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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit Ignorance is Bias: The Diversity Manifesto

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CooperTFN, Sep 2, 2012.

  1. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    What, after this? I'm not even speaking to you now.
     
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  2. Mazzic

    Mazzic Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2000
    But you love me too much. And aren't I fulfilling some kind of diversity need here?

    I'm no good to you dead.
     
  3. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Live body, dead body, diversity score's still the same.
     
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  4. instantdeath

    instantdeath Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 22, 2010
    So I read something I found funny on the internet today. Essentially, someone was denying that casting Billy Dee Williams in a prominent role in such a huge film was in anyway a big deal. This came out of a conversation where it was asserted that Star Wars doesn't need more diversity, because it has aliens (ugh). Someone rightfully brought up that yes, Star Wars does need diversity and that it most certainly didn't have it before Lando, because you can take one look at the Rebel Alliance from ANH and see they're all white guys. The defense slayed me: "I doubt that was intentional. They were probably all just right for their parts."

    Riiight. Every single background character with no line or action was specifically chosen based on how they simply embodied their characters. Unfortunately, no black guy happened to fit any of those deeply specific roles.
     
  5. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Dude, Jan Dodonna's whiteness is CRUCIAL. The narrative would fall apart if he was, say, a Klingon.
     
  6. Random Comments

    Random Comments Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 25, 2012
    And the tenth guy from the right, nine rows back?
    Definitely has to be a white guy. Nobody else could do that standing there like that.
     
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  7. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Dude, that's a woman.









    Ha, I'm just kidding--there are no women in the movie either.
     
  8. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
  9. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
  10. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Has this thread ever discussed Jan Ors, as depicted in Jedi Knight vis-à-vis Outcast and Equals and Opposites?

    She seems a bit more Caucasian in the latter two to me or are the graphics/artwork sufficiently ambiguous enough?
     
  11. windu4

    windu4 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 15, 2008
    I've always wondered if Jan Ors was Asian but I've never really had the courage to ask in fear of appearing racist.

    Furthermore, I've been trying to find a way to make a character Asian in a fanfic I'm writing but every time I do it comes off as horribly racist. Any tips on how to fix that? I mean, it's easy to call someone dark-skinned but when you say someone is yellow skinned it just reads awfully.
     
  12. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Light-skinned characters are always hard to nail down, but in Jan's case she's portrayed by an Asian actress so that makes it a pretty safe assumption.

    Windu--we've actually discussed that a handful of times. Best advice I can give you is to search this thread for the word "yellow".
     
  13. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Angela Harry, the actress who played her, is half English half Korean. So she is at least part Asian. :)
     
  14. instantdeath

    instantdeath Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Yeah, I definitely remember Jan being Asian. It would be nice to say there were two Asian main characters in a single work, but one of them was Epicanthix.
     
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  15. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    I am not even sure Yun's actor was of East Asian descent.

    But no thoughts on Jan's subsequent depictions?
     
  16. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004
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  17. windu4

    windu4 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 15, 2008
    Ha. Yeah, I didn't know how a term like "Epicanthix" could be seen as offensive until I was explaining the Epic Tale of Kyle Katarn to an Asian friend of mine and she had a double take when I said it.
     
  18. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
  19. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004

    No, no was for instant, you just posted right at the same time as I did.
     
  20. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    She remained voiced by Angela Harry; I think that settles the matter of intent. Whether they did a crappy job of keeping her appearance consistent is a different question.

    Edit: wait, I could be wrong. Did she do Outcast too? :confused:
     
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  21. kecen

    kecen Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 2005
    I have a habit of assuming every dark-haired human in Star Wars is not White unless proven otherwise.
    Ania Solo included.
     
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  22. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    She was voiced by Vanessa Marshall in Jedi Outcast.
     
  23. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Eh, still looks Asian to me. I could see E&O being a problem if that was her only appearance, but it's hardly the first time an artist has had trouble depicting an Asian woman.

    [​IMG]
     
  24. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Well, that's what I mean by ambiguous.
     
  25. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    I don't get what you're asking. :p