PT How much did Count Dooku know?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by JevanShevu, Jan 4, 2013.

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  1. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    Every time i watch the PT i always wonder how much Count Dooku knew about his master true plan. I mean when you listen to Dooku talking to Obi Wan on Geonosis he lets it slip that the Republic was under the control of a Sith Lord. And we know that Dooku left the Jedi Order for disagreeing with the Jedi and the Republic. Could it possible that when Dooku joined Sidious he joined with his own plan of truly fixing the galaxy? Just something I have been thinking about.
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  2. TheRevanchist Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 13, 2012
    star 2
    I think yes. Dooku wasn't entirely evil, he was more a idealist but he could do anything (even very bad things) to achieve it. I don't think that Dooku was ever as evil as Sidious or Vader.

    Also, it is not in the movie, but The Darth Plagueis novel confirms it, that Dooku left the order and was searching for the Sith Lord because he thought that the only way to fix the Republic was to start it from beginning.
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  3. The other Cleopatra's Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2013
    Did he know that he will take over the Republic?
  4. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

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    Aug 20, 2009
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    I forgot about that in "Plagueis". It sort of makes me sad for Dooku. We all knew he was just a pawn in Sidious' plan, but the more i think about it the more tragic Dooku is.
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  5. BigAl6ft6 Chosen One

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    Nov 12, 2012
    star 5
    Well, I'm pretty darn sure at the very least Dooku sure as heck didn't know his master was going to command that punk Skywalker kid to chop his head off!
  6. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

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    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    Agreed. xD
  7. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

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    Oct 1, 2012
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    I've been wondering about that as well. Even TCW and the EU materials that I've read keep it ambiguous as to whether Dooku actually knows that Sidious and Palpatine are the same person.
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  8. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    The scene in the ROTS novelization in which Sidious orders Anakin to kill Dooku addresses this--it indicates that Dooku definitely knew, and at that moment he realized that he was never more than a placeholder for Anakin Skywalker, that he was never the apprentice Sidious wanted. IIRC Dooku wanted to recruit Anakin and have the three of them work together. I guess no one educated him on the Rule of Two until that moment.

    Dooku is definitely a tragic figure.
  9. SlashMan Jedi Grand Master

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    Feb 5, 2012
    star 3
    I think when Dooku initially left the Jedi, his plans were well-intended. But Sidious seemed to have twisted his ideals and he slowly accepted the evil ways of the Sith. Dooku and his master were both on different wavelengths.
    Last edited by SlashMan, Jan 4, 2013
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  10. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

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    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    Its a shame Anakin killed him. I think having Dooku around during the Dark Times would make things very interesting...
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  11. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

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    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    I think an AU plot bunny just bit me.
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  12. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

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    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    I think if Dooku would have survived. He might have redeemed himself and could partake in the founding of the Rebel Alliance. I think that would have been a cool thing to see. Much cooler than just his head rolling around the Invisible Hand.
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  13. BigAl6ft6 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2012
    star 5
    Future SE change! After they crash the Invisible Hand, pan the camera down a bit on Obi-Wan's line of "Another happy landing" and Dooku's head goes crashing through the windshield!
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  14. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

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    Aug 20, 2009
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    xD and then ends up landing in someones bowl of frozen yogurt.
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  15. Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master

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    Sep 4, 2012
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    Dooku had potential but much of that potential was wasted in my view.

    Dooku knew the thruth about the clone war and the clone army and how it all was just a fabricated war in order for Palpatine to take over the republic. So that makes him evil and a willing party to Palpatines plan.

    Dooku's talk to Obi-Wan in AotC doesn't seem like he really wants to recruit Obi-Wan, instead it feels that Dooku is just pulling Obi-Wans legs for a bit of fun. Dooku would know that Obi-Wan knows of his plans and what he has been doing recently. Dooku intends to attack the republic, this is treason and Obi-Wan throws that in Dookus face. So Dooku knows that Obi-Wan has no reason to trust anything he says. So instead he just messes with Obi-Wans head by telling some thruths and some lies. Did he really expect Obi-Wan to side with him just like that? I doubt it.

