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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST How dark will the tone of the ST be?

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by Ghost, Nov 11, 2013.

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  1. Lee_

    Lee_ Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    What are the chances that they won't toy with it? The Chance brothers, Slim and None (and I think Slim will be out of town for this one...).

    I still wouldn't think they will make it more dark than ESB or ROTS, but I don't think it will be any more light-weight than those.


    OK, but- a movie is not either "dark" or "not dark," it is all a matter of degrees. Certainly, scenes in ROTS and ESB were dark, there is no other way to describe them. Movies like Alien were MORE dark because they didn't add/emphasize the lighter stuff to move the balance in the other direction, and were more graphic in the way they displayed the darkness of the story; you could certainly re-make ROTS into a similarly dark movie using almost the exact same story.

    I disagree that this is some sort of modern trend to look at the darker tones in movies. That has always been a part of drama, and a relatively high percentage of the greatest works, from Shakespeare to The Godfather (not exactly "skipping through the meadow on a sunny day" material) , have this in common. This is true in music also.

    No one (at least no one who is half-way rational) thinks this will be for adults only, or will be in the range of Alien. I think the reason it is brought up here so much is because of the range in different SW movies, and people having their own wish for where it will land on the spectrum.
     
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  2. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 10, 2004
    I remember before ROTS came out being very disturbed by how many people were literally hoping it would be rated R. I saw it a lot on the starwars.com message boards (which is where I spent most of my time in the prequel era... I was a bit intimidated by TFN in those days for some reason).
     
  3. -Jedi Joe-

    -Jedi Joe- Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    May 6, 2013
    Oh yes, I remember those rumors. That and "Will Episode III be 3 hours long?" were some hot nerd topics. (Although I wouldn't have minded one bit if RotS was 3 hours.)
     
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  4. Lee_

    Lee_ Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 3, 2012
    It SHOULD have been 3 hours; it would have done the story more justice I think (not that it isn't one of my favorite movies of all time as it is), there really was 3 hours worth of material (especially if you've read the novel).

    I think that was poorly thought out speculation as far as the movie being rated R. If they had gotten more graphic with the invasion of the Jedi temple, it could EASILY have been rated R, but I am sure Lucas would never make one rated R, this is still SW. I think it would be cool to make an R rated SW as one of the offshoots of the trilogies, like the whole Underworld thing, which was supposed to be for adults (and allegedly was far more dark than anything SW has ever been).
     
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  5. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

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    Mar 10, 2004
    I never liked the idea of a 3 hour Star Wars movie. They have a pace that dictates a certain length and I think Lucas already pushed that about as far as it can go on the last two. I know there was a lot of story crammed into ROTS, and I would have loved for some of the deleted scenes to make it in, but I feel that if it had been any longer it would have collapsed under its own weight. Star Wars movies just aren't designed for that. They're really pretty exhausting as is.
     
  6. Count Yubnub

    Count Yubnub Force Ghost star 5

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    Oct 1, 2012
    In this post-modernist day and age of audience participation, audience members may regulate the darkness of the movie themselves! Those who want their movies darker are encouraged to wear trendy sunglasses to the theater. Those who want a completely dark experience may wear special 0D glasses with completely opaque lenses. :cool:
     
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  7. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

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    Mar 10, 2004
    Or they could just see it in 3D. Zing!
     
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  8. appleseed

    appleseed Chosen One star 5

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    Dec 5, 2002
    I doubt it will be very dark at all. It's not gonna be darker than ROTS. I don't know if any of the films can be darker than ROTS was.
     
  9. Lee_

    Lee_ Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 3, 2012
    I see what you are saying, but I think ROTS would be an exception to that rule, and could have made a great LOTR-length movie. There is SO much great material that is only alluded to that could have been developed- the history of Count Dooku, the ferocious Grievous and all of the Jedi he has slaughtered, the deleted scenes (love Yoda's landing on Dagobah) and (obviously first and foremost) much more elucidation on Anakin's turn to Vader.

    That is the darkest of the SW movies for a very good reason. Some people on this site talk about how they didn't like Anakin in that movie; but that is the whole idea, right? He is not supposed to be likable, he is Darth ****in' Vader, he becomes a self-loathing, evil, horrible dude that reaps misery on the galaxy. ROTS is the story of how he comes about, and it is not supposed to be your grandma's SW movie.
    MODified: Gotta star out the entire word.
     
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  10. Lord TW

    Lord TW Jedi Master star 2

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    Dec 25, 2012
    Films classified as "dark" tend to be more intimate, character pieces (story impacts a distinct set of characters, small cast, tight close-ups, sparse scoring, etc.).

    Despite the fact the SW films feature characters ;) , they fit more appropriately into the "epic" category (stories with large-scale consequences, sweeping vistas, ambitious orchestral scores, huge set pieces, hundreds or thousands of extras, etc.).

    Very few movies cross both categories. At this moment, in my mind, the best example is "Saving Private Ryan."
     
  11. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

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    Mar 10, 2004
    I'm happy for backstory on Dooku and Grievous to remain in the EU. Episode III didn't need to be cluttered up with that stuff. I would have loved to have kept Yoda's landing on Dagobah in the film, but although the ending is long enough as it is, that scene wasn't really cut for time. Once Lucas explained his reasons for cutting it (wanting the ending sequence to go from Padme to Anakin to Leia to Luke), I was forced to agree on a thematic basis.
     
