[HCSF] *Official* 3NS Members ROTS Review Thread

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith (Non-Spoilers)' started by Mace Windy, May 17, 2005.

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  1. TurnedJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 2
    I posted my initial reactions in the Initial-reactions-thread, but now after nearly 48 hours I?ve calmed down (slightly) I?ve written a spoiler-free review. But since I?ve only seen the film once, it will no doubt change.

    I?ve come to terms that it is a good film. But it is completely different from all other Star Wars films, Empire included. It was not at all what I was expecting. I was expecting something along the lines of an up beat adventure flick, with a touch of darkness. What I got was the complete opposite. This is not a bad thing, though. And probably the main reason why I think my opinion will change after a second (and third and forth and so on) viewing, as well.

    Because I knew nothing about Revenge of the Sith, beyond the basics that?s been the stuff of legends for nearly thirty years. I had no idea what was coming, and what did come shocked me. Several images and scenes disturbed me, and still do when I think of them. They were just so cruel, not only psychological but physical as well. The characters in the film are subjects of horrid acts. Pain is evident every frame during the last hour and a half.

    Pain that is delivered very well by the actors. Everyone does a great job, even minor characters step up to the challenge. My only complaint about the acting, while it may be blasphemy to say :p, is that Ian McDiarmid goes a bit over the top once or twice. The dialogue is also fine, almost every line has a hidden under meaning that will be debated in these forums for years to come. The romance dialogue may not be great, but it works and is only a tiny portion of the lines spoken.

    Lucas also shows an improvement as a director, and also an added confidence in both himself and the actors. Not everything is spelled out to you, the actors are allowed to act out with their faces, not only through their dialogue as was the case with Clone. Except in one case, where a voice-over is used when it really isn?t needed. That scene however, is superb none the less. It shows that this is the story Lucas wanted to tell all along with the prequels, he is not afraid to pull out all the stops and go as far as he wants to and knows is needed.

    He still have a big problem though, an over-reliance on ?cool?-scenes, even though it has diminished since Clones and Menace. Effect-wise Sith is a masterpiece, nothing looks flawed and for the most part the effects are used as backdrops, not centrepieces. But about 45-60 minutes in (a wild guess on my part as I didn?t have time to look at my watch when I saw the film, but it feels about right) there is an action sequence that is simply too much, and it means very little to the story.

    The new characters are good. General Grievous (can I say his name in here?) is good, I like his stile and he looks totally realistic, but he doesn?t have much to do with the Big Story, so when I look back on his appearance in the film I only think that he was over-used, while being under-used at the same time. Make any sense?

    The Big Story. The Turn. I like it. It has been set up in the other prequels and now we get the fruit, and boy how juicy fruit it is. I do not look at Anakin the same anymore. I heard arguments that the turn is rushed, but I don?t feel that when I consider the choices Anakin had done so far and the consequences they?ve had on his souls. I see why he makes that final decision.

    I like the wipes. Some I don?t remember seeing in a Star Wars film since Hope, so it is good to see them again. Helps to tie the trilogies together, along with some great music. Williams never disappoints, and this is no exception. While one viewing isn?t nearly enough to notice all the tiny details in his music, it was enough to notice how well the music works.

    The tying up is also done very well, with some things that when I saw them I just got a big ol? smile. But then again, as big a paradox is might sound, I smiled a lot in this movie. There are many good laughs in it. Artoo (who gets to shine a lot) get many of them, as w
  2. stormcloud8 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2002
    star 4
    I think that your problem with a 'tiny detail' is probably the same that many have...and I didn't mind it the second time. And if there is enough outrage, it could EASILY be fixed on the DVD.
  3. TurnedJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 2
    Yeah, that detail is the one many others have voice, so I hope it better be "fixed" on the DVD.

    BTW, is there any differences between the filmversion and the digital version of the movie? Maybe GL's fixed it already. One can always hope...
  4. Darth_Surgent Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 14, 2004
    star 4
    Argh, I must know what this "tiny detail" is. Well, only ten hours to go. :(
  5. Lord_Hydronium Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 11, 2002
    star 5
    I want to know too, and I've seen the movie. Anyone want to PM me or post it in spoiler tags?
  6. DamonD Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2002
    star 6
    EDITED. This is a [HCSF] thread for reviews, so unfortunately no info from the movie allowed. ;)
  7. Darth-Seldon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2003
    star 6
    I edited it out for now. Too much information.
    Post it later, I will.

