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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit Ignorance is Bias: The Diversity Manifesto

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CooperTFN, Sep 2, 2012.

Page 322 of 677
  1. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004

    And even if they would.... yeah... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threads [face_plain]

    Creators, because they really should know better and I liked Sarah, and have not played the Among the Ruines episode yet, so [face_phbbbbt] @ forced outcome
     
    Gorefiend, Aug 25, 2014
    #8026
  2. TrakNar

    TrakNar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Indeed. If they hated the character so much, why did they create her?
     
    TrakNar, Aug 25, 2014
    #8027
    Gorefiend likes this.
  3. Reveen

    Reveen Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 2012
    [​IMG]

    I mean Jeezus. Is this really the same people who made the first season? I find that hard to believe.
     
    Reveen, Aug 25, 2014
    #8028
    Gorefiend likes this.
  4. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004


    *goess to build an all female units army*
     
    Gorefiend, Aug 25, 2014
    #8029
    Gamiel likes this.
  5. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    "Fight like a woman you roman boy-man!"
     
    Gamiel, Aug 25, 2014
    #8030
    Gorefiend likes this.
  6. TrakNar

    TrakNar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Continuing with the discussion, as I had finally gotten some thoughts in order...

    The thing that the article fails to mention that I've brought up elsewhere is that people are unpredictable. When the world goes straight to hell, even the most well-adjusted non-disabled person can fall apart under great duress. This is not something that is exclusive to disabled people. And in a series that lauds itself for having a "realistic" portrayal of human behavior during a disaster, it apparently forgets that key fact that people are unpredictable. Normal people can fall apart and disabled people can maintain a level head.

    Elsewhere, when I discussed this article, I've gotten responses from a couple people that amount to "in the real world, disabled people are cannon fodder." I found that to be quite appalling. This is an example of the real-life ramifications that such an ableist attitude can have, even if the attitude was originally toward a fictional character.
     
    TrakNar, Aug 25, 2014
    #8031
    Cushing's Admirer, Findswoman , Jedi Ben and 1 other person like this.
  7. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Have you seen the protests and outrage on the forums over it? And not just the excusable "these are fictitious" but also the "these offend me because I am terrible."
     
    GrandAdmiralJello , Aug 25, 2014
    #8032
    Valin__Kenobi likes this.
  8. Point Given

    Point Given Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Strategy gamers are the worst, between Total War and Paradox ones.

    And I say that as a player of both.
     
    Point Given , Aug 25, 2014
    #8033
    Gorefiend likes this.
  9. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    No
    Really?
     
    Gamiel, Aug 25, 2014
    #8034
  10. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004
    If we want to get into that no male Gladiator units in Roman armies either. :p The other female units are actually not that bad history wise, as there is enough accounts of our “Roman Friends” being utterly freaked out when Barbarian woman faced them in battle.


    You know I have so given up on listening to anything people say online about Rome 2 because from the sound of it is not only the worst game ever made, but it also killed their entire family and ate their dog just for the fun, whilst also running off with their girlfriend. [face_dunno]
     
    Gorefiend, Aug 25, 2014
    #8035
  11. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Actually, gladiators were raised on many occasions during civil wars... usually during the imperial period, but also during the convulsions of the late Republic. The thing is that gladiators actually weren't awesome, because they were entertainers who would get smashed by real soldiers every time. They were good at intimidating civilians though. The evidence for gladiatrices is sketchy either way, but the important thing is that there would not have been an all-female group.

    Not that I care -- when I play CK2, I often go for the gender neutral succession laws, as "unrealistic" as they are -- but I can understand why people would be really annoyed by it. My thinking is: if you don't like them, don't... make use of them?

    And I have little issue with barbarians making use of females (and am in fact a little perplexed as to why the Iceni, of all people, can't have female generals or any female units given that their faction symbol is inspired by Boudicca. She's the only reason the faction exists, even though her revolt wouldn't be for centuries later). But again the complaints against all-female units are probably valid on historical grounds, but my thinking is -- again -- if it bothers you, don't use them.

    Oh, I didn't mean the normal whining about Rome 2. I mean people who say that the existence of female units ruins the game for them, and makes them physically ill. Rampant misogyny cloaked in chivalry -- or straight up misogyny, of the sort that say it's unrealistic for any female warrior to beat a male one.

