Discussion I am now depressed and my excitement for the trilogy has dropped a bit....

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by Bleeding0range, Nov 16, 2012.

  1. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    probably. possibly. You would need a significant part of screentime to show them though, as well as to emphasize, maybe, the internal conflicts between them.
  2. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    they pretty much emphasized this in the EU by stating that humans were the most populous species in the galaxy (according to wookiepedia.)

    I mean ,sure, they can say that now from an official standpoint. but it really wasn't until ROTJ that we saw more aliens onscreen. From Ackbar to that Sullustan next to Lando. think there were a couple more non-humans/aliens in the Rebel briefing in ROTJ.
  3. EviL_eLF Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    The problem was... Greivous wasn't even in the PT until the 3rd one... yet Tarkin, Ozzel, Veers, Piett, Needa... we were fed new Imperials along with the carry overs from one OT episode to the next.

    The enemy was never faceless in the OT.
  4. CT-867-5309 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    Tarkin was only in ANH. Ozzel, Veers and Needa were only in ESB. Piett was in ESB and ROTJ. Piett is the only one with any carry over.

    Compare that to Nute Gunray, who had a significant role in all three prequels. You may not like Nute Gunray, but he was there the whole time.

    Imo, the enemy isn't faceless in the PT, Palpatine is the enemy and he's in plain sight the entire time.

    No other enemy matters, because Palpatine is pulling the strings.

    People have said that it was a mistake to have Maul, Dooku and Grievous instead of one major villain, and I agree. People compare their role to Vader's role in the OT, that is where I disagree. Maul, Dooku and Grievous are not the equivalent of Vader, Palpatine is. Palpatine is the PT's Vader. Grievous, Maul and Dooku are Tarkin, Ozzel, Veers, Piett and Needa.

    In terms of antagonists, OT's Palpatine is actually Anakin in the PT, who has a flash of dark side in AOTC and goes full dark in ROTS. Palpatine had a very quick appearance in ESB and was a major antagonist in ROTJ only. The roles are equal in terms of time.
  5. EviL_eLF Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    Actually we are introduced to Tiaan Jerjerrod on the 2nd Death Star when Vader is greeted by him at the beginning as well.
    Last edited by EviL_eLF, Nov 18, 2012
  6. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    What?

    That's Jerjerrod
  7. EviL_eLF Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
  8. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    Piett was the only Imperial carryover due to his popularity among fans, at least, according to Wookiepedia. Which, if true, is damn awesome.
  9. EviL_eLF Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    Even when I was a kid I liked Piett... He had common sense, and as we saw... that was a rare thing amongst the Imperials.

    I also felt bad for Needa, he had honor and wasn't afraid to admit when he made a mistake and Vader killed him for it.
  10. EviL_eLF Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    Also... about the Nute Gunray thing... sorry he is not a character equivalent to Piett or Veers etc. He's a bureaucrat.
  11. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 4
    I agree. Although this method of storytelling failed in many fans' eyes, this was Lucas' intention -- that they're one shot villains that served their purpose at that point in the story.
  12. TWISTY Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2012
    ....and ended up being more entertaining and memorable than all of Nute Gunray's screen time combined.
  13. CT-867-5309 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    In the PT, bureaucrats are far more dangerous than soldiers.

    Perhaps, but he was also playing with fire by bucking for promotion. Be careful what you wish for, or you might gain Darth Vader's attention, which usually ends poorly for you.

    In your opinion, but Gunray has a lot of die hard fans, including myself.
  14. NileQT87 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2002
    star 1
    Admittedly, some of those Imperial officers were just there to get Force-choked. "Apology accepted, Captain Needa." being pretty much the only reason that character is memorable. The long line of British Imperials failing to please Vader and failing at everything else in the OT was part of their charm. A bit like the largely incompetent Stormtroopers.

    The PT seemed to try to replicate this with Dooku, Grievous, etc..., but they ended up feeling like 'who the hell is this guy?' At least with the Imperials, their presence or purpose didn't need explanation. The easily-offed individuals of the PT would need a big explanation just to explain why they were there, when the point was really that they were there to die practically as quickly as they were introduced.

    Sadly, Christopher Lee is a rather prominent example of being wasted for such a high-profile actor. It's one thing to underuse Schofield, Sheard, etc... as background scenery, but Lee is as famous as Guinness and Cushing.
    Last edited by NileQT87, Nov 18, 2012
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  15. TWISTY Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2012
    I'm sorry George did practically nothing with your favorite character and also gave him am uninteresting death.
    EviL_eLF likes this.
  16. CT-867-5309 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    Not my favorite character, and George did far from nothing with him.

    Uninteresting death? Are you serious? Who didn't love Nute's crying last words? "The war is over. Lord Sidious promised us peace! We only want..." right before Anakin backhands him with his lightsaber. That was awesome. Anakin cutting him off is very similar to Vader choking Ozzel and Needa.

    I know I enjoyed Rune and Nute's cowering on the bridge of the Saak'ak at the start of TPM. "They're still coming through! This is impossible!" That sequence is one of the most memorable in the prequels, it felt just like ANH.

    How about Nute in AOTC? "She can't do that. Shoot her...or something." "This isn't how it's supposed to be. Jango, finish her off!" followed by Christopher Lee's "Patience Viceroy, patience. She will die."

    Whoever voiced Gunray did a fantastic job.
  17. Fleab88 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2012
    star 3
    People like different characters. No need for either side to get their panties in a bunch. Especially when it has nothing to do with the thread topic.
  18. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 4
    The most important thing people tend to ignore about the Prequels is that it is more about the villains and their origins than it is about the heroes. This trilogy mainly concerns itself with Anakin's fall and the Emperor's ascension.

    The Prequels were in a sense filmed backwards to mirror the protoganist style of the OT. Because of rampant corruption, the Senate became too inept to the keep the peace, and the Jedi evolved into a cold and shallow religious order, who in the end failed to see themselves as the antagonists, as well.

    You see, the OT was pretty clear cut and you can identify who the villains were. The Rebels vs. the Empire.
    The PT? Well, not so much, mainly because all parties contributed to the collapse of the Old Republic.

    At least that's how I see it.
    yggdrasil311 likes this.
  19. Vastor Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    star 3
    That looks great ! Cant wait to see what lucasfilm will make.
  20. Blue_Jedi33 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2003
    star 5
    It's silly did we ever hear people in there 40's when Star Was came out in 77, say I am disappointed that Peter Cushing looks old and ugly now.


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    Last edited by Blue_Jedi33, Nov 18, 2012