How has the Saga Forum at TF.N changed your thoughts on the Star Wars saga?

Welcome to the "meta-discourse"! How has this forum at TF.N effected your appraisal of the saga (has it?)?

For me it actually has. It has made me identify some of my own biases and reinforece other opinions that I have had about Star Wars for the past 30 years!

For starters, as a veteran of the old "PT Bashers' Sanctuary", I was definitely a die-hard O-OT fan. The discussion here has made me realize a number of important points:

1) I always saw the original Star Wars specificly and the O-OT generally through the eyes of a young child, as I first saw Star Wars (before it was "ANH") in 1977 as a six year old child, ESB as a ten year old in 1980 and RotJ as a 13 year old in 1983. Perhaps this is part of the reason I still love Star Wars the best. This leads to point #

2) The PT, of which I am not a huge fan (excepting RotS) was a let down for me, because I was in my late 20s to mid 30s when it came out. I judge these films as a critical adult, not as an innocent child. The gushers often have a case when they argue that the PT is no worse in many ways than the OT when it comes to acting, direction, and dialog (though I would maintain that, despite bias, Portman and Christiansen turn in much poorer performances than Hamill, Fisher and Ford).

3) You take out of these films what you put into them, Lucas's unknowable intentions not withstanding. We can read in as much meaning/mythology into the films as we want too. I think by and large we fans do read too much into them, but if they can sustain this, that is indeed why they are good films! They hold up to scrutiny and interpretation in ways that few works of fiction do.

So, basically, this forum has not changed my likes and dislikes about the saga at all, but it has made me see my own prejudices and that the whole basher/gusher debate really has a lot to do with things outside of the films, like how memory of childhood and engagement in fantasy and willingness to ssuspend disbelief effects one's view of fantastic fiction. I envy those who were able to experience the PT through the eyes of a child, like I was able to for the originals. It is no wonder I like RotJ the least of the originals; it may be the worst of the OT, or even the saga, but my reasons for disliking it might well be that I saw it at age 13, when most boys hate everything, particularly everything that reminds them of the childhood they are leaving behind... let's face it, puberty stinks! After building up the greatness of Star Wars and Empire for close to 30 years, TPM had no chance for me; it was afterall, a kid's film, just like the originals, only I was no longer a kid (though this does not excuse Jar Jar--I insist on some objective standards)!

Anyway, this forum has helped me realize this, that my appraisal of the saga is skewed by my age and changing tastes in film, as opposed to some major sea-change in Lucas as filmmaker, etc.

Has this forum effected others similarly?

 

Without going into too much detail(I hate typing..unlike some of you ), This forum has answered some questions i have had on the ot & pt films..i trust my own perspective but i like to hear others as well..i have actually changed my oponions(sp) on some points that other posters have made..or i didnt just plain know something or catch something in the films that other posters have and thats great..i mean as much as iv'e watched these films its good to know it wont get boring because im still discovering things about them..

so thanks!

 

It has made me believe that Star Wars fans can discuss the movies without the "gusher basher" lines in the sand.

Finally it feels like a discussion between a diversity of opinions more than two gangs of people aligning themselves against each other.

 

Long story short, before I came to this forum, there were two SW films I couldn't abide: II and VI. Though no force on Heaven or Earth could convince me ROTJ was anything but a disaster, the appraisals of a dozen posters--who will remain anonymous, keeping with good form--have allowed me to approach, and appreciate, AOTC from a detached position, taking it in as I would a Herzog film (and no, I wouldn't dream of elevating Attack of the Clones to Aguirre and Nosferatu status).

Chilly and ersatz, but not without its merits.

 

Just so there's no misunderstanding, I was referring to the film, not the forum.

 

I hate to say it, but I came in here last year a genuine fan of all 6 movies (to varying degrees), with six years of Prequel-defending in real life to show for it.
But here... because I hate the 2006 dvds, and I don't think the movies are equally good, or that there was any kind of master plan, I've been painted a few times with this broad "anti-Lucas infidel" brush, and it's totally creepy. I'm now really turned off to the "saga". The hard sell just pushed me the other way.

 

I guess I should mention first that I only like 3 Star Wars movies: Phantom Menace (yes..I really do), A new Hope and Empire ofcourse. I like optimistic movies mainly, but empire was done so well that I loved despite the fact that it was so dark. And as for the question, yes this board has changed my views. Other peoples in depth analysis as to what makes the saga great and what are the underlying themes and motifs, have made me appriciate it more. I may not like all the films but I do like the story a lot. And reading other peoples ideas on Star Wars is allways fun. Well at least to me it is. I don't personally want to watch AOTC or ROTS again, but it's great to hear what other people think about those films. Every once in a while something takes you by surprise. Someone sees something you overlooked and points it out. Good stuff.

I allso notice that as I get older, some things just don't thrill me like they are supposed (or used) to. I hated Spiderman 3 and thought Superman returns wasn't as good as I hoped. But that's how it goes. We all change.

 

I still like all of the films, but I've grown to like the character of Anakin Skywalker less and less over time. It may not solely be because of the forum, but I think the pushing of him as the most powerful Force user ever, greatest Jedi ever, and greatest Sith ever when in my mind while powerful, he's done nothing to show himself to be better than Yoda, Mace, or Palpatine, a failure as a Jedi until RotJ, and a great Sith as Vader other than his redemption.

