rob-kenobi4, Apr 17, 2013
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  13. 07jonesj Force Ghost

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  14. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

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    No. It only seemed wrapped up once the PT concluded. But, the ST and the further films will widen that story and show it was about much more.


    They weren't condensed to six. George wrote every script as each individual film was developed. What he had were story treatments. And he had those for the ST too if you watched his video announcing the sale of LFL to Disney.
    Last edited by ShaneP, Apr 17, 2013
  15. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

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    . oops. double postage
    Last edited by ShaneP, Apr 17, 2013
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  16. kubricklynch Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 3
    Just because something is "concluded" doesn't mean there isn't room for more stories. I mean the Hobbit was concluded, then they added on LOTR. The Godfather 1 didn't end with any plot threads hanging and they made two sequels, one of them being one of the greatest films ever.
  17. Corvax855 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 23, 2011
    star 2
    To the OP: Lucas himself didn't consider the saga to be concluded seeing as how he still had plans to do a ST post-RotJ to 1999. When TPM came out, he pretty much declared the ST to be a dead project, but there were always plans for there to be one. If you ask me, I think making the ST is more of a "now or never" scenario. With the OT cast getting up there in age (particularly Harrison Ford), now is the time. Look at it from this POV: I'd rather take the risk of the ST being lackluster than never getting a ST to begin with.
    Last edited by Corvax855, Apr 17, 2013
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  18. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

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    I loved the experience of the prequel times as a fan more than the finished films themselves. It was a great time to be a fan again and share it with other fans. So, I'm looking forward to more of that more than the finished movies really. So yeah, make more SW. The movie-eras are great living through as a fan.
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  19. Toonimator Force Ghost

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    Aug 16, 2006
    star 3
    You're describing... the EU!
    -The Empire were the primary villains for 15 more years beyond ROTJ in the EU continuity (with assorted upstarts & break-off warlords liberally mixed in)
    -Clone Emperor returned for THREE comic mini-series as the Big Bad
    -Lots of new Jedi, some of them terrible and/or annoying (at times; Corran Horn sometimes felt like a Gary Stu when his piloting & other similarities or minor differences to Luke were the focus; as a cop with the Force, he was portrayed better)
    -Lots of new superweapons that could 'outdo' the Death Star in one way or another; the more portable World Destroyers first, the star-destroying Sun Crusher, the Eye of Palpatine, the Darksaber, etc
    -The Sith returned via Krayt's "One Sith" (who took many decades to emerge as a new threat), Vergere & Lumiya setting Jacen Solo on the path to the dark side, and the Lost Tribe

    If the Empire's still kicking, I'd rather it be similar to the EU around this time: a separate state, MUCH more lenient than in the days of Palpatine.

    The new threat should be from outside the Empire... to set it apart from the existing Saga, and make it more than just an epilogue, the threat needs to be pretty big and NOT primarily Sith or Imperial. That's what Del Rey tried to do with the Yuuzhan Vong--a threat big enough to challenge both the Jedi and the galaxy as a whole, so it wasn't just another 'civil war' or Sith threat (several years too late, tho, after Bantam's patchwork timeline-filling throughout the '90s). Not that I want or expect the Vong themselves to be the ST's threat, just that they had some of the right ideas: a threat separate from those faced before, presented in very different manner.
  20. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

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    Didn't the story of SW end with the first film? Yes, it could've ended right then and there. Luke and rebels victorious. Everyone happy and applauding...and before you say "Vader escaped!", yeah, so? To what end? He was in a single Tie. Not a threat to anyone on his own.

    So it could have ended in '77 with a single film and everything was just as tidy and wrapped up.

    But it didn't.

    edit: While I agree with you Toonimator that having the Empire and Sith return would be weak, that's only because I'm not creative enough perhaps to imagine a really kick butt story for them to reappear.

    I tend to like the "other" enemy though just to keep things fresh. Or maybe an Imperial remnant sticks around in the background while the republic and new enemy duke it out so they can then go after the whomever the weakened victor is.
    Last edited by ShaneP, Apr 17, 2013
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  21. Echo-07 Force Ghost

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    Nov 9, 2012
    star 4
    This has been discussed ad nauseum. George said SW has always been intended as a generational saga if even he decided to not do them himself. The Creator has thusly decided to continue the saga, which we will now see start with Anakin, go to Luke and then pass on to a new generation. Honestly, even George never fully scratched the surface on the potential for SW. I mean we had two Death Stars. New, "original" and very EXCITING possibilities and potentialities await us so long as this is done right. By right I mean the passing of the torch from the BIg 3 to the newbies.

    I fully expect this to be done so.
  22. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

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    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    What I'd like would be some more insight into the force (not overly much, just a bit) so that we now can answer what the Sith are, why some people have more force than others and why the force seemingly consists of two parts. Imo that's something that hasn't really been explored and could be woven into the ST, especially when the protagonists try to find out why the Sith reappeared.
  23. Echo-07 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 9, 2012
    star 4
    I'll disagree with you a bit. While yes I want to see more about the Sith I don't think the ST is the place necessarily to do so. I think the Old Republic era series would be perfect ground to reveal the story of the Sith. Also, I don't want to see anymore explanation of the Force. Too much demystifies it.
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  24. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Yes, too much explanation would demystify it. I don't want another Midichlorians, don't get me wrong. But answering some of the questions (even partial answers would be nice) would serve to create even more questions.

    The ST is the perfect place to go into Sith because they have to explain why the Sith could return anyway. This explanation could tie into the "nature of the Sith". Right now we know absolutely nothing about them and I think that is a bit cheap and boring.

    Plus I'm not optimistic we'll see a TOR movie anytime soon. Maybe in 2030.
  25. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    But didn't the midis answer why some people had more Force power than others?

    Obi-Wan in TPM: "Not even Master Yoda has a midichlorian count that high."

    I think that has been answered. Now, you're question about the nature of the sith......I don't know.

    Peter Venkman(drinking a soda): I don't know.
    Last edited by ShaneP, Apr 17, 2013