How to Fix a Sinking Political Party (or how to save the Democrat Party)

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by TripleB, Nov 4, 2004.

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  1. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6

    The Republicans would not move to Canada. Arguement settled. LOL


    What makes you think that we'd let them in? The Democrats are conservative enough, thankyouverymuch.
  2. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    The Republicans would not move to Canada. Arguement settled. LOL

    What makes you think that we'd let them in?

    LOL. Good one [face_laugh]
  3. shinjo_jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2002
    star 5
    "How dare you say I'm not patriotic! I'm just as patriotic as any Republican! You have no right to say that I'm not!!! In fact...who won? Screw it, I'm moving to Canada!


    To clarity something - not all of the Democrats who said that they were as patriotic as they come are moving to Canada. They care about their health, their job, their environment, and their future more than their love for staying in the United States - which is perfectly fine, it my eyes.

    The Republicans would not move to Canada. Arguement settled.


    That's not entirely true, at least around here. My best friend, who is a hard-core Republican, told me shortly before the Election that if John Kerry was elected, he would be moving to Canada in the Spring. He also said the same thing if Hillary Clinton would win in the next election.
  4. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    My best friend, who is a hard-core Republican, told me shortly before the Election that if John Kerry was elected, he would be moving to Canada in the Spring. He also said the same thing if Hillary Clinton would win in the next election.

    Good call. Get used to the idea of gay marriage, legalizing pot, budget surpluses paying down the national debt, higher taxes, government provided health care, and a culture that frowns heavily on guns, before it comes to the US. That way, when he returns a few years later, he?ll be able complain about how Kerry and Clinton are too conservative.
  5. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    Talk about frying pan to fire...

    Either you are pulling my leg or you "hard core republican" friend doesn't know much aboot Canadian politics eh?
  6. Hades2021 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 29, 2003
    star 4
    It's countries like Canada where we get the Tom Greens of the world.

    (that was a joke, so no one take offense please)
  7. shinjo_jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2002
    star 5
    Either you are pulling my leg or you "hard core republican" friend doesn't know much aboot Canadian politics eh?


    I'm not pulling your leg - but he is a hard-core republican who said he would move to Canada if Hillary Clinton was elected. First off, you have to know him - then it wouldn't surprise you. I don't think he's taken that into consideration yet. He just believes that if Hillary Clinton is elected, he'll be getting out of the country as fast as he can.

    Get used to the idea of gay marriage, legalizing pot, budget surpluses paying down the national debt, higher taxes, government provided health care, and a culture that frowns heavily on guns, before it comes to the US.


    That's why I want to move there - the country is actually in good condition. Except for the who marijuana thing, but I can get over that.
  8. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    Weed is no worse than alcohol.

    Actually, given the choice, I'd rather be around someone smoking pot than someone drinking alcohol. Not only are they easier to get along with, they smell better. ;)
  9. Hades2021 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 29, 2003
    star 4
    Smelling better is a matter of opinion. ;)
  10. Jediflyer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2001
    star 5
    [image=http://images.southparkstudios.com/img/content/characters/46a.gif]

    Blame Canada!
  11. igotajobasatestpilot Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2003
    star 2
    *skipped to end after first post*

    not sure if it's been brought up, but the poster who started the topic seems to be supporting the idea that somehow the people of the midwest and southern states represent america more than the people who live on the coasts in big cities. this is a ridiculous idea that i've been seeing more and more of.

    total rubbish.

    and both parties should try and put up moderates. extremism is an ugly thing, no matter where you apply it.
  12. masterskywalker Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2001
    star 5
    Because Raven, you Canuks so good natured. America could rid of a lot of its problems by unloading our prison population on you guys. ;)
  13. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    this is a ridiculous idea that i've been seeing more and more of.

    total rubbish.


    Uhhh...Did you see the election results?

    Ya know what? Never mind. Like I said earlier, keep your blinders on. I'll make '08 easier.
  14. igotajobasatestpilot Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2003
    star 2
    election results have nothing to do with my statement. regardless of how america voted, some conservatives seem to think that blue cities/states somehow aren't as american as the red states.

    anytime i get in a discussion about the electoral college it comes up. and TribleB's post echoed the same ridiculous sentiment.


    EDIT: regarding raven's post. have we had a discussion about marijuana in the senate yet? perhaps a new thread is in order...
  15. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    . regardless of how america voted, some conservatives seem to think that blue cities/states somehow aren't as american as the red states.

    Well...they are the ones talking about moving to Canada, aren't they? Is that American? Would Mel Gibson or Bruce Willis talk like that? I doubt it.
  16. Cyprusg Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 16, 2002
    star 4
    Well...they are the ones talking about moving to Canada, aren't they? Is that American? Would Mel Gibson or Bruce Willis talk like that? I doubt it.

    Who's "they"? A few liberals do not represent liberals as a whole, get that through your brain. You don't see any of us bringing up the Michigan militia or any other right-wing wack jobs do ya?
  17. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    Well...there is an Ann Coulter thread... [face_laugh]
  18. igotajobasatestpilot Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2003
    star 2
    what he said. the hot air of a few disillusioned people doesn't matter.

    i'm talking about the idea that somehow, conservatives living in rural, red states are "the true america," and everyone else shouldn't count for as much.
  19. liberalmaverick Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 3
    shinjo_jedi: The reason why Kerry lost, IMO, was not because people thought Bush was great; it was because they thought he was better than Kerry. And that was largely due to all the smear and distortions that were unleashed upon Kerry by Rove. Because Rove will simply dust out the same repertoire for a Kerry 2008 campaign, I do not believe Kerry will win then.

    As for our prospects, I really think Senator Russ Feingold (D-Wis.) should make a run.

