I'm On A Mission

Discussion in 'Fan Fiction and Writing Resource' started by Amidelta, Aug 11, 2001.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Moderators: Briannakin, mavjade
  1. Amidelta Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 8, 2001
    star 2
    Hi. I'm a denizen of the movie boards, but now I'm on a mission to the fanfic regions. What do I need to do to get started over here? I'm trying to get over my unworthiness to play around with someone else's work, so it's going to take time to get comfortable.

    The main reason I'm here is to ask a question, one I don't think starwars.com will answer for me.

    *deep breath*

    Is there anything in the Jedi Code that forbids a Jedi to marry? Or fall in love? Or anything along those lines? I'm talking about in the time period before the Empire rose. Silly question, but this is bothering me.

    Can anybody help me?

  2. Orion_Star Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 10, 2001
    star 2
    Specifically speaking, no, there's not. Personally, I don't think there are any prohibitions on marriage/ love within the Jedi Code. The only possible aruging point would be the phrase that says, "there is no emotion, there is peace." One could debate whether or not this excludes love because it is an emotion.

    Anyway, as far as fitting in on the fanfic boards, just make your presence known and be nice. Bribery never hurts either ;) ;), nudge nudge...

    Besides that, don't just lurk in a story, post something, even if it's, "Nice post", let the writer know you care and they'll probably stop by your posts and say something.

    That's all. Later, and welcome!
  3. Julie Moderator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 1, 1998
    star 5
    There was a big debate about Jedi marriage on a mailing list I'm on last winter. Hopefully I can set your mind at ease, most of the writers here feel that Jedi can marry. First, no marriage/no children just makes no logical sense. It would make the Jedi sound like baby-snatchers. I've noticed that those who feel that Jedi shouldn't marry usually say so because they hate the opposite extreme - Jedi required to produce children.

    I feel that neither extreme would happen. The Jedi tend to follow the will of the Force and I can't see them sensing from the Force a feeling that they never/must love another person or never/must have children.

    The Jedi take Force sensitive kids as infants. If love/marriage/children were forbidden, then these kids never, ever get a choice. That's cruel and sounds far too much like the dark side to me.

    I've also heard people argue that 'Jedi don't have time to raise kids or have a spouse - they must serve the Force and save the galaxy'. By that logic then Jedi shouldn't have padawans either. Take a young teenager into a possibly hostile situation? No way! They should be trained by those unable to go on missions until they are fully grown and have finished learning all the skills one needs as a Knight. - See how silly that sounds?

    Not everyone would be an actively-policing-the-galaxy-Knight. Everyone has different skills and it would be bizarre if someone extremely gifted in healing, or completely lacked fighting skills despite Force-enhancement, etc. was denied Knighthood. Some Jedi go out like Qui-gon and Obi-wan, but I feel certain that there are those who work permanently on Coruscant or on other worlds and could easily balance work and family. Look at our own world's military - they manage it most of the time.

    I expect the Force would clue a Jedi in if marriage/or kids just wasn't for him/her. It seems nasty to forbid it completely.

    Another thing I've heard is "the spouse or the children of the Jedi could be used as bait to lure a Jedi off by themselves and then destroy them." If they knew. I highly doubt that there is a complete directory of the Jedi's names outside of the Jedi Temple. I wouldn't expect it to be public knowledge or for even the Republic to find the names of a Jedi's family at all.

    I can't count on what Lucas will decide, he will do whatever fits the way he wants the plot to be. So, if by some chance we get told in the next two films that Jedi don't marry or have kids, then I'd say that is another sign that the Jedi Order has become stagnant and that it is falling apart like the Republic is around them. And those who follow the EU books know that Luke changed many rules for the New Jedi... :)

    As for getting around the board, we don't have much in the way of rules (we rarely need them). Read a lot of the threads here on the Resource board to get an idea of how things tend to be. If you like a story you read, please take a few seconds to reply. Writers really really appreciate it! :D And try writing sometime, even if you don't think its good, no one will flame you. We all do our best not to discourage each other. :)

    (takes deep breath and looks at post, goodness this is ridiculously long, ;) )
  4. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    Well, about the Jedi celibacy issue... there's no canon on the subject. Personally, I think they are a celibate order, and I think that's going to be an issue in the next couple of films (it's going to have to be addressed, at any rate, one way or another, in Episode 2). I think that the priestly associations are deliberate.

