Hate Remarks Towards Lucas Concerns

Discussion in 'Communications' started by bjbrickm, Nov 5, 2002.

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  1. anidanami124 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    I don't expect everyone will succeed at all times--everyone has a bad day from time to time--but I would certainly expect an honest effort to be a well-mannered human being! I mean, that's not just here; that's everywhere.

    I agree with this big time. At the place where I work some one of the people who was work was very rude to the people shoping there. He was also rude to the bosses. Which I think he may have been fired I don't really know.

    But even if your walking out in public. Begin able to say rude things does not make people think your smart it makes themthink your dumb. They also may get very mad at you. Also say one wrong thing to the wrong person well...

    So even in here we can say I don't think GL did a good job this time around with AOTC. But if you only saying things that are hurtful well some people here coudl take that the wrong way. Again this is a PG forum.
  2. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    Look, I don't believe every comment that is written in a Insider or the Official Site is completely honest with fans. I don't believe anything that has to do with the entertainment industry!

    I think I get madder when it seems that people are more than willing to believe that GL and anyone in the entertainment industry isn't out to separate them from their money and isn't out to sell their product!

    I think fans are naive and are willing to be manipulated because they feel that SW is GL's gift to them. I don't believe that!

    I think he was making a movie because HE wanted to create his homage to the serials he grew up on, fine.
    The fandom supported him and over time, he began to feed the fandom whatever he needed in order for him to get his movies made and the money rolling in. I don't believe that GL is totally incorruptable to outside influences or any feelings of greed.

    I don't believe that GL should be worshipped because he made 5 movies!
    There have been a lot of influential films and directors over the years.
    Are you saying that GL is a better storyteller than David Lean, John Ford, or Alfred Hitchcock?

    I respect GL work on the SW films, but I also feel that he hasn't delivered films that are a good as his previous works.
    I also think he's just as willing to be a "businessman" as anyone he distains in Hollywood.

    I think the fans that treat SW as a "gift" from St. George are stupid (Yep, I said it!).
    It was a combination of his original idea, his influences (The Searchers, Flash Gordon, The Hidden Fortress, Joesph Campbell,etc.), his work and the work of other people as well as the public that made the SW Saga popular enough to be a part of pop culture for 25 years!

    Hey, I don't really care about the basher tagline, I think of it as a badge of honor.
    I think it means that I can like parts of SW as well as hate parts of it! I don't have to always find some deep meaning in throwaway lines or think that such flat characters or unoriginal situations are improvements or on par with his previous work!
  3. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    I'm pretty sure banning your co-worker for being rude to customers is outside of our jurisdiction here. :p :D
  4. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    This was just posted by Rebel Scumb in the BS.


    Never underesstimate the power of denial.

    They'll be some crazy rational for this.

    ie "the media bias agaisnt GL convinced people to buy LOTR:EE which sucks over the AOTC which people really loved."
    />
    />
  5. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    Dig down deep inside. Have a mentos and a smile. :)
  6. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    There is a severe inequity in favor of the negativists in the very forum set aside for TPM's fans.

    I wouldn't mind it if I could counter it without being banned.

    Why can't they just have a mentos in response to my comments?
  7. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    Look, some people are --------! I feel that what comes around, goes around. You guys are going to judge people on a smart alec comment about GL? It would be funny if it was GL making fun of himself and he got banned for it! [face_laugh]

    I don't think that if someone makes a dopey comment about GL, they should be banned... what's next?
    I didn't think the "love story" in AOTC was very good... ban me?
    Obviously, this is a reflection on what I think of GL's and JH'S script.
    I thought Jar Jar had a lousy voice... ban me because I'm indirectly putting Ahmed Best down?

    Go-Mer, I think you are just peeved because there is a Basher's Sanctuary. That has to be the reason, every time I leave and come back to these boards you are doing something to either stir people in there up or get people not in there mad about what goes on in there!

    EDIT: I get the feeling that a lot of "Bashers" feel that the AOTC forum is a stronghold for "gushers" and "Lucasworshippers". Perhaps the TPM/AOTC boards are a way to "balance" things out. ;)
  8. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    "Severe inequity?"

    There is an equivalent thread set up to do the exact opposite - TPM Defense Force.