    -Seldon
  8. Darth_Surgent Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 14, 2004
    star 4
    Okay, I've seen the film and I still can't tell what bothered you guys. :p

    A nice little PM would be appreciated, if convenient. ;)
  9. vikingjedi1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 2
    I was expecting a lot more from this movie. Way too many things didn't make sense, everything happens too fast with no build up, and it didn't feel like a Star Wars movie to me. IMO it was like Lucas didn't have enough time to tell the story so everything was smushed together.

    Overall: D+

    Sorry, I wanted to like it (in fact I was doing everything possible to like it). Didn't happen.

    New Rankings:

    #1 ESB
    #2 AOTC
    #3 ROTJ
    #4 ANH
    #5 ROTS
    #6 TPM

    Still a must see if you're a Star Wars fan.
  10. Darth-Seldon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2003
    star 6
    Now that the spoiler ban has been lifted here is my informal review. I warn that if you haven't seen the film, you shouldn't read this.


    George Lucas delivers a film as intense and vibrant as a Mustafar larva eruption. The film begins with light-hearted robotic humor and squash buckling adventures. The scene where the infamous Count Dooku loses his head, is the scene that makes it abundantly clear that this will be a darker film. It will explore the decisions that Anakin Skywalker makes and will deal with the consequences of such decisions. Slowly as the film progresses, a shadow is cast on the screen and it grows darker with each minute. Parts of the film are typical of a Star Wars flick. There are the lightsaber battles, the space dogfights, the comical droids, and the Jedi. Yet some parts of this movie have more in common with a Shakespearian tragedy. Not to say that Lucas and his writing is analogous to the Bard (not to say that Lucas can?t write) it is just that story-wise it is very similar to a Shakespeare tragedy. Like Hamlet, just about everyone bites the dust.

    For Anakin, it isn?t the poison at the edge of a sword that destroys him. As Obi-Wan states, he destroys himself. Good becomes evil, democracy becomes empire, adventure becomes tragedy. It is the decisions we all make which determines our reality. Anakin seeks to gain power to protect those he loves. The boy is unwilling to allow any of his loved ones to die. By pursuing further power, he ends up killing those he loves in one of the greatest bits of irony.

    As a good Star Wars fan, originally I saw Revenge of the Sith at the midnight showing. The line was filled with anticipation and enthusiasm. The master storyteller had one last piece of Star Wars history to deliver and all of us couldn?t wait. Finally when the time came, the fans stormed the theater as the French had stormed the Bastille. Every seat was taken, every fan ready, and soon the screen was illuminated by those now famous blue lines. It was Star Wars, and after the crawl was completed, we were all taken into a dizzying space battle. This was Star Wars as it should always be. The reality that this was the last Star Wars film was almost as depressing as the ending.

    The film flashed before me, not to sound trite but I was on the edge of my seat. My primary concern was to stay on the chair and not fall off. For this reason, I didn?t enjoy the film as much as I should?ve and had very mixed feelings. It is so much darker, so much more depressing, I wasn?t at all sure if I could ever enjoy it. On opening weekend, I returned to the theater to see it a second time. This time, I was finally able to sit back and enjoy the show.
    It stirs emotions, if anything it does do that. At times the person watching wants to jump on stage and violently kill Anakin themselves. At others you want to enter the scene to comfort Yoda, Padme, or Obi-Wan. One just can?t casually watch this film. One becomes apart of it and emotions are invested.

    This film adds so much more meaning to the three original films as well as the previous two prequels. It connects the saga and binds it together. The gap is bridged, the saga finished, the circle complete. Darth Vader is not a black obsidian mask, he is a tortured individual. Obi-Wan isn?t just a sapient old man, he has such a story, such a personality. The final duels of Return of the Jedi have so much more meaning. It is made clear that Anakin Skywalker returns to save his son, because he is unwilling to allow any more loved ones to die.

    -Seldon

  11. kingthlayer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 7, 2003
    star 4
    Spoilers:

    Mr. Lucas, you've done it.

    Star Wars Episode III is a phenomenal end to a prequel trilogy that many have felt to be lackluster (though not me). I find it hard to believe that any prequel trilogy bashers will be able to reasonably bash this film without nitpicking. Revenge of the Sith is a sinister, tragic two and a half hour rise of the dark side.