    But since you're also asking about the fanfic community, here's the great secret: Until something is definitely committed to film, it's entirely up to you. If you want a celibacy rule, use it. If you don't, don't. At least until Uncle George says otherwise, you can handle it in whatever way you need to.

    EDIT: And if Uncle George *does* decide to go a different way, you just shrug and say, "Oh, it's an alternate universe." :)
  5. SiriGallia Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2001
    star 4
    I'd say that first, no one I know of has ever said that, but I don't know. I think that it is okay.

    Secondly you can write whatever you want! No one's going to get on you case, right guys? ;)

    Thirdly, if you really want to know what people think read some like Family Snapshots by Sarah_K or the Letters by Jedi_Arwen, you'll find out what most people THINK that way! Anyway I hope you get used to doin' it, I'm sure you'll get lots of encouragement :)

    --SiriGallia
  6. Herman Snerd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 1999
    star 6
    Listen to JG.

    The AU loophole is a fanfic writer's greatest friend. :)
  7. Melyanna Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 2001
    star 4
    I've heard that celibacy was strongly encouraged, though not required. After all, we do know that Corran Horn's grandfather was married. (Otherwise we wouldn't have Corran Horn.)

    As for "breaking in", Orion_Star is right. Don't lurk. Drop by occasionally and tell the authors that you like what they're doing. Lots of times they'll read your stuff if they know you're reading theirs. And it's always good to return the favor when people start reading your stuff.

    Also, put links and short descriptions of your stuff (or a quote, like what I have) in your signature. I've gotten hooked on several stories that way.
  8. Amidelta Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 8, 2001
    star 2
    Thanks for your help, everyone.

    I'm interested in fan stories that take place before TPM (Obi-Wan in his late teens to early 20's). Can anyone point me to some?
  9. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    Well, look for anything that's specified as JA in the subject line -- that's the abbreviation for Jedi Apprentice, and will be in the era you're looking for. Jane Jinn has one at the archive called "Jedi, Go Home," that I think is very good. And heck, Quiller has one there called "Defy Not" that's even further back, with Qui-Gon as Yoda's padawan.
  10. Julie Moderator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 1, 1998
    star 5
    The TFN Archive is a great place to start. You can also use your browser's search function to find JA in the Master New Story Index. There are many stories about Obi-wan before TPM. It is rather popular. ;)
  11. Renton Kenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2000
    star 4
  12. Anakin's Angel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 3, 2000
    star 4

    Gah..ever know what you want to say, just not how to word it?

    Here goes.

    If Lucas uses the Jedi are not allowed to be married EVER! plotline, I do hope it's for another reason other than to speed up Anakin's fall. I mean, if that's the only reason, it seems rather...er...forced. I know writers sometimes bend the rules to fit around their mental plotline (Lucas included, since this is his baby), but still..

    There will be enough reasons for Anakin to fall, it seems...but having the fact that he can't marry Padme become one of those reasons...?

    Feh.

    aa :)
  13. greencat336 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2001
    star 5
    Here's my two cents on the Jedi marriage debate:

    I don't think there is any rule against Jedi marrying. In the comics Ki-mundi (sp?) has several wives and he's on the Jedi council. It would be extremely difficult to be the spouse of a Jedi, though. If the Jedi one was married to was a field operative, that Jedi would be gone for months at a time. Most missions would also have the possibility of the Jedi dying. I think that whoever compared it to military spouses has the right idea. Yes, some military personnel never get anywhere near combat, and may be stationed in one place for a long time. Others move constantly and are sent into dangerous situation.

