Human Rights

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Hungry_Ghost, May 26, 2005.

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  1. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    FID said...I already did. And your quotes too prove you wrong as well. So no. I'm not PPOR'ing again unless there's something else to add.

    You've only PPOR'd why you believe it is a gulag. You've never PPOR'd that AI actually believes it's a gulag.

    You can't because they don't, never did.

    PPOR.
  2. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    They also never denied their position either. ;) And any fool can PPOR someone, do everyone a favor and look for yourself if you don't believe me. Sheesh...PPOR, IMO, is for intellectually lazy individuals.
  3. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    Remember this? Asked about the comparison, Schulz said, "Clearly this is not an exact or a literal analogy."

    They are denying that they believe it is a gulag.

    Or this one...Schulz said, "We don't know for sure what all is happening at Guantanamo

    Here they admit they don't even know.
  4. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Uhh...J-Rod...they meant that it's not exact or literal, but they do stand by what they've said. Is it that hard to figure out or are you in a 'Gotcha!' moment?
  5. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    they meant that it's not exact or literal, but they do stand by what they've said.

    Let's say that is even possible (it ain't) then why say, in the same interview..."We don't know for sure what all is happening at Guantanamo."

    That's not standing behind the statment.

  6. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    I take it you're not adept at nuanced speech?
  7. Medical-Droid Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 14, 2001
    star 2
    J-Rod, I think you may be slanting what is said. The comparison to a gulag was metaphorical, not literal, and the "we don't even know what all is going on" is not the same as "we don't know anything". It seems to be more akin to "there may be even more going on than what we have indicated".
  8. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    I take it you're not adept at nuanced speech?

    Of course I am. He used nuanced speech to say he lied.
  9. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    You're very bad at this.
  10. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    Alright, try this.

    "That's why I think Amnesty needs to get out on top of it to clarify what the report really says and to note that the use of the 'gulag' phrase was an unfortunate phrase, it's the wrong phrase, it's the incorrect phrase, and did not accurately categorize what the U.S. is doing," Arend said.

    I'm not bad at this, I just take a word as a word. Try it sometime.

    They lied.
  11. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    You should know better than this to use fauxnews by now.
  12. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    Don't change the subject. I've just proved my point.
  13. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    You proved your point with a biased news source. Try finding one that's more balanced.
  14. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    You proved your point with a biased news source.

    Sorry, if you don't accept worldnewsdaily or newsmax, that's understandable. I don't accept commondreams.

    But I accept CNN as proof, there is no reason to accept FOX. We both feel each slants the story. But niether lie.
  15. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    But wait! There's more!

    Speaking of political donations, it turns out top officials at Amnesty International (search), the self-described "independent" and "impartial" organization that called Guantanamo Bay the "gulag of our times," have recently given thousands of dollars to Democratic campaigns.

    Executive director William Schulz (search) donated $2,000, the maximum legal amount, to John Kerry's presidential bid last year, and another $1,000 to Massachusetts Senator Ted Kennedy's re-election campaign for next year.


    Amnesty Board Chairman Joe Pitts III (search) also gave $2,000 to Kerry's campaign. But, an Amnesty spokesman insists, "We strive to do everything humanly possible to see that the personal political perspectives of our leadership have no bearing whatsoever upon the nature of our findings."


    Bias? Left wing? We report, you decide. ;)
  16. Quixotic-Sith Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2001
    star 6
    Waitaminnit, you're making a leap in your argument, J-Rod. Donations from private individuals do not equate to official endorsement from an organization.

    I teach, and my college has a strict policy saying that faculty cannot use the classroom as a soapbox for a political party, nor can we make public statements affiliating ourselves with the college without explicit administrative permission (to avoid looking like spokespeople). I am still free to donate my time and energy to a political candidate as a private citizen.

    What Fox reported was two donations from private individuals - it is irresponsible to insinuate that they did so in an official capacity or as representative of Amnesty International. That conclusion does not necessarily follow from the information given.
  17. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9
    J-Rod, how much knowlegde did AI have about Soviet Gulags during the USSR's heyday?

    Yep, gotcha.

    And it's "We Report, You Believe"

    E_S
  18. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    [image=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v226/FireIceDeath/Pics/sheeple.jpg]
  19. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9
  20. Quixotic-Sith Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2001
    star 6
    That's really baiting, FID.
  21. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Not baiting. Just a funny image. :D
  22. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    J-Rod, how much knowlegde did AI have about Soviet Gulags during the USSR's heyday?

    Well, I would think that as one of the leading human rights organisations, they would be well versed in the history of human rights abuse. I mean wouldn't they?

    But then again, they don't seem to be well versed in the current situation of human rights abuse, so you may have apoint...

    Seriously, E_S, of course they would have complete understanding of the Soviet Gulags. Remember, it wasn't that long ago. You may be young enough to feel like the 80's were ancient history, I don't know. But it wasn't that long ago. (God, I miss Poison!)

    Seriously, both you and FID need to accept the fact that AI intentionally misdescribed Gitmo as a gulag.

    We can debate why they did it (to draw attention to the issue, or to lash out at America) but the fact that they did it is indisputable.

    I'm not used to seeing you argue from emotion, usually you run on straight fact. But this time, I'm the one presenting the facts you seem to be interpreting them through an emotional filter.

    FID, did you put a camera in my living room? [face_laugh]

    Quix said...Waitaminnit, you're making a leap in your argument, J-Rod.

    Yes, it is a leap. But at the very least is shows a serious lack of professional judgement when you work for an organisation that must appear impartial to be its most effective.
  23. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9
    J-Rod, I am pleased that there exists on the internet an emoticon to express how I feel debating with you.

    [image=http://boards1.wizards.com/images/smilies/banghead.gif]

    Seriously, if you can't figure out by the telltale wording that I was talking about how much AI knew AT THE TIME the gulags were working, i.e. how much did AI -25years from now know about the gulags!!!

    Seriously; here it is again!

    [image=http://boards1.wizards.com/images/smilies/banghead.gif]

    Please, please, please stop baiting!

    [image=http://boards1.wizards.com/images/smilies/surrender.gif]

    E_S

  24. J-Rod Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 5
    Seriously, if you can't figure out by the telltale wording that I was talking about how much AI knew AT THE TIME the gulags were working, i.e. how much did AI -25years from now know about the gulags!!!

    Relax bro, simple misunderstanding. So, AI not knowing much about gulags at that time has...what...to do with them lying about Gitmo?

    Please, please, please stop baiting!

    Sorry, didn't realize I was.

    LOL Kinda funny...you telling someone not to bait. [face_laugh]
  25. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9
    I don't bait! :eek:

    Actually I just love that smiley and wanted to use it. [face_whistling]

    E_S
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