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Lit Ignorance is Bias: The Diversity Manifesto

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CooperTFN, Sep 2, 2012.

  1. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    In that case Zeta, I expect you'd find it quite cozy in there.
     
  2. Esg

    Esg Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    I have aplenty of problems with Traviss on her own but that's not even a blip on my radar personally
     
  3. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

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    Sep 2, 2012
    I just don't see the need for such characters, but I have so many other problems with LotF that such things probably shouldn't even matter.
     
    thesevegetables likes this.
  4. Esg

    Esg Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Eh SW has interspecies romances all the time. (Points at Hobbie and Jenson macking on Bothan dames in Requiem for a Rogue)

    So homosexual relationships are hardly out of the realm of normalcy
     
  5. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    I use fiction to get away from that stuff, so I am simply annoyed with it showing up in my escape,
     
  6. Esg

    Esg Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    SW has black people. Do black people do that too? This is a slippery slope of reasoning

    I mean does it really break your suspension of disbelief when this is a universe where dudes can have Rodian Mistresses?
     
  7. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Let's just drop this, because I have more important things to worry about, like the direction the universe is being taken.
     
  8. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Zeta, how many gay people do you encounter in your everyday life that you need fiction to escape from them? Do they just kind of walk by, or are they, like, hurling themselves at you?
     
    theraphos and Contessa like this.
  9. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Its escaping the issues not the people.
     
  10. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Their existence is not an "issue". They are demonstrably there, whether one agrees with their sexuality or not.
     
    Contessa and Rilwen_Shadowflame like this.
  11. Zeta1127

    Zeta1127 Jedi Master star 5

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Let's just drop this, because I am probably being an idiot.
     
  12. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    You and I don't have to have this conversation, but this is the diversity thread - it's kind of why we're here. [face_peace]
     
    Zeta1127 likes this.
  13. Point Given

    Point Given Mod of Literature and Community star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Why are you even in this thread then?
     
    Contessa likes this.
  14. CeiranHarmony

    CeiranHarmony Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2004
    just returned from cinema... Cloud Atlas is really stunning awesome and when I found words to describe what I think right now.. this discussion is spammed by me.

    besides: now I wish for the Wachowskis doing the Sequels!
     
    CooperTFN likes this.
  15. Rilwen_Shadowflame

    Rilwen_Shadowflame Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 27, 2005
    Yes. Besides, that is essentially saying only straight people are allowed to have escapism. (And only straight people who don't like gay people, at that.)
    What if I want my escapist literature to be a place I can escape to where homosexuality is so normal and accepted nobody blinks twice at it? What if a gay person wants escapist literature they could imagine themself in, literature that doesn't tell them 'sorry, your existence is too inconvenient for our other readers to accept'?
     
    Contessa, JediFreac and Mia Mesharad like this.
  16. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    But we can also point at many white authors who have given us numerous black characters, many of them prominate in the books they appeared in. Say characters like Nick Rostu, Hallena Devis or Belindi Kalenda. Ostrander & JJM are also really good at showing diversity in their works.

    Not that having a more diverse stable of authors wouldn't help, chances are it probably would on some level.

    Kinda secondary to this conversation but I'm wondering if anyone(well I guess besides me) here went back and read A Practical Man after we learned of Goran and Medrit's relationship in Revelation?

    I bring this up because of how Beviin is portrayed in A Practical Man. It could be pretty easily argued that in the short story Goran is the main character, even more prominate than Fett or Nom Anor. When people first read this story they would have had no idea that Medrit, who gets mentioned, wasn't a woman.

    It might only be a 60 page short story, but I think its also the first example we have of a Star Wars story with a lead character that is gay.
     
  17. CeiranHarmony

    CeiranHarmony Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2004
    okay after a good nights sleep I am still speechless due to Cloud Atlas...someone kickstart my brain please cause I can't decide what to comment on first
     
  18. LarryG

    LarryG Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    For every SW novel & comic out there, there are a thousand romance novels & smut magazines. So if sexual jollies is your priority, why not buy one of those? I'd rather keep SW above the waistline.
     
  19. Esg

    Esg Jedi Knight star 4

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Having a character who is gay =/= Gay sex
     
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  20. LarryG

    LarryG Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    If sex is not being mentioned in a novel, then why would sexuality need to be mentioned unless it is political-correctness point scoring?
     
  21. CeiranHarmony

    CeiranHarmony Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2004
    new official out of universe book just released: Star Wars and History, just got it from amazon and it has a lot to say about real world history and SW, not just american but world history of many countries.

    I bet some diversity stuff in there too ;) written by multiple History professors and other academics.

    lots of great new insights in the book, among them too the paralells of Slave Leia to sex slavery, as well as paralells about uprisings, rebels, dictators, Trade Federation and East India Trading Company and lots of other things. also useful to chart historic paralells for the Sequels.. great book so far. and not shy of drawing paralells that others would shrug back from in a book.
     
  22. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    You're right. It's not like children's movies have romance in them or anything.











    ...oh wait.
     
  23. Esg

    Esg Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Newsflash: You can show a homosexual romance or relationship without sex fool
     
  24. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Esg, calling people fools, no matter how unfortunate their views are, isn't helping anything.

    Larry - what Esg said.
     
  25. LarryG

    LarryG Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Calling my view unfortunate isn't helping anything either.

    If anyone actually read my post, I was referring to all mentions of all sexuallity.