Tucson I'm outta here

Discussion in 'SouthWest Region Discussion' started by thatsMISTERwookiee, Sep 10, 2007.

Moderators: DieWompRatDie, Grimby
  1. thatsMISTERwookiee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2005
    star 4
    I quit. This has absolutely NOTHING to do with what you wrote, Mike, so don't freak out and go "guilt-trip" on everybody.

    I joined this group because of the costuming and the charity work. While I have enjoyed the company of most of you, THAT REMAINS THE MAIN REASON that I stayed with the group. Last year we did a lot of charity events. This year, Komen, Flowing Wells band, and the food drive at Phil's. Three events in eight months. Last year we had two or three months where we had three events. While the "anti-costuming debates"(for LACK of a better term) that occurred this summer had some influence on the TIMING of my decision, I had already informed a few people that I was leaving the group. I was planning on hanging around until the December meeting, but why?(PLEASE NOTE: this is a rhetorical question. I do not want to read or hear any reasons for staying any longer. Thank you)

    Last year the group focused more on charity work. This year, the group's direction has been more toward gaming. Will this direction help the group, or will it hurt the group? I do not know, I am no seer. What I do know is this direction is not the path I wish to follow.

    This is not like I am going to disappear from the face of the earth. I may still post on occasion, and I will probably be showing up at costumed events, but I won't be a group member anymore.

    Congratulations, K-Kat, it looks like the wookiee DIDN'T WIN :D . Or maybe I have, I'm free...
  2. firstsonofsolo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2006
    star 4
    Although I have known this was coming for quite some time it saddens me to see it. Jack you will always be a member of the TFF wether active or inactive. Your help and service has been greatly appreciated and we are all in your debt. I know that I can not sway your mind (as I already have tried) but you are welcome to join us wherever we are.
  3. Mugen Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 7, 2005
    star 4
    Wook! You have been a loyal and honorable friend and valued member. I find myself within the same delemma, and an support you no matter what you do, because I too understand youre position.

    Love you bro, and see you at DSG events!
  4. cathiecat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 24, 2005
    star 4
    You will be dearly missed. I can't imagine a TFF without you. :(
  5. _Anakin_Vader_ Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2005
    star 3
    I sure hope so. I have had too many people quit things because of me, from work to school. I am really sorry to hear that you are leaving. I always thought of you as one of the core members that made it all go 'round. The 'power behind the throne' as you put it. I will defenitely miss you. I'm sorry. You couldn't have a more noble cause for leaving, though. The group has definitely shifted, for better or for worse, from more charity events to events for the fans. It's too bad you never got into those other parts of the group. It would have been fun to have a Wookiee in the RPG.
  6. RebelMom Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2000
    star 6
    I'm sorry to hear you are leaving. You will be missed.

  7. hal9k1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2003
    star 4
    What exactly is "more noble cause?" He went out of his way to take his own time and money to help the community in need... ...that's not noble? He just didn't want to do functions that didn't involve helping others. His cause is his own, we should respect it. I don't see how defaming his decision is helping the situation.
    Group has shifted....Events for the fans?
    The "non charity" events have NOTHING to do with the costumers or said events. We (costumers) very quickly got our act together and did what we set out to do. If it took 2 years to get the non charity Fan Force stuff together to happen that has nothing to do with what others in the group did or didn't do. If a charity even was going to happen, that was the discussion at the time. Minis and Book Club didn?t exist so it was not discussed at the time. RPG as always been brought up at meetings but unless you are doing it explanation was not really necessary, if you were doing it you knew what was going on.

    I really don?t see your point in posting this...it seems to be placing blame on a section of people within the group that has always been among it?s strongest supporters.
    Personally, to me, it seems to clarify Jacks action.
  8. _Anakin_Vader_ Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2005
    star 3
    For the first part, I think you read it wrong. What I said is that because he is leaving mainly because we are not doing charity work, I admire him for that. He was in this 100% for charity (from what I can tell). I was definitely NOT defaming him. I was doing exactly the opposite.