    "You" have one, "they" have one.

    How is there a "severe" inequity about that situation?

    I think maybe your overstating things a bit.
  9. Jabbadabbado Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 1999
    star 7
    Go-Mer. Your style of arguing is that you're mostly unwilling to take on a criticism of the movie and argue it on the merits. Is it right. Is it wrong. That's easy to do, and many "gushers" are willing to do that and do it well. I enjoy reading those posts. I come here to read those posts.

    But you tend to go directly after the attitude/personality of the person making the argument. That's what upsets people. It's designed to upset people. It will always upset people, and you know it. Ad hominem attacks are a rhetorical ploy designed to draw attention away from an argument on the merits.

    Antime you do that, Go-mer, you are essentially derailing the topic of the thread. You're saying: I don't want to argue the topic. I want to argue about why your attitude makes you feel that way.

    I call that deliberate thread sabotage. And that's why people dislike it. And that's why you're banned from the BS.
  10. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    There shouldn't be a "sanctuary" for either group.

    I am not sure if any of you noticed, but I am not a gusher.

    And how is predicting a "crazy" rationale for LOTR DVD sales topping AOTC a criticism of the film?
  11. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    I agree that there shouldn't have to be a sanctuary for either group.

    However, fandom has proved the need for them. And it is fandom that must prove that need no longer exists.
  12. Jabbadabbado Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 1999
    star 7
    I agree Go-mer. You're not a gusher. Because responsible "gushers" don't use your tactics. For me, a gusher is someone who will argue any critical topic on its merits, enthusiastically, responsibly, without backing down. Anyone who goes after the attitudes and personality of the poster, as opposed to the topic, is just a troublemaker.
  13. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    On a side note....

    To the young teens out there

    START A DEBATE CLUB! YOU WON"T LEARN ABOUT DEBATING HERE OR ON ANY OTHER INTERNET CHAT BOARD!!!

    (Sorry, I needed to raise my voice, it's getting busy in here.) ;)

    Seriously, if you want to learn debate skills, really, a movie forum isn't the place. Find a political or issue oriented message board.

  14. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    Sanctuary threads merely entrench the animosity in my opinion.
  15. Jabbadabbado Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 1999
    star 7
    "Seriously, if you want to learn debate skills, really, a movie forum isn't the place. Find a political or issue oriented message board."

    But that's why we're here as opposed to on a political board - it's the entertainment value of spirited debate over things that are fundamentally of no importance.
  16. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    I think it's peoples' attitudes that create animosity.

    Yes, this is for entertainment. My point in saying that, is to show that this a loose discussion.
    Coming here for debate skills, is as smart as coming here to learn good spelling or sentence construction.

    ;)
  17. anidanami124 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    Punisher this hole forum is PG. PG don't you find it odd that many people seem to forget that. That's why you can't say s***, F***, and other words like that. Also what does GL beign Fat have to do with how good SW is?
  18. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    Go-Mer...
    "Sanctuary threads merely entrench the animosity in my opinion."

    I agree to some extent.

    I think everyone realizes that using them as a solution is not without its drawbacks.

    And it should also be noted that effort has been made to try and minimize the useage of them as well. In the AotC forum, for example. EUCommunity is another example.

    But, there's also been tremendous resistance to such limitations expressed by fandom. People try to create them like clockwork in AotC. In EUCommunity about two months ago or so, they were taking the place over.

    So, again, it is fandom that is expressing the need or the wish for their existence. When that need or wish becomes too great, fandom will win out. When that need or wish becomes nonexistent, then so will the sanctuaries.
  19. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    I really don't care hot fat GL is, I think he should try to take care of himself, but if you believe the news, many Americans need to lay off the Twinkies!

    I think that many of the people making these kind of remarks are the teens and trolls that appear from time to time.
    I could be wrong, but I doubt than many people that make comments about GL like that are over 25 and if they are over 25, they are just yanking someone's chain!

    I think the underlying point to this issue is that many "bashers" have made negative comments about GL, RM and others involved in the SW films and this is a way to silence them!

    I take offense to comments saying that GL is the greatest storyteller ever or he's the best director. He's a great businessman, that's for sure. He got many of us when we were young and he's been holding onto us, that is until he needed to play "damage control" and say the SW films are "childrens' films" and all that crap.

