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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Pittsburgh, PA Hayden as Blue Ghostie

Discussion in 'NorthEast Regional Discussion' started by greencat336, May 27, 2005.

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  1. greencat336

    greencat336 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2001
    When Hayden was CG'd into ROTJ, I thought it was an even worse idea than Greedo shooting first. But several people told me that once I'd seen ROTS, it would make sense, in universe. (since out-universe, we all know it was just George tinkering.)

    Well, I've now seen ROTS twice and read the book. And I still don't understand why it make sense to have young Anakin as Blue Ghostie.

    After all, Obi is an old guy. Who can tell with Yoda. And I don't buy that, Ani is young again because that's how he looked when he was a good guy argument. He was technically a good guy when he died, old crusty white guy that he was. Furthermore, since he was appearing to Luke, who had only seen him as an old guy, it makes even less sense.

    So, can some one give me a really good reason for Ani to show up young as Blue Ghostie?
     
  2. stateless

    stateless Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2002
    I can't, because I agree with everything you said. It has never made sense to me, and I suspect it never will.

    :)
     
  3. Hidai

    Hidai Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Mar 15, 2005
    I agree, I don't understand. Maybe... because at that age he had almost his complete body, and as ghost you cannot "reconstruct" your body, since vader doesn't have any limbs. Still, I didn't find the answer. I think Lucas said something about it on the DVD commentary, I haven't heard it.
     
  4. stateless

    stateless Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2002
    Heh heh, that's a good point. Old Jedi Anakin wouldn't have any limbs; a blue ghostie torso might not be too attractive. ;)
     
  5. Phisherton

    Phisherton Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    May 19, 2005
    yes its on the DvD commentary, it was basically something about that after padme died etc, he lost his tru self in vader, and his last "good" memory was at that time so thats how he would appear, IE yoda and Obiwan died happy so they retained there "dying form" I don't know, i gotta go listen to it, lol.
     
  6. Dex1138

    Dex1138 Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 1999
    That's pretty much it right there. Lack of limbs aside, it was how Anakin Skywalker last looked (as opposed to Vader).
     
  7. MetalliJedi

    MetalliJedi Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 10, 2002
    That sounds semi reasonable. I still don't like it.
     
  8. greencat336

    greencat336 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2001
    Its just such a lame excuse to CG in Hayden. Anakin dies content as an old guy. As for the limb thing . . . Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. So therefore, Ani could appear with blue ghostie limbs intact.

    Sigh.

     
  9. Chris-Stacina_Rajinn

    Chris-Stacina_Rajinn Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 15, 2002
    The Anakin that they originally had in ROTJ never existed. Old Ani not only had no limbs, he wasw also covered in scars. Not too pretty. Also, I supose it could be argued that Anakin looked that way when he was "killed" by Vader.

    Another reason could be that in order to project one's self as a blue ghostie they would have to have a mental image of themself, and that's how Anakin remebers himself looking. I don't imagine that Vader went around taking off his helmet and looking in mirrors, so how would he know what he looked like when he was old and scarred? And for that matter, how would he know how he looked old and unscarred? He's never looked that way, why would he project himself as someone that he's never seen?

    I dunno, I could be wrong, but having Hayden in ROTJ doesn't really bother me anymore.
     
  10. jedi_master_sal

    jedi_master_sal Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 20, 2002
    Stacie, that's the first reasonable explanation that I've heard about this.

    True he wouldn't know how he would look old, were he not scarred and he wouldn't want to look like his hideously scarred self. So, it does stand to reason then that he would remake his ghost vision of himself as he saw himself.

    Great point Stacie!

    I don't think a better argument could be made. For me this point has been put to rest. I think I can now accept Hayden's ghost in ROTJ.

    -Sal
     
  11. ben_ethus

    ben_ethus Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 17, 2001
    Greetings, blokes.

    I hate the fact that I'm about to type this since I revile Hayden's presence in ROTJ, but Stacie's theory actually makes a great deal of sense. I submit that Luke would still have no idea who it is he's looking at, though. :p

    Stuck in the office once again,
    Yours Truly
     
  12. Shewski

    Shewski Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 2002
    "Moichendising, Moichendising, Moichendising" -Yogurt

    We can rationalize all we want to, but it's Lucas trying to shoehorn the PT into the OT. There was no real need to do that, but he wanted to, so he did. He then leaves the "logic" of his decisions to us =)

    That being said, Stacie has a nice theory. =)
     
  13. greencat336

    greencat336 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2001
    Okay. Stacie's theory I can accept. Its a reasonable 'in universe' explanation.