    About Anakin, Dooku would know about the rule of two so why he goes along with Palpatines plan to fight Anakin is gross stupidity on his part.
    Winning gains him nothing and loosing could mean his death even ignoring the rule of two as he would know that Anakin would be looking for revenge for what happened in AotC.
    If Dooku had plans for himself then an ideal chance presents itself juts before the start of RotS. Instead of taking Palpatine, simply kill him. Have a bomb on the shuttle or shoot it down when it gets close. Dooku is now no 1 Sith and the republic is now without a leader. Then he could simply level Coruscant, destroy the senate and the Jedi temple, this would destroy even more of the leadership of the republic. To make things even better, he could fake Palpatine sending out order 66 which will put the clones and the jedi against each other.

    What could have made Dooku really tragic is instead of being a sith, he really is just a former Jedi. He leaves the order because they won't do enough about the corruption in the senate and begins to form the seps. They have no plan to attack the republic but the republic force their hand by making an army and using it against them. Palpatine has agents among the seps but Dooku doesn't know it at first. Then in EP III he finally learns the thruth about Palpatine and how cruelly he has been used. He then makes a desperate attack on Coruscant, intent on killing Palpatine. But when he bursts in on Palpatine, Anakin is there and they fight. Dooku tries to reason with Anakin and tells him that Palpatine is a Sith but Anakin of course doesn't listen and instead kills him.

    I think Dooku could have been so much more than what he became.

    Bye for now.
    Blackboard Monitor
  16. The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Grand Master

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    Sep 4, 2012
    star 4
    Dooku may not have been a Sith in the strictest sense but he was certainly evil. He murdered innumerable sentients firsthand, not including those killed by his underlings and the war that he created. Sure he may have started out wanting to fix the Republic, but he clearly went about the worst possible way to do so. Having a political agenda doesn't remove the fact that his intentions were pure evil.
  17. Darthbane2007 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2007
    star 4
    I assume Dooku knew everything except the part where Palpatine was going to have him killed..
  18. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

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  19. Darthbane2007 Force Ghost

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    Oct 31, 2007
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  20. MrFantastic74 Jedi Grand Master

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    Oct 4, 2010
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    Why would you say Dooku wasn't a Sith? Because he was once a Jedi?
    Anakin was a Jedi too, but he unquestionably became a Sith.
    Anakin and Dooku both became "Darths", and thus, were brought into the Sith fold.
  21. The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Grand Master

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    Sep 4, 2012
    star 4
    Agreed I don't understand why people argue that Dooku isn't a true Sith. At some point in his life the man became pure evil. He just wasn't a very smart Sith to realize that his master was trying to replace him.
  22. King Terak Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2012
    star 1
    Guess Dooku never felt like taking a peek in those robes [face_laugh]

    Although, on a serious note, that's something to think about, considering Darth Maul knew that Palpatine and Sidious were the same.
    Last edited by King Terak, Jan 8, 2013
  23. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4
    Why didn't Dooku tell Anakin the truth, when the latter had him down for the count aboard Grievious' ship?
  24. only one kenobi Jedi Grand Master

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    Nov 18, 2012
    star 3

    Well, he's with him in person at the end of AOTC. I don't see how he can expect to keep his identity secret in that circumstance. And Dooku does look at Palpatine with a "what the..." look before his head departs his body - though, why didn't he say anything?

    In fact, if Dooku really was a Sith then Palpatine's plan at the beginning of ROTS relied on a great deal of trust. I mean, how easy would it have been for Dooku to just...not turn up, and then send a hologram message to Grievous; "The plan has changed. Kill the Chancellor". Hey presto, he's completely destabilised the Republic and the CIS can press their advantage. Not Sidious' plan but... where would Dooku actually expect to fit in with that anyway?
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  25. Darthbane2007 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2007
    star 4
    Dooku was just getting senile in his old age...
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