    The beginning of the film starts with a bang, as the camera slowly creeps over a Star Destroyer and then veers down to an amazing shot depicting all hell raging above the planet Coruscant. It continues to get better, as Anakin Skywalker and Obi-wan Kenobi, who have become legends in the Clone Wars, infiltrate the Separatist ship that belongs to General Grievous. The film manages to maintain a strange comic style that stays around for a majority of the first half. There are quite a few laughs as the two Jedi and R2-D2 (who is at his best this time around) search for Count Dooku ("You're welcome" had me laughing for a while), and though at times it is a bit tacky, it's fun, light and necessary in preparation for the darkness that is coming.

    After the battle the heroes return to Coruscant, to find more problems. The Jedi have become increasingly suspicious of Palpatine, who is still in office and slowly increasing his power. Anakin and Padme's marriage is still a secret and their love has become tested by war and politics. It isn't helped by Anakin's dreams of Padme dying while giving birth. Anakin is also strained the Jedi Council is having him spy on Palpatine, and in turn Palpatine having him spy on the Jedi. His relationship with the Chancellor becomes closer and slowly Palpatine introduces Anakin to the dark side, telling Anakin that it will help him save Padme from death. And here the tragedy begins to unfold, as the second half of this film contains more emotion and powerhouse action than any Star Wars film to date.

    All plot aside, Anakin's turning is very convicing and well done. Lucas makes us care about the character by having him portrayed differently than in Attack of the Clones. This time Anakin is mature and patient, and respectful of his old master, Obi-wan. They appear to be good friends. Anakin is still just as unsure of himself though, which makes it easier for Palpatine to manipulate him. Hayden has improved on his acting, I felt that his lines were delivered almost perfectly. Ian McDiarmid also shines as the villainous Palpatine, his voice is riddled with evil and his eyes glow with the dark side. It was a spectacular performance. Ewan Macgregor was great, at times he resembled Alec Guiness and did well at copying his mannerisms. The character has become one of my favorites, and he couldn't have been casted more perfectly for the prequels.

    All the characters manage to stir up some emotion here and I felt all of it, especially Mace Windu's last stand. The duel between Anakin and Obi-wan was spectacular and also heart breaking. The relationship between Anakin and Padme was still somewhat clunky (love dialogue) but for the most part it was much better than Attack of the Clones.

    The visuals are stunning, of course. Yoda looks realistic and I felt his lightsaber skirmish with Sidious was extremely well done. The planets are very impressive, Coruscant looks better than ever, Kashyyk is vibrant and Mustafar burns with hellfire. Everything looks fantastic. I know I'm gushing here, but the movie really was THAT GOOD. The only problem lies with General Grievous, who looks and sounds amazing but is cheesy and his stupid cought ruins any chance at seriousness. His parts, while they look great and are fun, are a bit too campy. But it works, he does what he has to do and isn't forced down our throats like Jar-jar of Episode I. It doesn't ruin the film or make it less impressive, and it is quickly forgotten as the horror and the massacre soon follow.

    This is definitely the biggest and darkest Star Wars film. I don't think it could've ended better. By the end, everything is explained and put in its place. You almost have to put in A New Hope w
  12. DamonD Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2002
    star 6
    Well, I thought it was absolutely fantastic. I think it's a strong contender for best of the Saga. I love saying that around the ESB fanatics, you can see the whites of their eyes flashing :p

    **********

    Random thoughts -

    * I thought Anakin's decent was done very well. Some felt it was a bit too quick, but the set-up was in AOTC after all...and I still don't feel he was 100% committed to the Emperor after Mace was killed. He seemed to realise he was now utterly unable to stay with the Jedi, and just wanted to use Palpatine to get the power to save Padme. He even admits he plans to bump him off, later in the movie.

    * The new battle droid voices took a bit of getting used to, but they were funny and I liked them in the end. I still get a laugh out of that doofus-voiced Neimoidian captain, though. He deserves a tribute thread of his own. What's he called?

    * I liked Grievous a lot. His role was basically to supply a reason for Obi-Wan and Anakin to get split up, but he looked great and I loved the voice. He's very quotable I think, especially when you put on the accent..."Kenobi, Ah-taaahk!" He ran away like a moustache-twirling villain a fair bit, but when he had to stand and fight with Kenobi he looked good. The difference between him and Obi-Wan though, and why he lost the fight, was The Force...yes, it's Uncle George's old favourite - The Triumph Of Human Spirit Over Technology.

