"I see Dead People...........but maybe I don't......"

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Darth_Malt, Oct 31, 2003.

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  1. Darth_Malt Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2003
    star 4
    I have not seen this anywhere so I decided to create a topic on this. It has to do with the whole force ghost thing.

    The only times we have seen a Force Ghost was Obi-Wan in "Empire" and the whole gang at the end of "Jedi". But I was wondering, can other people than Luke see force Ghosts?

    Whenever there was a force ghost in the films, there has been no one around except at the end of Return of the Jedi.

    Is it only Luke Skywalker that can see Force Ghosts? Or do you have to be a Jedi to see a force Ghost? Heck, can anyone see a force ghost? It's not been very clear on this issue so far but maybe the last Star Wars film can clear it up!

    What do you guys think? Personally, I think only Jedi can see Force Ghosts.
  2. DarthNigel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 14, 2003
    star 3
    I always felt that the phenomenon depended on both the person appearing as a ghost, as well as the person seeing the vision. I.E., the person seeing the vision would have to have some Force-related ability to perceive the ghost.

    In ROTJ, it appears that even Leia, who we know to be Force-sensitive in some degree, does not see the ghosts of Yoda, Obi-Wan, and Anakin when she walks over to bring Luke back to the party.

    Perhaps it's like a radio transmission - A weaker signal will need a more sensitive receiver to pick it up, whereas a strong signal can be picked up by less-sensitive receivers. examples:

    Qui-Gon projects a weak signal, because he has not sufficiently developed the techniques before his death. Therefore, Yoda and Mace are able to pick up his voice, but only weakly and only in times of great emotional turmoil, which strengthens the signal.

    Obi-Wan and Yoda are able to develop the technique more fully. When Obi-Wan dies, at first Luke can only pick up his voice, and later as he becomes more skilled, he can see Obi-Wan in gradually increasing levels of clarity (e.g. ESB on Hoth, then Dagobah, then ROTJ on Dagobah and Endor).

    Anakin appears as a ghost also, so he must either learn the technique in episode 3, or he must be powerful enough or have enough midichlorians to enable his ghost to appear without learning any specific technique.

    GL has said this would be explained in ep3, so I guess we'll have to wait and see.
  3. iMark-The-Blue Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Wow that's a good question. I have no Idea.

    Perhaps force ghosts can be seen by only who the ghost wants them to be seen by?
  4. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 1999
    star 10
    Only Force-sensitive people can see the ghosts of Jedi, and then only Jedi that they were close to in life. For example, Leia didn't see Yoda, Obi and Anakin at the end of ROTJ, because she didn't know them. And R2-D2 couldn't even see Obi-Wan's ghost on Dagobah at all.
  5. DarthNigel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 14, 2003
    star 3
    Does it matter whether the person was close to you in life, or does it matter whether you are there when the person dies? or both?
  6. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 1999
    star 10
    I believe they had to be close to each other in life.

    However, Anakin did appear to Leia a short time afterward, to try to apologize for Vader's actions, so it may not be a hard rule.

    But you do have to be a Force-user to see the Jedi spirits.
  7. Darth-Lando Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2002
    star 6
    This is EU Infinities but here goes anyways.
    In ANH Infinities, when Obi-Wan appears to Luke and has a conversation with him, Han has no idea what's going on and think's Luke is talking to himself. He can't see Obi. Draw your own conclusions.
  8. Darth_Malt Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2003
    star 4
    I was just bringing up another topic at first but now I really want to know what George Lucas thinks on this issue.
  9. Palp_Faction Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 3, 2002
    star 3
    What I want to know is why the ghosts wear Jedi robes? When Obi-wan sits down to chat to Luke in ROTJ he even adjusts his robes to sit down. Do spirits wear their favourite clothes in heaven?
  10. Darth_Malt Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2003
    star 4
    That is an absolutely great question. I have never thought of that either.
  11. Spike_Spiegel Former FF Administrator Former Saga Mod

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2002
    star 6
    Think about it, what would make Luke go to the dark side faster than seeing a naked Obi-Wan?

    Food for thought.

    :p


    I believe that the only people who see Force Ghosts are the persons that ghost wants to communicate with. In RotJ, the three ghosts wanted only Luke to see them and were invistible (intentional, :p ) to Leia.
  12. MariahJade2 Former Fan Fiction Archive Editor

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    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2001
    star 5
    I think it's the will of the spirit who they can appear to. In ROTJ it was Luke that needed to see that he'd accomplished something, thus it was he the spirits appeared to. If it was necssary for Han to see Anakin for some reason then perhaps he'd be able to also, though it certainly seems to be only a Jedi thing up to now.
  13. vw_jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2002
    star 4
    You forgot that Yoda converses with, and sees Obi Wan in ESB while Luke is leaving Dagobah. However, unless you are a fan of the EU it can be said that no manifestation of a force ghost has happened unless a Skywalker was involved. i.e.

    epIV- Luke Hears Obi Wan after the duel with Vader and during the trench run on the DS.

    epV- Luke talks to Obi Wan on Hoth and Dagobah.
    Yoda also talks to Obi Wan and sees Obi wan. Luke is present both times

    epVI- Luke speaks to and sees Obi Wan on Dagobah and sees Obi Wan, Yoda and Anakin on the moon of Endor

    epII- Yoda hears Qui Gon trying to communicate with Anakin. I assume that Anakin also hears Qui Gon. Note, even though Yoda hears Qui Gon also Anakin, a Skywalker, is involved and is the intended receiver of the message.

    From the film evidence my opinion is that it's a phenomenon exclusive to the Skywalkers.
  14. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 1999
    star 10
    Well, Yoda didn't seem that surprised to see and hear Obi-Wan, so it's probably not exclusive to the Skywalker clan.
  15. vw_jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2002
    star 4
    Yoda also heard Qui Gon in AOTC when sensing Anakin in terrible emotional pain. So it's probable that he knows of the phenonenon involved with Skywalkers and force ghosts. In which case there is no reason for him to be "suprised." You can't rule out the possibility that the apperance of force ghosts is exclusive to situations involving skywalkers. So far as the movies show there is no situation where a Skywalker is not involved.

  16. vw_jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2002
    star 4
    Note, this is not my opinion, but the opinion of Lynn Gold circa 6/7/83. It's from the Google archives and I thought it would be amusing to interject some unjaded 80's SW fan logic into this thread. Please feel free to respond to Lynn, but I doubt she'll answer being that this post is over 20 years old.

    If every "good" person who died appeared in holograms, Luke's aunt and
    uncle, not to mention all those Rebellion fighters, would have appeared
    with Obi-Wan, Yoda and Anakin. If it were the case that one must be a
    Jedi knight in order to die and turn into a hologram, Luke would've had
    to deal with a horde of dead Jedi holograms. Therefore, the only ones
    who could appear as holograms would have to be people Luke knew during
    his lifetime who were Jedis and died "good." This would explain why the
    Emperor wouldn't show up in Luke's holograms.

    --Lynn

    I especially like that she refers to the Jedi spirits as "holograms." Hehe. :)
  17. Mateo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 22, 2001
    star 4
    Mace Windu cannot hear Qui-Gon's voice in AOTC,he just senses the Disturbance in the Force that Yoda had both felt and heard,thats why he asks him "What is it?"

    And as for Force Ghosts other Jedi can see them,remember in ESB Yoda was looking at Obi-Wan's ghost just like Luke was and was completely aware of the conversation they were having,of course Han or chewie wouldnt see or hear any of this if they were there but Leia might.
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