    There is also the issue of children. I think that there would be a high expectation that any Force sensitive children born from a Jedi marriage would be given to the Temple to raise. This might not be a problem between a marriage of two Jedi, but with a Jedi/nonJedi match, it could become an issue.

    Of course, all this is just speculation until Uncle George lets us know what he thinks. And if we don't like it, AU lets us get our way. :)
  14. Amidelta Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 8, 2001
    star 2
    Never mind. I just had an anxiety attack over the AOTC teaser poster and now I'm over it. If it's not a fake, I'm still not very happy about it.


    ~Amidelta~
  15. Jedi Girl of Corellia Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2000
    star 6
    I read somewhere, I am pretty sure the Offical site, that Padawan Learners are not allowed to marry. This makes sense, AND allows GL to progress Anakin's fall under the plot line that he can't marry Padme. By not allowing Padawan's to have such a serious relationship they can concentrate on become official knights, and keeping the bond with their Master strong. If another strong relationship entered the situation, this could weaken the relationship between Padawan and Master, a potentially bad thing. For example, take Qui-gon, when he found Anakin he began to develop a bond with the boy, even offering to become his Master(a type of marriage almost). This weakened(at least in my opinion) the relationship between he and Obi-wan.

    Does any of this make sense? I have a habit of talking nonsense. :D
  16. Jedi Girl of Corellia Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2000
    star 6
    I read somewhere, I am pretty sure the Offical site, that Padawan Learners are not allowed to marry. This makes sense, AND allows GL to progress Anakin's fall under the plot line that he can't marry Padme. By not allowing Padawan's to have such a serious relationship they can concentrate on become official knights, and keeping the bond with their Master strong. If another strong relationship entered the situation, this could weaken the relationship between Padawan and Master, a potentially bad thing. For example, take Qui-gon, when he found Anakin he began to develop a bond with the boy, even offering to become his Master(a type of marriage almost). This weakened(at least in my opinion) the relationship between he and Obi-wan.

    Does any of this make sense? I have a habit of talking nonsense. :D
  17. sabrelight Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 21, 2000
    star 4
    I think Jedi Knights can marry other jedi, because then they can carry out their commitments to the order, which always comes first. But marriage outside the order would require more commitment from Jedi.
  18. Mistress_Renata Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2000
    star 4
    Yup. I'm with Sabrelight and Greencat on this one. I think that many Jedi may CHOOSE to be celibate, because it's just not practical. I would guess that for a number of reasons, they would also pair up only within the order.

    The point of Padawans not being allowed to marry makes sense. There were rules in the US military (years ago) forbidding newly-enlisted personnel and military cadets to marry, for the same reason: 1) too young and 2) need to be able to stay focussed to finish the training.

    Write a Jedi marriage if you want Amidelta, WE aren't fussy.

    Another recommendation: get involved in writing a round-robin. You meet other writers that way, get to know their style, and they get to know yours.

    Good luck!
  19. Casper_Knightshade Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 6
    These has actually been something of an ongoing exploration, Amidelta, far longer than anyone really thinks. The great thing of course mentioned earlier about fanfiction is that you can bend the rules of the Jedi code just a little to accompany certain plot lines. And let's face; in TPM, the Code was BENT ALOT!

    But here is my take on the whole situation. Not just the marriage situation, which I will get to later.

    Analysizing what we do know:

    The phrase 'A Jedi's life is a hard life' can be a very true one. Given that a Jedi Knight is constantly challenged in the everyday obstitcles that he or she faces, meaning their beliefs in the Code being tested, it is reasonable to assume that the Jedi religion is the ultimate church/monastary housing religion you can ever think of. According to TPM novel, potential Jedi are identified at with 6 months of their birth; this means these children at around 6 months of age are thrusted right into the religion before they are even done with breast feeding.