    * Dooku's cameo was short but sweet. Did exactly what I was expecting, die horribly at Anakin's hand, and he had a great reaction to Palpatine asking for his death. And I love the line "Your swords please, we don't want to make a mess in front of the Chancellor." Sums up a huge amount of Dooku's personality in one line.

    * Yoda and R2 had several 'hero' moments, and the biggest laughs. Yoda looked incredibly life-like, both came off well, and R2 knows the whole story!

    * Hayden and Natalie really stepped up the romance here. They seemed more comfortable around each other, which isn't too surprising as this was their second go-around. The way he cradles her head in their first scene in particular stayed with me. Even though her role was less pro-active than before, I think Natalie really got her teeth into the role and was convincingly upset and heart-broken.

    * Ewan has perfected the art of being Obi-Wan. He's so good at it that you sometimes forget to give him credit. The dry wit, the gentle nature, the warrior...it's all there.

    * Hayden just burned up the screen for me. Not even so much in what he said, although he had some great lines, but his expressions and his eyes. Real inner turmoil. I'd been struck by that in AOTC, for example in the scene with Queen Jamilla where he flashes Padme a very cold look. But he really turned up the intensity here. From being a likeable hero at the start to verging on the demonic at the end, he really nailed it.

    * Speaking of demonic...Ian McDiarmid. C'mon, need I say more?

    **********

    Now for the scenes that really left an impression on me :

    - Awesome opening sequence. War drums, over the ship, then dooooowwwwnnn into the battle. Like a roller-coaster, and a huge amount of detail that I think we'll only be able to fully appreciate when the DVD comes out.

    - A night at the Opera. McDiarmid was mesmerizing, spinning tales for Anakin. Surprised and happy at Lucas for doing a longer pure dialogue scene than you'd expect for him.

    - That electric sequence with Anakin and Padme seemingly starting across at each other across Coruscant. Loved the strange wailing music, the intensity, and that tear from Anakin at the end...one of the best scenes Lucas had ever directed in his life, as Anakin makes his choice to do whatever it takes to save Padme.

    - Mace's death. Very shocking (ho ho, punnage :p) I really think he had Palpatine there, but the debate over that one is really raging. Lucas really went all-out with this one to show Palpatine's power, Mace got utterly fried and it was horrible in an awesome way.

    - Palpatine puts the hood on and...bingo. Instant ROTJ Emperor, ev
  13. kingthlayer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 7, 2003
    star 4
    Anakin's transformation was awesome. I came up with a hundred ways for him to get burned, and they were all wrong. And I was even happier for it. :)
  14. leelee Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2003
    star 3
    So what was that "small detail" y'all were talking about? Padme's death/Leia's memories or Vader's NOOOOOOOO?
  15. TurnedJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 2
    The detail I was talking about was Leia's memories. Sad that it was dealt with in such a way as it was in the film, IMO.
  16. DamonD Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2002
    star 6
    I thought the detail was Qui-Gon not appearing, in voice or spirit.
  17. TurnedJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 2
    Well, the Qui-Gon thing was a bit of a let down after Lucas has more or less promised to explain why some Jedi vanish and other do not, but Leia's memory has always been a big deal to me personally. So that was a major grievance for me.
  18. CoolHanLuke Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 19, 2004
    star 2
    I did like Ewan McGregor's portrayal of Obi-wan in this episode. His mannerisms, the way he said his lines, his body language, all of it---I loved it! =D= Nice Episode IV tie-in with "So uncivilized."

    This film reminded me of the time when someone asked me what I thought about The Passion of the Christ---did I like it? No, I did not "like" that film in the sense of "Hey, let's go see a movie tonight!" That was a film I just wouldn't "go see" in order to be "entertained."

    It was heart-wrenching to see the consequences of Anakin's actions on the rest of the Jedi and the people who loved him. To see the love that Obi-wan had for Anakin just crushed me. "YOU WERE MY BROTHER, ANAKIN...I LOVED YOU." :_| The human drama came through for me in this episode...that, I did enjoy.

    Even though there were many bright moments in the film, Lucas was right...it doesn't end on a happy note. I'm just glad that there is a "happy ending" for this saga.

    Overall, I think George Lucas and Company did a great job tying the trilogies together! =D=
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