    Sen. Clinton's gender might alienate sexist voters, but I wonder how strong a vote they amount to, and where they are concentrated. I'm sure they are not in the blue states - female leaders are everywhere. Both of my own state's (California) and Maine's Senators are women. Michigan has a woman governor. Maryland and New York have one women Senator each.

    Some red states have women as well - Louisiana's Mary Landrieu, Arkansas's Blanche Lincoln, Kansas's Kathleen Sebelius, Texas's Kay Bailey Hutchinson. Perhaps the sexist voters are largely in culturally regressive areas, which are probably rural, which Democrats wouldn't do too well in anyway. (I apologize for the blatant generalizations, but they're necessary for the purposes of this post.)

    I'm not pulling your leg - but he is a hard-core republican who said he would move to Canada if Hillary Clinton was elected.

    Raven makes a good point. If this a hard-core conservative, why would he pick Canada as his refuge? Why not move to a diehard conservative country like... like... Saudi Arabia? I don't know.

    Chile would be a good pick if Pinochet was still around.

    ophelia: Well that explanation makes me feel somewhat better about Gov. Granholm. However, did she even attempt to raise taxes to solve budget problems? Speaking for myself and, I think, most Democrats, tax increase (particularly on the affluent) is the method of choice for deficit reduction, and vastly preferable to spending cuts.

    Actually, I saw an interview of her with Chris Matthews, and she said she would have no interest in the Presidency even if she were eligible.

    I think she should stay as Michigan Governor. She does seem to be intelligent, articulate, and if I may say so, good-looking. :)

    J-Rod:
    Hey, here's a new question.

    I love how the Dems were pissed off because we were doubting their patrotism.

    "How dare you say I'm not patriotic! I'm just as patriotic as any Republican! You have no right to say that I'm not!!! In fact...who won? Screw it, I'm moving to Canada!



    The Republicans would not move to Canada. Arguement settled. LOL


    Er, pardon me, but... where's the question?

    Cyprusg:You don't see any of us bringing up the Michigan militia or any other right-wing wack jobs do ya?

    Well...there is an Ann Coulter thread...


    Which was started by a conservative Ann Coulter fan, genius. ;)

    igotajobasatestpilot:
    not sure if it's been brought up, but the poster who started the topic seems to be supporting the idea that somehow the people of the midwest and southern states represent america more than the people who live on the coasts in big cities. this is a ridiculous idea that i've been seeing more and more of.

    total rubbish.


    Indeed. It's a tactic Republicans are using to demoralize Democrats. Don't fall for it.
  20. darth_paul Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2000
    star 5
    Speaking for myself and, I think, most Democrats, tax increase (particularly on the affluent) is the method of choice for deficit reduction, and vastly preferable to spending cuts.
    [face_laugh] Yep, let it never be doubted that libmav is on the left.

    When I'm married, if we ever have money problems, I'll have to try this out. "No, honey, I don't need to buy less Star Wars stuff. Instead, we need to ask our bosses for raises."

    -Paul
  21. ophelia Cards Against Humanity Host. Ex-Mod

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 6
    liberalmaverick wrote: ophelia: Well that explanation makes me feel somewhat better about Gov. Granholm. However, did she even attempt to raise taxes to solve budget problems? Speaking for myself and, I think, most Democrats, tax increase (particularly on the affluent) is the method of choice for deficit reduction, and vastly preferable to spending cuts.

    Aargh . . . I should be paying more attention to these aspects of my state's politics. My general impression, for which I can't actually give specifics, is that her line is that we need to attract business to Michigan through having the highest-caliber workforce, i.e., high-tech industry zones like automation alley, rather than attracting businesses by never making them pay any taxes. Ever. As long as they live.

    This would imply that she's scaling back Engler's corporate welfare policies, which isn't so much raising taxes as much as it is making companies pay taxes they owed in the first place. There's been talk of a tax hike on gasoline to help pay for road upkeep and to encourage people to save fuel, but I think they're still bickering about that.

    THe fact that Granholm isn't an outrageously controversial figure with most people tells me that she hasn't done anything hugely dramatic, although she does seem to be annoying the right people in Lansing--namely wildly-pro-business legislators and Engler-appointed judges who got used to no taxes and no regulation during the 80's and 90's.

    Despite the complaints, Michigan businesses have not been scurrying for the exits, although we aren't attracting as many new businesses as before, either. My feeling is that this is because we're in a recession, and that affects businesses too. They're less likely to take risks than they were when the economy was great and it would never, ever, ever get any worse. (Please.) We'll see how things play out when the economy eventually digs itself out of this hole. The hope is that even though we may not be attracting as many (predatory, I don't give a damn about your population, just gimme all the goodies I can get, after which I'll skedaddle) businesses, the ones we do get will remain in place, because we're becoming a specialized economy with skills that can't be found everywhere. (Where that leaves my poor special ed teens who read and do math at the 5th grade level I don't know, but be that as it may.)

    I will now shut the hell up about Michigan. :p

    Edit darth_paul: A better analogy for the case in point would be, "Honey, let's not buy less Star Wars toys, let's go on welfare and quit paying our taxes. Then we can buy all the toys we want!" ;)
  22. sellars1996 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 19, 2002
    star 3
    There might not be so much butter to go around in the workers' paradise that is the People's Republic of Canada if those happy go lucky Canucks actually had to spend money on guns in the form of national defense. Roving herds of caribou in the Arctic and the world's largest undefended border to the south are not exactly a homeland security threat, particularly when your neighbor to the south is the world's only super power and has been responsible for much of your own peace and economic prosperity.

    As friendly as the people were in Montreal when I visited there a few years ago, I much prefer the so-called cowboy conservatism and redneck hayseed good life I have in Texas, thank you very much.
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