    But while we're on the subject, now that EB2 is out it's hard to see myself ever going back to the superficial (though very pretty) Rome 2 :p
     
    GrandAdmiralJello , Aug 25, 2014
    #8036
    Gorefiend and Vthuil like this.
  12. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    How dare they give players options!
     
    Vthuil, Aug 26, 2014
    #8037
  13. Gorefiend

    Gorefiend Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Yeah they are pretty useless in Rome 2 as well. :p Though I heavily doubt they actually used their “stage weapons and armour” if included in armies, which is more the thing that irks me in Rome 2.


    Yep, always found that really odd as well.
     
    Gorefiend, Aug 26, 2014
    #8038
    Zeta1127 likes this.
  14. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    Break out the chainsaws - we shall render these people as 'one of us', with tourniquets, but without anesthetic!
     
    Jedi Ben, Aug 26, 2014
    #8039
    TrakNar likes this.
  15. Findswoman

    Findswoman Fanfic and Pancakes and Waffles Mod (in Pink) star 5 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2014

    Of course. Because—at least to my understanding—whether one falls apart easily or maintains a level head easily is not about someone's function of mental ability or neurological condition, it's about personality type, plain and simple.* Disabled people as well as nondisabled people come in all personality types. To say that all mentally disabled people fall apart under stress is just as unfair a blanket statement as saying that all women (for example) fall apart under stress.

    I'm no expert on these matters, but this at least this is how it seems to me ("...said Booker T.").

    *And please let's not get into the whole thorny issue of whether things like personality type are 100% neurologically determined—there's probably some thread about that in JCC. I have every confidence that you all know what I mean here.
     
    Findswoman , Aug 26, 2014
    #8040
    Gorefiend, Jedi Ben, Zorrixor and 2 others like this.
  16. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    Funny thing: the classic swedish wild west RPG Western is coming out in its fourth edition and is right now on the last days of its crowdfunding and one of the books they will publish is Dakota & Deadwood (sorry about the small size)
    [​IMG]

    so maybe I will find out what Deadwood is. Even if the book I have paid for is the third core rolebook: Amerika 1876
    [​IMG]



    And just because I like the art, the covers to the first two core rulebooks
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Gamiel, Sep 1, 2014
    #8041
  17. moonjump05

    moonjump05 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2013
    ^It kinda amazes me that stuff based in the American wild west could be popular across the world:)
     
    moonjump05, Sep 1, 2014
    #8042
  18. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    To my understanding so are, or at least was, wild west stories rather big in Sweden. I don't know how it is in the rest of the world, but I know that both the Italians and Czechs have made their own western movies and there are some Franco-Belgian wild west comics.

    EDIT: Some characters sample from some of the already published adventures, CooperTFN how is the representation?
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    art from http://lukasthelin.blogspot.se/
     
    Gamiel, Sep 1, 2014
    #8043
    Valin__Kenobi and MistrX like this.
  19. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    Hmpf. Deadlands is cooler.
     
    blackmyron, Sep 1, 2014
    #8044
  20. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    Maybe, but one of Western's strength is how historically realistic it is.
     
    Gamiel, Sep 1, 2014
    #8045
  21. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    Mostly it's a personal preference, but I find those to be the least interesting - like playing Gangbusters* instead of Call of Cthulhu.

    *(For those of you that aren't old and don't have knowledge of early RPGs, Gangbusters was a 1920s RPG that is exactly what you think it is based on the name alone)
     
    blackmyron, Sep 1, 2014
    #8046
  22. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    I can understand that but with so many "fantastic" RPG it is nice with one who try to be realistic, even if they give the opportunity to introduce the supernatural. And after all many of the PC are going to believe in something supernatural, and you can also play one who deals with it:
    [​IMG]
     
    Gamiel, Sep 1, 2014
    #8047
  23. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    That is rather similar to Deadlands, at least.

    But no Hucksters, I note - or more importantly, mad scientists. I can't play a Wild West game without mad scientists. :p
     
    blackmyron, Sep 1, 2014
    #8048
  24. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Pretty art. Diversity Score: 30
     
    CooperTFN, Sep 1, 2014
    #8049
  25. Gamiel

    Gamiel Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    Thanks
     
    Gamiel, Sep 1, 2014
    #8050
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