Lit How can Imperials be fascists...

The important thing to remember about STAR WARS is that it should be an infinite variety of worlds and very little cohesion between them. It keeps the universe interesting.

That is, sadly, pretty antithetical to certain left wing models.

Simply due to size.

If one world is using stone knives and bear skins, it's hard to raise them to a Galactic Standard.

 

I think it's not so hard to read the Empire as "progressive." Imperial officers' attitude towards to the Jedi and remnants like Vader, plus the fact that they're such a technological juggernaut, give off that kind of vibe of a rationalist/materialist regime doing away with old superstitions and building a shining and scientific new society - think French Revolution, Communism, Nasserism, etc. And, of course, there's their attitude to the corruption and decadence in the Old Republic and the fact that they were born from the Clone Wars - they're the people who restored government authority over those crazy out-of-control capitalists and their treasonous insurrection.

Although I agree with you that this is only one aspect and that the Empire borrows from lots of different things.

 

I don't disagree, but Fascism, especially of the classical Italian variety but also Nazism to some extent also had that sort of attitude. The Italian Futurists and Modernists especially were big cultural foundations for the rise and early support of Mussolini, for example. Or Oswald Mosley in Britain being a fan of H.G. Wells. It's really only the sort of nostalgic fascism of the neo Nazis (and also the Francoists) that give their movements' culture the sort of more mystical, pseudo-Romantic primacy.

 

CIVILIZE THE SAVAGES.

 

The French Empire analogy fits rather well, considering especially in Legends I'd consider Palpatine to be more of a Literally Napoleon (who still wasn't portrayed well by his contemporary enemies, he was literally called a 'demon' in some propaganda). The honor of being Literally Hitler goes to either Darth Krayt or to Valkorion.

 

Mind you, Canon Palpatine is known to have wiped out two planets in the movies.

The Geonosians
The Alderaanians (and also ordered the survivors exterminated)

So, he's not the guy we can just call a bloodthirsty warmonger (which Napoleon was and guilty of many horrible crimes including re-legalizing slavery).

 

Palpatine is an historical amalgamation in terms of inspiration-with traces of Napoleon, Julius Caesar, among others.

The First Order does have fascistic overtones-but it's not historical fascism it's watered down fascism. Sort of like Neo Nazi rallies today-the Nazis and fascists of the 1940s would see their 21st century heirs with utter contempt and disdain or at best shock troops because of their fanaticism.

The galactic alliance in legends reminds me a lot of the late Roman republic come to think of it-coups, people installed, civil wars, strife and triumvirates to maintain stability.

I am trying to think of a RL analogy for the Felpire-it's sort of a combination of the Byzantine empire, Tsarist Russia, and the Soviet union(Imperial mission). Though that's an admittedly rough analogy.

 

Felpire is Byzantium, GA is the HRE. Best analogy I can think of. I agree with the GA resembling the Roman Republic too though, we see that in the Old Republic too which I believe is intended so.

 

How does the GA resemble the HRE?

 

The GA, at least as it was originally kind of described at the end of NJO and in the NEC, was kind of an amalgamation of the former New Republic that was essentially directly under the control of Coruscant, but also included the Hapans and Imperial Remnant that were essentially fully autonomous but vaguely affiliated with the GA, and some type of intermediary where systems also had more local control.

It's confusing because that's how it gets set up by Omas at the end of Destiny's Way, but for the rest of the NJO it's not really clear how much of what we see actually works like that versus is just the wartime alliance. Then the NEC comes out and expounds on the supposedly more decentralized nature of the GA. And by the time of LOTF, it's essentially just the New Republic, with no seeming inclusion of the Imperials or Hapans and is stated to be more, not less, centralized than the Republic.

 

I always thought the imperials and Hapans in the NJO era just became more diplomatically inter linked with the GA. Pellaeon's whole defense position if I understood it was more honorary than anything.

And the Hapans still had their indepedence, vicious court intrigues, and own policies into the LOTF era.

 

Because the GA and its predecessor was formed out of beating back Warlords and foreign invaders, leading to their eventual 'crowning' as galactic government, gaining the title, gaining the capital, even if they legally had no connection to the old regime (Old Republic/Empire and Roman Republic/Empire for the comparison). You could potentially paint the GA vs Confederation War as one of the various dynastic wars in the HRE.

 

If you believe the Rebel Alliance is a continuing remnant of the old republic-after all at least three senators were instrumental in its founding then there is continuity of government. The Empire and NR/GA are then hence both descedant governments of the old republic.

Though I am sketchy at the notion the Rebel Alliance was a some sort of continuation of the old republic one could make the argument for it but the rebel alliance wasn't founded until 17 years( 2 BBY) I believe after the old republic was dissolved and hence on that measure continuity seems somewhat weak.

This is counteracted by the fact a few Jedi and three senators were involved in its founding(TFU). Thus giving it some continuity from a sort of legal perspective.

 

Guelphs and Ghibellines, with the Chief of State as the Pope.

 

Well historically once the Germanic tribes came in they largely replaced the Roman aristocracy or the Roman aristocracy accommodated them and in places like Italy Roman administration continued under Odoacer for some time.

In Britain Roman authority collapsed entirely, in Gaul it was a mix of Germanic warlords, Roman general's and so on with massive shifts in the identity of the ruling class, in Spain the visgoths largely replaced the Roman aristocracy and continuity seemed to be broken, while the papacy remained as well as of course Byzantium.

So continuity sort of happened and didn't happen-it was a complex and long process with variations within and between regions of the former WRE.

Though I suppose your right-three senators and some surviving Jedi do not make a continuity of government.

My point was you could stretch the logic enough and maybe make that argument.

 

The problem with the argument about the First Order being wannabes is they successfully conquered the galaxy via military force.

Sort of like the odd thing about Kylo Ren is he one-upped Darth Vader.

 

I've only seen the TLJ film, but I don't recall the First Order ever being said to have taken over the galaxy. We certainly didn't see it.

 

Given the complete lack of any New Republic forces answering the call....I think that's holding out for Mace Windu's survival.

 

We'll really have to see in IX. The optimist in me says if the NR was actually all gone we'd have seen it on-screen. But maybe the ST really doesn't care at all.

 

JJ Abrams has been stated on record as having said he does not care about worldbuilding, and the ST has been very prudent in avoiding that could look like political references-"so as to not be like the prequels"

I suspect the NR is gone as was said in the opening crawl.

 

TIL the NR was one system.
EDIT: And to be honest, I'm about certain we won't see them; Lucasfilm will wave their magic wand to explain it all away. But still, from an in-universe perspective it's ridiculous and I hate it.