     
  14. MetalliJedi

    MetalliJedi Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 10, 2002
    Very good explinatin!
     
  15. BonMothma

    BonMothma Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 1, 2003
    Of course, Stacie's probably also OK with it because Hayden's much easier on the eyes. :D
     
  16. Chris-Stacina_Rajinn

    Chris-Stacina_Rajinn Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 15, 2002
    Now why would you say a thing like that, Bonnie? Everyone knows that Sebastian Shaw is WAY more attractive than that new guy they hired ;)
     
  17. BonMothma

    BonMothma Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 1, 2003
    Then why isn't Sebastian Shaw in your icon? :D
     
  18. Stina-Cri

    Stina-Cri Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 18, 2002
    she's keeping with the episode 3 spirit (haha..ok bad pun...)

    it's that new guy that plays vader in episode 3
     
  19. Chris-Stacina_Rajinn

    Chris-Stacina_Rajinn Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 15, 2002
    Though Tina is quite correct about the reason I chose my now previous icon, Bonnie also has a point. Thus, I am changing my icon and proclaiming it Sebastian Shaw week!

    All hail the ever-attractive master of Star Wars, Sebastian Shaw!!!!!

    ;)
     
  20. DarthGyos

    DarthGyos Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 23, 2001
    Sorry Cat- can't some up with a good OR B.S excuse for Lucas's crimes against Fandom.

    Anakin died. If you want to use the 'last time he was a jedi' excuse, that doesn't work. When Vader throws the Emperor into the pit, then he is redeemed.

    BRING OLD ANAKIN BACK!!

    BTW: WAZZUP P'BIGGY!!

    ~DG~
     
  21. greencat336

    greencat336 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2001
    Sigh. Yeah, I'd rather have Sebastian back, too. But at least Stacie gave me a reason so I can see Hayden without feeling the need to shout at the TV screen.

    Or do something like I do when the cantina blashpamy occurs and I make my nephews and nieces chant "Greedo doens't really shoot first, Han does." :D
     
  22. edog37

    edog37 Jedi Master

    Registered:
    Mar 20, 2005
    dude,
    oldest trick in the book. marketing, plain & simple....he wanted to tie in the OT with the prequels, so why not have Hayden in there? Admittingly, it did look a little stupid with old Obi Wan & young Anakin, but when did Lucas ever listen to the fans?
     
  23. Chris-Stacina_Rajinn

    Chris-Stacina_Rajinn Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 15, 2002
    Why should Lucas listen to his fans? He can make his movies the way he wants to. He's earned that much. That's the wonder of being in charge. Besides, with all due respect, Sebastian Shaw wouldn't really have fit into the Vader suit. Not that Hayden fit into it perfectly either, but his body type does make more sense.
     
  24. Darth_Iratus

    Darth_Iratus Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Jun 8, 2005
    I'd like to see some red ghosties. Anakin could confront his Darth Vader form that way.
     
  25. jangofett219

    jangofett219 Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    May 2, 2003
    Darth Iratus,
    Being that users of the dark side are perverters of the force, I dont think there could be a possible afterlife image for them. It's sort of a perception of heaven and hell.
    Which leads me into the thought of why Anakin had a full body ghostie.
    When we see Obi-Wan and Yoda die, there bodies dissapear. For Qui-Gon, his body does not disappear. For Anakin, we are not sure what happens to his extra crispy barbequed torso, but it is possible that it could have disappeared because at his cremation we only see the suit and helmet, not Anakin himself. They dissapeared and came back as blue ghosties because they were preparing their spectral images. Qui-Gon, on the other hand, confident he would filet Darth Maul, was caught off guard and did not have time to prepare his spectral image. He only had enough time to recite to Obi-Wan his last wish, to train Anakin. That is perhaps why it took him the entire prequel trilogy to become a blue ghostie which we never get to see anyway. (Jedi purgatory perhaps?)

    Blue Ghosties are not holograms of your corpse before you die, they are simply an avatar of the afterlife.
     
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