    Honestly, what do you think?
    That was meant as a compliment when all the 20 somethings are camping outside of theaters?!
    "Look at me, I'm 22, I work online and I'm spending 2 months in the elements waiting in line to watch a KID'S MOVIE! YEE-HAW!"

    C'mon! ;)

    If I wear a SW shirt, obviously, I'm a SW freak that is going to do that kind of crap? Right?

    I took a lot of garbage at work when the SW fans were doing that stuff during TPM and it's even worse when I go to Magic of Myth and C1/C2 and get "slapped in the face" by GL that I'm some kind of freak that gets into "children's films"?

    Sorry, but I think as a fan, GL has disrespected me as well!
  20. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    What's wrong with them being children's films? "Children's" is not a derogatory comment.

    Saying that prequel fans are naive and brainwashed is rude and defamatory, and is directed at other posters here, so there is no question of whether or not it would be covered by the TOS. It is. Just for the record.
  21. Undomiel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2002
    star 4
    Jedi Galadriel,

    Ah, most wise you are! I'm in agreement, completely. Here's the rub. Some, who shall remain nameless, approach the topics from a decidedly testosterone-laden perspective (meaning aggressively, life in the jungle, dog eat dog, it's a rough world out there, that kinda thing) and some approach it from a decidedly estrogen perspective (be polite because people have feelings [whether you can see them or not] etc). By its very nature, the more aggressive approach is typically the more accepted. Occassionally, however, there will be those rare moments where common sense overrides hormones and people rise above their inborn natures to reach a common, beneficial goal.

    Is this one of those moments? I sure hope so.
  22. Daughter_Of_TheForce Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2001
    star 4
    We sure are getting hung up on politeness here. The application is uneven; "if the bashers weren't so aggressive or so combative" or whatever. What I'm seeing is that no matter how polite or politic a basher is in their criticism or arguement, the other side will suddenly forget to be polite.
  23. Undomiel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2002
    star 4
    It applies across the table, for both gushers and bashers. Common sense, no?
  24. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    Excuse me! But what is advertising?

    You are trying to INFLUENCE someone to choose YOUR product over someone else's!

    I tend to think that by it's nature, that promotion is trying to brainwash someone to a certain extent.

    What was the big excuse used throughout the land by some fans when AOTC didn't make as much money as TPM?
    Well?

    "They didn't PROMOTE it enough."
    "They should have done more to let people know about it." (I've seen that one posted on these boards and a lot of places.)

    I guess Spider-Man was lucky that the Sony promtions team was better at brainwashing people into seeing Spider-Man and all these other Sony films so that they could make more money than AOTC and FOX!
    I'm sure the Sony people's brainwashing will be good enough to make the DVD sales of Spidey beat AOTC's!

    Advertising and promotion are subtle ways of brainwashing, it's the worse thing! If you have enough money & power you can influence as many people as you want, you don't have to be a part of the government or a conspiracy group like something on the X-Files!


    I don't believe this!

    "Children's film" has a stigma attached to it! It's cute and fluffy, no real issues explored here, it's a bunch of escapist fantasy... they are good to appease the children, but generally it's "junkfood" for the kids.
    I'm sure if you told a bunch of "sophisticated" adults that you camped outside for months to see TPM or AOTC you are going to be treated like a valued member of the society!

    I remember a time when GL used to not excuse his films as kids movies. At the time, I think he felt it was an insult. I never thought he would use those words to describe his "modern myth".





  25. Punisher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 1998
    star 4
    I love the thinly veiled comments. ;)

    I guess me get away from the box of light and kill mammoth for tribe! Too many words, me no understand. :(

    Actually, I guess I shouldn't be too ashamed about liking children's films... I read that Adolph Hitler was a fan of Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs & King Kong!

    Everyone starts with words, but eventually, they revert to their natural "animal tendencies" and throw stones and attack in packs.
    Oh, I'm sorry. That's just a trait of the testosterone freaks! [face_laugh]

    What did Sarah Conner say in T2...
    "Men only know how to destroy, they don't know what it's like to create something, to feel it growing inside them."


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