    As for the second part, I was just pointing out exactly that the majority of what we now do is RPG, Minis, and Book Club, or whatever other non-charity thing. Now we do mostly that... events for the fans (meaning get-togethers that are more for us, about SW, etc.)... it has shifted. But obviously charity is still a big part of it. It hasn't decreased much, but the other things have increased. the PERCENTAGE of how much we do charity has therefore decreased a significant amount.

    In no way was my previous post meant to come across as disrespecting or flaming anything or anybody. I posted that because I was trying to back up what he was saying. But hey, I am the Master of Miscommunications. That is my curse.
  9. cathiecat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 24, 2005
    star 4
    I do want to note one thing.. I don't view that this group has shifted at all.. it has just grown.. and that was exactly what was always expected of it. It was always supposed to include all these extra things that just took longer to get off the ground. We knew the group grow and take off in many directions.. or at least I certainly hoped it would. The group will still do its costuming events and charity events, it just so happens that now the group also does other things as well that like I said.. just took a bit longer to get off the ground.

    I respect Jack's decision and I will miss him terribly though he has said he will most likely still attend costume events.. so with any luck I will get plenty of chances to see him.. I just wish we had more in the group to offer him so that he would want to stay. I had hoped to bring in model building and figure painting which I knew was one of the things that Jack enjoyed doing in the hopes that that would broaden the group out a bit more to include more things than just costuming to hold onto the people in the group that mainly enjoy costuming, that and more of the prop building and sewing sessions as well.. those type of things I felt could have given a chance for the members of the group that enjoyed costuming and planning charity functions to find enjoyment in fun get together type settings.

    As for the Charity, I think that there will always be charities we will get involved in.. so far this year we have done Komen, two flowing Wells events (did we include a drive of some sort with this.. I thought we wound up not doing it though we had wanted to, but I may be mistaken), the food drive at Galactic Empire.. plus we had decided as a group to not overlap events with the DSG having their three events which were the PF Chang event, the MS walk, and the little boys Lukemia event. So that is seven events so far this year. We also decided as a group that summer was just too hot for having a lot of charity events outdoors. There is still fall, and winter and who knows what will happen with that.. we already know we have the DSG MS walk set up for fall and the hospital visits as well, it is only a matter of someone bringing up a cause they want to hold an event for, the group agreeing to do it and then planning it and making it happen in order for it to take place.
  10. hal9k1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2003
    star 4
    OK, sorry. I must have misinturperated your post.
    I read it fast (I could have read it wrong) and posted fast before I went to work. I'll take blame for that miscommunication then.
  11. KickingnScreaming Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 26, 2006
    star 1
    I totally understand and support your reasoning to quit the group. Mike's statement about "things for the fans" that are non-charity is typical of the type of anti-costuming feeling I get from some of the group members these days. Like costuming/charity events are NOT for FANS.

    Although I have not been with the group nearly as long as you..I too am quitting the group. I will no longer attend monthly meetings or be monitoring the boards. I am working on both my Rebel Legion and 501st approval and should have at least one costume approved by the Light Parade.

    I will be attending the costumed events to help, but I can no longer continue to be a part of the "daily grind" so-to-speak. Some members of this group are way too volatile for me to be able to keep my life as drama-free as possible. See ya!
  12. dialswiftjustice Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 4
    I understand big guy, and you'll be missed. I also undertand and am inthe same place. Im just not into the rest of the stuff, as well. I spoke to you over the phone, so theres no need to go on and on here, other than to say, the TFF has lost one of its core members, with one of the biggest hearts, and we will never be the same.


  13. thatsMISTERwookiee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2005
    star 4
    I love history. I love the historical accuracy that makes events come alive for me.
    However, when facts and reality are distorted and twisted to mislead posterity, I feel the obligation to correct any abberations and make sure that the truth is represented to the public.
  14. _Anakin_Vader_ Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2005
    star 3
    Just FYI all, I'm most definitely NOT anti-costuming.