  12. Lee_

    Lee_ Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 3, 2012
    I guess the ROTS novel is considered EU (I don't know if you mean that or another novel), but their back stories/description in that book certainly were anything but clutter; they added to the Episode 3 story's cogency a great deal (you hardly even know who they are in the movie). I wasn't talking about some great in-depth thing like a whole story, just enough to better understand the characters and what they mean to Episode 3. In any case, I was saying that most of the value from a longer movie would come from more detailed explanation and buildup for Anakin's turn.

    No, that scene wasn't cut for time, but I still think it was a mistake (as did the producer, Rick McCallum). It was a gorgeous scene that was only about 30-60 seconds long (unlike the other cut scenes that were just way too long). The actual ending is very short from the time where they cut to Padme's funeral, it is only a few minutes long.
     
  13. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

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    Mar 10, 2004
    It's still longer than the ending of any other movie, after the longest period of post-action time in any of the movies.

    I don't remember exactly what the ROTS novelization said, although I'm rereading the PT novelizations at the moment so I'll get there soon enough. I just don't think that stuff is essential to the story as told in the movies, and I don't think being longer would help ROTS, besides the fact that it would have lost a lot of money by being that long and the general public would have been very turned off by it. We may just have to agree to disagree though. This is all pretty off-topic anyway.
     
  14. Darth_Articulate

    Darth_Articulate Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Nov 1, 2012
    It might be actually short but it felt almost like the ending of Return of the King. I agree the dagobah scene is beautiful, but it just wasn't necessary. I also think it's exclusion adds mystery to what happened to Yoda during ANH which pays off in ESB. However, I was rather hoping that the final meeting between Bail, Obi Wan and Yoda would take place on dagobah just to add resonance to Luke's line, "still...there's something familiar about this place" ;)
     
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  15. Lee_

    Lee_ Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 3, 2012
    I take it you are well under 40? It would only add mystery if you aren't old enough to have watched them in the order they came out.....

    The extended ending was to set up the OT (or help us better understand the OT), which I thought it did well. I just thought that added a nice touch with Yoda.
     
  16. Darth_Articulate

    Darth_Articulate Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Nov 1, 2012
    I wouldn't say "well" under 40. (just turned 36). The number times I saw the OT before the PT was even officially announced was probably in the hundreds. I'm just not a fan of watching the movies in release order, hence, I prefer the PT to be structured to maximize the 1-6 experience. Not for me, of course, but for future generations. I thought the scenes that were left in were necessary, just not the dagobah scene.
     
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  17. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 25, 2003
    I agree it's all about balance. and I suppose that's why I felt that Star Wars could even have its own darkness rating like I mentioned: it being called "Star Wars dark," because you're right-movies like alien for example don't have anything to counterbalance the darkness whereas Star Wars has a mixture of a lot of different things-which is unique, instead of making everything grim and dark, creates an exciting adventure with something for everyone!

    of course I don't know, but I'm pretty confident that this formula is what they'll stick to for the ST...
     
  18. Darth Morgoth

    Darth Morgoth Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Feb 1, 2014
    First, I would like to say hi all, this is my first post. I am a huge Star Wars fan, though I follow many other fandoms such as Doctor Who, and above all Middle Earth.

    So, I was think about the new Star Wars movies, and the question of tone came into my head. How should they handle the tone of the trilogy? Dark or light? Or perhaps somewhere in between? I personally hope these films are very dark, much more so than the other movies. Some would argue that if it were too dark, it would not "feel" like a Star Wars movie. I disagree, and think that if done correctly, a dark Star Wars film could be quite awesome. Episode 3 was darker than the other films' but they went about it the wrong way IMO, and filled it with bad writing. I think that JJ may be able to pull it off though. What are your thoughts on the tone of the trilogy?
     
  19. TheBBP

    TheBBP Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 6, 2012
    Welcome aboard. I would imagine that the tone will run the gamut as we go across the trilogy.
     
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  20. Odolwa

    Odolwa Jedi Knight star 3

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    Nov 12, 2013
    I hope there is some darkness to it, But to me the PT got away from the adventure aspect that the OT had, so i wouldn't want it being a pure dark emotional movie. As long as they dont fill the movies with horrible love scenes and bad acting im good.
    Welcome to the forum too, nice name too.
     
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  21. InterestingLurker

    InterestingLurker Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 15, 2011
    I want the tone to be adventurous yet at the same time dark and mysterious, like the Mortis trilogy in Star Wars: The Clone Wars. In addition, I want there to be some "trippyness" to the movies, like the cave scene in the The Empire Strikes Back
     
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  22. Seagoat

    Seagoat Former Manager star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2013
    I'd like a good balance between the tones of the first two trilogies

    The galaxy is just recovering from the tyranny of the Empire and rebuilding things, but obviously there's going to be some rising threat that yet again threatens peace in the GFFA
     
  23. ScorpionJedi

    ScorpionJedi Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 19, 2013
    This.

    I want it to be a fine balance of these:







     
  24. Six

    Six Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 9, 2014
    I think its going to be a mix of dark and gritty, and fun and exciting, like the originals. I don't think we'll have to worry about getting an overly campy, kid friendly trilogy like the sequels, I'm sure they've learned.
     
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  25. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk JCC Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2013
    I think there should be someone in E7 called Tone. Like as a mechanic or something. Luke could be all like "morning Tone, my speeder's not starting. If you get a chance, can you have a look"?

    PS tone should be dark;)
     
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