How to Make the Love Story More Believable

Discussion in 'Attack of the Clones' started by Binary_Sunset, May 18, 2002.

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  1. AL Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1998
    star 5

    It would have made more sense to suggest that Anakin and Padme had been spending some time together previous to the film, as they did with Han and Leia in Empire. Nevertheless, that is not Lucas' intention.

    His intention is to show a fairy tale love in which heroes and heroines fall in love as easily as they slay dragons. In the grand scheme of the prequels, the love story works perfectly.

    And Binary_Sunset, don't give up the day job.

    (BTW, where was Jar Jar in Kamino; I thought you said he would be Obi Wan's side kick and be present in Kamino and in the final battle?)
  2. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    AL wrote: "His intention is to show a fairy tale love in which heroes and heroines fall in love as easily as they slay dragons. In the grand scheme of the prequels, the love story works perfectly."

    Do fairy tale princesses fall in love with and marry child-butcherers?


    You got me on the Jar Jar, AL. This movie sunk for entirely different reasons than Jar Jarisms.
  3. Wajas Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 15, 2001
    star 1
    I agree with ShaneP, that it's part of the point that the relationship IS rushed, badly thought through...it's the point that it might not be love just a deep infatuation. Because, as people said, it's a tragic one, one destined to go terribly wrong.
    It would have been less believable I think, in the eventual scheme of things, had they known each other for years.
    And as for the point about Padme being mature, well physically yes but emotionally? Having your teenage years destroyed by responsibilty and war mean that she knows little about love I think.
  4. Draculas_guest Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 15, 2001
    star 2
    "Actually it's quite a point. The love story worked quite well for me. I am sick of so many people thinking they can do a better job. Fact is, they CAN'T. "

    How would you know, no-one has tried. Someone went off and re-edited TPM without anyones permission, and from the rumours I've heard, the re-edit is a vast improvement over the original.

    I think BinarySunset has some good points. Look, it is possible that in 5 years time, Lucas might re-evaluate certain aspects of this new trilogy and tweak them, in a similar way he tweaked the original trilogy a number of times. Granted, the modifications of the original trilogy were more to do with quality of effects, but there are a number of different ways AOTC could have been done. Just because Lucas chose one way to do it, doesn't necessarily mean it is the only way. Stop being so un-imaginative
  5. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    Shane, I'm married but no kids yet. :)

    I could buy some immaturity in Padme, but even most of the teenie-bopper girls at the mall talking on their cell phones wouldn't meet a guy, find out he's a mass murderer, and then marry him all within a week! Padme would have to be a complete idiot to do that. And if that's how GL wants to portray her, well... Let's just say that I won't feel sorry for her AT ALL in E3, no matter what happens to her. Neither would I feel sorry for someone who leaps off a cliff and dies; though I would feel sorry if the person was pushed.
  6. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    Thank you, Draculas guest. :)
  7. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 7
    "that it's part of the point that the relationship IS rushed, badly thought through...it's the point that it might not be love just a deep infatuation."

    Exactly W. Remember in Jedi when Leia tells Luke she remembers her mother being "sad"?

    Well, maybe because her children are split from her and she's never known true love.

    It's interesting that as Luke's story parallels his father's, Leia's does her mother's. But Leia's has a happy ending.

    EDIT: BTW, did anyone else see the look on Padme's face at the very end? Does she look happy?

    Anyone ever see The Graduate? One of the best contemporary young-love stories. Remember the look on the girl's face? Very similiar.
  8. Riley Man Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 1999
    star 5
    What exactly was going to be said in the remorse scene that would've made you despise Padme so much? The cut scenes page just says he "continues on where he talks of his remorse for doing it and Padme tells him that he is only human." I don't really see that "making excuses" -- it's more that she's trying to calm him.
  9. abmccray Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2002
    star 2
    I'll create a "Clone Edit," but I need a better copy of the movie than the current bootlegs.

    What I really need to get a hold of is all those scenes that Lucas cut out of the movie. The fact that Lucas cut out character exposition and development to give us scenes of Anakin and Padme playing Mega Man shows the exact problem with the film.

    Get me a better copy and I'll make an edit ;)
  10. That_Wascally_Droid Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 29, 2001
    star 6
    Well you found the nitch that most people agree with you on and ran with it.

    You know how to play to an audience B_S, I'll give you that.
  11. SLAVE2 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2000
    star 5
    I wish I knew why Binary_Sunset liked talking about things he hates so much, it just seems such a strange thing to do.
  12. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    Riley Man, here's the cut scene from the script published in the "Art of" book:


    ANAKIN: Why do I hate them? I didn't...I couldn't...I couldn't control myself. I...I don't want to hate them...but I just can't forgive them.

    PADME: To be angry is to be human.

    ANAKIN: To control your anger is to be a Jedi.

    PADME: Ssshhh...you're human.

    ANAKIN: No. I'm a Jedi. I know I'm better than this. I'm sorry, I'm so sorry!

    PADME: You're like everyone else...