    And sorry for being too volatile.
  15. hal9k1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2003
    star 4
    I'm not "fanning the fire" but I thought I'd post what I have as Events the TFF "officially" did in costume (so far) in 2007

    6.30.07 Galactic Empire Food Drive
    5.24.07 USPS Tucson Stamp Premier
    4.15.07 Koman Race for the Cure
    3.28.07/5.9.07 Flowing Wells Star Wars Concert
    1.3.07 Make a Wish TFF and the PFF



  16. JediObiKat Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2006
    star 3
    Not much to congratulate me on there, Jack...you know that's not what I meant by my quote. I enjoyed having you in the group and I have to say I never saw this coming. We hate to lose you, but as you say, you are free to do what you want.
  17. Jedi_Dajuan Admin: FanForce and Games

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    Dec 30, 2002
    star 6
    Ok, one thing I am noticing here is people keep assuming the worst about what's being said. _A_V_ didn't mean anything negative by his comment, and I'm sure cathiecat didn't mean to imply that the TFF set up the event, rather that it was an event the TFF is attending. So if something can be taken in a negative way or not negative way, please assume the other meant it in a non negative way.

    That being said, sometimes group dynamics change. It sucks to lose members over over things like that, but sometimes it can't be helped. More later, at work.
  18. dialswiftjustice Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 4
    Even I thought the heartfelt goodbye was a thinly veiled jab, but now that its been clarified (or back-pedaled whichever way you want to see it) I see that it was just not thought out well before posted.

    the great thing about the fan force is this. Its a growing entity constantly in flux, and as such has the potential to become the premier SW fan club in the state. Our first year we sought out costumed based charity events because we were so successful at them. We also had alot of SW releated events just come to us (the not 2B toyed with premier, etc). This year we did not make an active attempt to seek out costumed events and charities as many of us were dividing our time between the 501st, home, school, work etc, so it just didnt happen as much. But who knows? If the costmers havn't all together abandonded the fan force, next year we could be in demand again. But now I feel we have the potential to became that premier SW fan club because of the diversity of the inerests (minis,costuming,rpg,book club). Now more than ever we truly appeal to the widest range of SW fan out there. We just need to let them know we're here for them. So I hope the upcoming events aren't looked at as stricly costumed events. We are promoting the club, and could use as many members dedicated to reaching out to the public to come.
  19. thatsMISTERwookiee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2005
    star 4
  20. hal9k1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2003
    star 4
    I was not sure about the Make a wish event, I think U R right about it being in '06
  21. thatsMISTERwookiee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2005
    star 4

    What is truly pathetic, disgusting, and disturbing, Mike, Michelle, and everybody else in the group, is that ANYONE should have to publicly declare what their allegience is in regards to costuming. Has it really come down to this level?

    Where did this poison come from? It was not present in the group BEFORE Celebration 4. Did costume events tend to dominate what we did as a group? Probably, we were trying to build up membership, and getting noticed in the community was an obvious way to do that. Even our PREVIOUS Chapter Rep wanted to promote the group by participating in events. Would the zoo want us back, year after year, if all we did was show up in t-shirts? Would Channel 13 have put Dustin on the news in Nov. '05 if all we were wearing were "civvies"? Would the Band Director at Flowing Wells have wanted us for even a single night if all we were wearing were STAR WARS shirts? EVERY COSTUME EVENT that we have done, whether tied to a charity or not, has ALWAYS had PROMOTING THE TFF tied in with it. There were times when it seemed like we had too many events going on, but we did it to help promote the group.

    Then came C4, and suddenly, attitudes changed. It didn't help matters that the TFF scrapbook was alternately used as an example of an active FanForce and then used as an example of what FanForces SHOULDN'T BE DOING (too much "costuming"). To anyone outside the TFF that might wish to deny this, this was witnessed by more than one member of the TFF. At least one person came back from C4 believing that what we had done in the past was wrong. A charge was leveled at the "costumers" that they were dominating the group and not letting other interests flourish within the group. As near as I have ever been able to find out from this ivdividual, this accusation was unfounded. Yet for some reason it stuck, and now, some three months later, the "costumers" feel like pariahs, that every little thing they do that involves costuming has to have a built-in apology for those that don't "costume".

