How old is the Republic?

In ANH Obi-wan says "for a thousand generations the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice". But in AOTC we hear "there hasn't been a full scale war since the formation of the Republic" and "I will not let this Republic that has stood for a thousand years be torn in two".

In TPM we hear "The Sith have been extinct for a millennia."

Yet in Episode III GL says that the Sith came first "ruled the universe".

The EU takes the ANH quote. The Jedi came first. Then the Republic. A cult calling themselves the Sith came up. Then a thosuand years ago the Sith were defeated. And now they've rise again.

I say its because GL has changed his mind. He wanted a mystic universe, with the force and the Republic overthrown by the Empire. Now that he's actually showing that universe he's changed his mind.

My little brother says its because Obi-wan was stressed out. Me, I'd throw out the AOTC quotes. The guys who says that is stessed out, and is clearly summurizing. Like "There hasn't been a civil war for a 150 years" when the USA civil war was 145 years ago.

What do you think?

 

I think the EU is right, simply because the stuff in the films can be so obscure at times. Lucas leaves so much up to interpretation, almost leaving it for the EU to decide.

The EU also makes sense. In TPM, the Jedi Council states the Sith have been extinct for over a millenia. In terms of the EU, this makes sense. Before TPM, the last encounter with the Sith was, you guessed it, close to 1,000 years before the events in TPM. Also, even if you take Obi-Wans "over a thousand generations" literally, 1000 generations would come out to 20,000 years (assuming their generation is also 20 years), which is pretty close to how long the EU states the Old Republic existed before it's fall. So there really is no contradiction.

To be fair, though, Lucas is telling a single saga in a very different way from the EU. He concentrates on the mythology and all that stuff more than anything, so it's understandable why he doesn't try to elaborate on anything too much. Especially all his attempts to elaborate and explain the complex universe have failed miserably.

 

This has been covered several times in the ATOC forums, but there is nothing that is essentially contradictory in the movies or Lucas' quotes. I can't speak for the EU, because I haven't read much of it, but will speak for the movies.

In ANH, Kenobi says that for over a thousand generations the Jedi have protected "peace and justice" in the Old Republic. Let's say this is 20,000 years, at least.

In ATOC, Palpatine, the future emperor, says that the he will not allow the Republic, which has '"stood for a thousand years" be "split in two". In TPM, Mace Windu says that the Sith have been extinct for "a millenia". Grammatical errors aside (it should be a "millennium"), these statements are congruent with Sio Bibble's statement that there hasn't been a full-scale war since the formation of the republic.

All these people are political or close to politics, so they speak of the Republic in terms of the re-constitution of the Republic since the war that last defeated the Sith, the one which now prompt the Sith (Sidious and Maul) to seek revenge, even if they didn't exist at the time. Think of France. France is currently in the fifth republic of government, despite France existing as a nation-state for hundreds of years, at various times, as a republic, empire, monarchy and an occupied territory, in part, of a foreign power. Thus, a thousand years or so before the events of ATOC, there was a massive, full-scale war which led to the defeat of the Sith and the reconstitution of the Republic, much like the Algerian crisis of 1958 led to the reconstitution of the French republic under De Gaulle as expressed in, literally, a new consitution. The change in the GFFA republic after defeating the Sith was so profound as to mark a turning point in the form of government from that which had existed previously. Both Republic and Jedi (Palpatine, Bibble, Windu) and Sith (Palpatine/Sidious) see it as a turning point, and acknowledge it as such. When Palpatine speaks of the "republic that has stood for a thousand years" he is speaking both as head of that republic and the Sith who were defeated a thousand years previously and who are seeking revenge and destruction of that same republic and the Jedi who lead to their defeat.

This bring us to the Kenobi's "thousand generations" quote. Much like France, the Republic must have existed for at least a thousand generations prior to the events of ATOC. As such, if we are to take Lucas' quote that the Sith once ruled "the universe" then they must have either done it prior to the "thousand generations" or sometime during the "thousand generations", i.e., about a thousand years prior to ATOC. Either the Jedi at one time served the Sith (or were the Sith, hmmm), as rightful rulers of the galaxy or else challenged their rule. Alternatively, 20,000 or more years previously, the Sith ruled and then were usurped by the Republic and the Jedi.

Nothing in the films or Lucas' comments is contradictory, although they may contradict the EU.

 

Great post, but take my word for it, the EU does not contradict the films like many people say.

Everything you said has been correlated and supported by the EU. So this is a perfect confirmation, one that works three ways: Lucas' own words, the films themselves, and the EU.

The thing to always remember is that Lucas and the films will always be rather obscure and vague, while the EU always flushes everything out. This may be because a movie is less capable of telling broad stories, butI feel Lucas also makes an effort not to explain everything. When he does, he always fails.

 

How long ago was Empress Teta? 5000BBY, that was republic wasn;t it?

careful guys, any EU talk outside the safehouses is playing with fire.

 

"I will not let this Republic which has stood for over a thousand years be split in two."
-Chancellor Palpatine.

There ya go, simple as that.

 

It is twenty five thousand years old.

 

GL has said that "a thousand years" was a typo and it should be a thousand generations.

 

GL has said that "a thousand years" was a typo and it should be a thousand generations.

Where? Good.

 

Lucas DID, in fact, contradict himself majorly in AOTC.

One generation is typically held to be about 25-40 years {from the birth of one generation until they birth the next generation}. So, going by Ben's statement in ANH, the Republic {or at least the Jedi} were at LEAST 25,000 years old; not the measely little one thousand years as per Palpatine in AOTC.

 

I'll have to agree with PalpatineAntikristos. The Republic is 20,000 years old at least, but I'm not guessing much more than that. The Republic was the first order, the first law of uniting the galaxy together not counting a few primitive orders. The rituals are old, but not extremely old. 20,000 is quite a good estimate.

 

Does anyone here has ever heard about the Battle of Ruusan and the Ruusan Reformation? I started to investigate some time ago about this issue and found this:

"The Ruusan Reformation was a fictional event in the Star Wars universe when the Republic Measures and Standards Bureau reset the year zero to year of the Battle of Ruusan, which is 1,000 BBY by the current date system.

The Battle of Ruusan was the final major engagement of the conflict fought by the Galactic Republic and the Sith Order in the fictional Star Wars universe 1,000 years before the Battle of Yavin.

It led to the apparent extinction of the Sith, and the restructuring of the Republic and of the Jedi and Sith Orders.

The pivotal seventh battle of Ruusan resulted in the most powerful and last surviving Dark Lord of the Sith, Darth Bane, deciding henceforth to concentrate the dark side of the Force in only one master and one apprentice."

I don't know if this is official, but it's very interesting indeed. According to this, during the Battle of Ruusan a mayor Force Cataclysm occurred destroying all of the Sith (as told by Ki-Adi-Mundi in TPM) and most of the Jedi Knights. After such desaster, the Republic history was divided resulting in the 1,000 years old number given by Palpatine.

EDIT: Source: www.answers.com

 

1000, cuz Palpy said so