    Why? Answer: if you believe in the 'Peer Psychology Theory', one who grows up with a group of individuals that think alike will rub off them. You can view this point like a infaint growing up in a family that attends church regularly on Sundays; it becomes a habit. Now with that said there can be outside influences that may sway such a mind, but what's the one phrase you hear alot in that situation: FOLLOW THE WORD OF GOD. Here, in SW, it's follow the Jedi Code. LIke it or not, those Jedi Knights know that they cannot purge their natural emotions, so they adopt a logic way of thinking and heed by it. More or less, a Jedi is taught no to be guided by their instinct drive; i.e. be territorial, act on impulse, etc.

    Now with that all said, and knowing that outside influences in one way or another can affect someone's thinking and emotional states that is where marriage, or even a relationship, may cause a bit of flux in the thinking regardless if one 'dates or marries within the same church' so to speak(I can't think of that other c word at the moment.)

    Back to marriage in a minute, but here is another related subject: JEDI POPULATION NUMBERS. According to TPM, there are 10,000 Jedi Knights.

    Eh?

    Only 10,000, in an religious organization that has been in existence for over 20,000 years?

    AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, this is where things can get very interesting, and here is some of my theories.

    1.) High Midichlorian births- They must be rare if the Jedi Population is that low, especially in a galaxy that is connected by hyperspace travel; remember, here on Earth there is over 5 billion people. In the Core Worlds alone, and Coruscant in particular, one could safely assume they have that much, Coruscant possible even 10 times, or even 100 times more. The odds, you would think, would be too good for Jedi births. But their population numbers suggest otherwise.

    And if you think about it that would make Anakin's children, Luke and Leia, and Leia's children, Jacen, Jaina and Anakin, that much more unique and special.

    ---OR---

    The mortality rate of Jedi Knights is ssssssssssoooooooooooo bad that there is such a high turnover.

    2.) The Jedi's Life Theory- This goes back to the top, but includes the fact that perhaps a Jedi Knight is dedicated and devoted to peace in the galaxy. If so,

    a.) He or she may not have time to get married or explore a relationship.

    b.) Those dedicated to such pursuits may indeed take vows of celebacy in order to have clear minds in regards to emotions or not have connections to family outlets.

    There are folks in real life with such dedications where they do not seek relationships.

    There is so much more I can show, but I won't tie up the thread. But perhaps one more thing everyone should consider. Say that a Jedi can indeed marry.

    But what if, and this is a big if, in the case of Anakin starting so late in his Jedi Career, that the Council is forbidding him from marrying. :eek:. Such relationships in a young man's life where much of it was spent being a slave may be hazardous to w
  20. Amidelta Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 8, 2001
    star 2
    I don't know why I'm so concerned about this. I could just write what I want to write and call it AU if AOTC & Ep. 3 say something different. Some part of me still dreams about writing a sanctioned SW novel, I guess, and I want to do it by the book.

    But realistically, that's not going to happen. My characters and situations can only exist in the world of fan fiction. If I'm going to stray into AU, I want a good reason to do that, and I want to make it believable in the story. If I say "yes, that's odd, but...", I want the "but" to make sense.

    Anyone understand what I'm saying?


    ~Amidelta~
  21. Gandalf the Grey Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2000
    star 6
    The official teaser poster is up.

    [image=http://www.starwars.com/episode-ii/news/2001/11/img/banner_bg.jpg]

    This looks to confirm it: Love is forbidden to the Jedi in the prequel Order.


    How does the code go? ?There is no emotion, there is the Force.? The Old Jedi cut themselves off from emotion and the guidance of the Force, trying to standardize and formalize something intensely personal. The Dark Side needs hate to grow, but the Light Side needs love.

    I think that Vader/Anakin restored the balance not just by destroying the Sith, but by purging out everything that was wrong in the old Order.
Moderators: Briannakin, mavjade
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.