It's also shown me views of the films that I would have never thought of as possible interpretations. I disagree with many of those views as my posts attest, but I still find it interesting just how much the message that people get out of the films can vary.

Edit: I need to clarify my view of Anakin. I think as a character he's great, but I don't view his time as Vader as good or necessary. I also consider him to be at fault for his fall rather than the Jedi Order.

 

It hasn't. And I don't mean that as a negative.

I've been into STAR WARS since before the first time I saw the movie STAR WARS in 1977.

I came into this forum already enjoying each STAR WARS episode and each STAR WARS trilogy and the STAR WARS SAGA fully and equally.

And I came into this forum already with total appreciation and total respect for the heart, imagination, effort, talent and skill of George Lucas and everyone else involved in the creation of the STAR WARS SAGA.

I've enjoyed reading enthusiastic/positive comments from other STAR WARS fans and I've enjoyed seeing other STAR WARS fans get the STAR WARS SAGA and figure out the STAR WARS SAGA together. And I appreciate and respect the STAR WARS fans that other STAR WARS fans are.

And I've never been influenced by/impressed with negative attitudes towards and negative comments concerning the STAR WARS SAGA/George Lucas/everyone else involved in the creation of the STAR WARS SAGA. I know better.

There's nothing like STAR WARS. Any of it. All of it. And only George Lucas and company could have pulled it off. And no other group of fans are as enthusiastic and as much fun to be around as STAR WARS fans.

 

It hasn't made any differance to me. I love all six movies and see them as one Saga, and I've not reada nything here thats changed or re-inforced that opinion.

That said, although I don't post much, I ALWAYS read the threads in Saga, so it certainly keeps my interest.

 

It hasn't changed my thoughts all that much. There are certain posters that I can have intelligent discussions with where different perspectives can be looked at by both sides, but those type of posters are few and far between these days. Overall it's become increasingly frustrating to hjave to deal with people that can't look at the movies objectively. You have the gushers that refuse to see the flaws that are present in the movies, then you have the bashers that refuse to see the good that is present in all the movies, and then you have the Lucasphiles that treat his word like it's the gospel and can't have an intelligent discourse without dropping Lucas quotes a mile a minute. Intelligent discussion is a dying breed here, and it's been replaced with copious amounts of posts from the above three groups.

 

I think this has a lot to do with brainwashing due to the ROTS novel. The films never said that Anakin was the most powerful Force user ever or the greatest Jedi ever... just that he aspired to be. Which is a big difference.

 

It hasn't really. My perspective of the films has remained the same because I know how I percieve the saga, and it sometimes differs from the way others do.

(No offense intended to this forum or anyone here)

 

The olden days leading up to AOTC and ROTS on this site were so memorable.
When I was banned during the heated "Did Yoda Own Dooku" debate during AOTC ... it was then that I realized this place totally impacted me ....
The spoilers going on then tainted my viewings of II and III considerably.

Friends like Hudnull and Green DestinySword made me search deep and rationalize why the PT sucked - when we would battle gushers and we would have to come to each other's defense.

The controversies made me a better person, a better fan, etc.

The battles and name calling seem so long ago .... but it was a special time and one I will always miss ... everything seemed different ... it was awesome and it changed me.

 

That could definitely be.

 

When I first got here back in 99, I was one of the people who didn't like Ewoks.

I found people who loved them and they convinced me of their reasons and now I love them too.

I think that made me better able to set aside my own ego for the prequels, which in turn allowed me to not have a problem with Jar-Jar or Jake Lloyd or all the other child-like aspects of TPM.

I felt bad for all the people who got hung up on those things, and I did everything I could to show them why these things were the way they were, but some people just couldn't see things with the same eyes they saw the classic trilogy with.

A lot of people became "film students" and "would be film makers" and saw everything through the lens of "craft" rather than allowing themselves to get lost in the story.

Some people were so hung up on the mechanics of making a movie, many even insisted there was no story to be lost in to begin with.

I would argue with these people tooth and nail to no avail and while it sort of made me a bit sad to see people with so much hatred in their hearts for something they supposedly loved, it also made me feel lucky that I was able to enjoy it all without all those hangups.

Now that Revenge of the Sith has been in the can, I have stepped away a bit from these boards and now that I'm sort of back again I see that while there are still the fires of hatred burning, there are plenty more people who see the genius of what Lucas has done.

It warms my heart.

 

Well, that was a lie, wasn't it? In fact it's not just confined to SW. This was one of the great shameless lies of the 20th century: "It had no plot."

 

There were certain people in the media who were gunning for the prequels right out of the gate. Like those scathing reviews that were published before the movie was released (which was in violation of the non disclosure agreement they signed that forbid them from publishing the review before the movie was released). That's where the idea of "The Phantom Plot" came from, and a lot of people just nodded their head and agreed with it.

What really gets me are the people who love the classic trilogy saying the story of the prequels wasn't as good as the classic trilogy, when it's all part of the same story.

Like suddenly the story of Star Wars sucks because it has CG in it or something.

 

I feel the same way. It's all the same story.

 

So back to discussing the Saga forum, guys... *Points to thread topic*

Of all the posts, Go-Mer's first one was my favorite.

Poppy, I found your opening post very interesting. I would ask, why the Saga forum, or rather, what about it has had that impact?

 

I have to say, I never did reach my full vision for that post. I had to release it before my 30 minutes were up.

Posts are never finished.

 

But now you can make a new post, just don't delete the first post for the people who prefer it