    As you can see, in this cut scene Anakin is the one who is trying to come out of his dark hole; but Padme pushes him right back in.

    She tells him it's only human to be a mass murderer!
    She shushes him when he says he should have controlled his anger!
    She says everyone is like that when he says he should have been better!

    "I know you just massacred a bunch of women and children, but hey, don't sweat it. You were just being human. There's no need to control your anger. If you ever want to just cut loose and massacre some more, just do it. Everyone is like that."

    Grrrr. That scene makes my blood boil. If that had been in the movie, my head would have exploded!
  13. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 7
    Wait Binary, I think you're missing something said earlier(actually a few minutes ago). ;)

    Is Padme really in love with Anakin? Yeah, she did say she loved him when they were about to die in the arena, but does she really?

    As for "feeling bad" for her in Episode 3? Tragic characters are often victims of circumstance. They're relationship develops as a result of extraneous events not necessarily because they truly love one another. That's one of the aspects of the story that's tragic.

    As for you're future little binaries(or gungans :D) just so long as you don't name them Biggs and Tank. ;)
  14. SLAVE2 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2000
    star 5
    Binary, how many people do you think Luke killed on the Death Star? Like father like son, then Leia congratulates him...what a weird family ?[face_plain]
  15. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    SLAVE2, the Death Star was a military target. It was not a civilian target. I'm not a pacifist. I'm a strict just war theorist.
  16. JediTidus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2002
    star 1
    I thought the love story was fine. It was a plot device. Lucas was trying to fit two storylines into one movie, the only way the love story would have been better is if it had more screen time and I much rather see action than the love story.
  17. abmccray Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2002
    star 2
    I JUST REALIZED THE SIMPLEST WAY IN WHICH THE "LOVE STORY" COULD BE FIXED!

    I was scannign the bootleg just now, planning out my edit, when I realized something...

    WHY DOES THE KISS COME BEFORE THE MEADOW SCENE?!

    This is so paifully obvious that even a kid could figure it out! If the meadow buildup came before the kiss, we could see why Anakin would make a move on her - and she would initially accept it. It would make perfect sense, and not be so offsetting to the audience, especially since it is given no buildup and quickly cuts back to Obi-Wan.

    Editing this movie should be a much easier task than PM, although I still wish I had those cut scenes to actually give Dooku some kind of purpose other than some lame excuse for Yoda to swing a saber.

    I really can't believe Lucas made such an obvious mistake there.
  18. ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 7
    Wait Binary, Padme consoles Anakin as much over Shmi's death as his confession to her.

    The Tusken's were different than the Stormtroopers and Imperial Officers Luke burned holes through in Star Wars?

  19. SLAVE2 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2000
    star 5
    The people onboard the Death Star were more human than the Tuskens. If the Tuskens had found Anakin they would have killed him (like they killed the search party), it was merely self defense. Whereas farm boy Luke went along for the joyride, didnt care how many familys were on the Death Star, he just wanted something to blow up! Crazy little boy!

    Iam sorry, your whole argument is crap, if I knew someone who had killed their mothers murderer in anger, call me crazy but I wouldnt be surprised at all and I'd be sympathetic. Almost anyone would do something to someone who murdered their mother, thats how Anakin is no different to anyone else.
  20. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    Shane, I'll have little Rebels. ;) But I won't name them Biggs or Tank. [face_laugh]
  21. abmccray Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2002
    star 2
    There were a lot of women and children on the Death Star too. Right. Wasn't this conversation already resolved in Clerks?

    Stop making lame excuses.
  22. plocool Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 25, 2001
    star 3
    I agree with Riley man.
    The rushed relationship b/w them may be key in their separation.
    I saw an obsessed Ani influence a Padme who would normally think rationally, but was copletely caught up in the emotions, possibly wanting to help Ani b/c of the things he goes through as a jedi. I think her feelings truly change when Ani comes back from killing the tuskens. She's weirded out by him, but wants to help or maybe even fix him.
  23. Binary_Sunset Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 5
    Oh, boy. The whole point of the Tusken massacre is that it marks the beginning of Anakin's descent into the dark side! That's why they play the Emperor's theme when Anakin is telling Padme about it!

    Are you really saying that Anakin's action is better than Luke's? Then, SLAVE2, you've missed the most basic point of the entire saga:

    1. Anakin becomes evil.
    2. Luke resists evil.
    3. Anakin is saved by Luke.
  24. abmccray Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2002
    star 2
    "Iam sorry, your whole argument is crap, if I knew someone who had killed their mothers murderer in anger, call me crazy but I wouldnt be surprised at all and I'd be sympathetic. Almost anyone would do something to someone who murdered their mother, thats how Anakin is no different to anyone else."

    I didn't know that the whole camp, including the women and children, which Anakin admitted to killing in PLEASURE, killed his mother.

    Wow, you didn't even understand the movie you love so much. Perhaps that has something to do with it...
  25. SLAVE2 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2000
    star 5
    abmccray, how exactly do you know the women didnt do anything to Shmi? Anakin should have picked the most likely suspect from 20 Tuskens looking at him?
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