    It would be nice if there was some leadership from the FanForce leadership that could help quell and rid this group and others of this poison. But, apparantly, the poison seems to be coming from some of the FanForce leaders themselves.

    Why should the costumers have to apologise for anything? Are the Minis players going to apologise if someone thinks the group plays Minis too often? Will the Book Club have to cut back on the number of books they read if someone thinks they're reading too much and too many books? We need to rid ourselves of this poison that was pushed on us from outside forces. So what if we like doing a lot of costumed events? As long as other interests within the group are not denied in favor of costuming, or in favor of ANY OTHER INTERESTS, then it is nobody's business what we do, so long as the FanForce guidelines are followed. If all a group wants to do is costume, then that is their right. If all a group wants to do is play chess with a STAR WARS chess set, then that is their right, also. NOBODY SHOULD BE FORCED TO PARTICIPATE IN SOMETHING THEY HAVE NO INTEREST IN. That is why this group has different interests. If I, for example, have no interest in Minis, I should be able to attend other functions and not have anyone tell me I should show up to a Minis game anyway.

    I think it is time that the "Jedi" in charge of the FanForce start acting like Jedi and stop acting like Sith.

    Anyways, them's my thoughts...
  22. Mugen Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 7, 2005
    star 4
    Whats wrong with acting like SITH??? :mad: :p
  23. dialswiftjustice Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 4
    I cant vouch for the FF higher ups. But I will say this. Since there are new officers, and a new TFF CR, the non costuming activities have increased, and the costume events show no signs of ceasing to exist. The TFF is becoming Tucsons Ultimate Fan Club because of the new regime that is NOT anti-costuming ,or anti-anything fan related for that matter. Frankly if you are a costumer or not, I think now is the ebst time to join the TFF, there is a little something for everyone.
  24. firstsonofsolo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2006
    star 4
    I see alot of different angles and understand where everyone is coming from. Yes it seems that the higher ups would rather not have any fan force do costuming but rather have us join either legion. Yes there have been complaints in our own ranks about costuming or too many costuming events. I sometimes regret sharing things that may cause this but I feel that none of us should be kept in the dark.

    Some of the events we do as the TFF are flown under the 501st banner for ease and the 501st Tucson squad is litterally weeks away from reality. The TFF is quickly becoming recognized and people want us at their businesses or events mostly due to costuming. We have made an impact on Tucson that no other fan club can touch. We are experiencing major growing pains here but some of it is due to the fact of poor communication. Sometimes it feels like the costumers are outcasts, yes I have felt this way before myself. The non costumed or less active costumed feel the same. What I believe the differenece is communication and the fact that neither side knows really truly how the other feels.

    Jack is absolutely correct in saying that our exposure has come from costuming in the community. What we offer is far beyond that and that is how we keep growing. I personally feel that we have not done enough charity events this year as the TFF but then again we are getting into our busy season and we had a huge event being C4 that although it was not a TFF event it was a major impact on us this year.

    Now I am not saying that all of our exposure has come from costuming but look who we have because of it.

    I am going to share a personal experience that may help others now how I feel.

    I was asked multiple times by a good friend to come hang out at Cats house or to come to a meeting. I kept telling myself it was a bunch of geeks with really bad BO sitting around talking about Star Wars which was not my idea of a good time. Then after constant asking from my friend he told me that I could probably sell all my toys to these people (cha-ching!).

    So I loaded up my car with some stuff and headed down to a meeting. Sitting there looking at all these diverse people gathered around I instantly felt welcomed and like my opinion actually mattered. Then there was talk of all this charity work and visiting sick kids in hospitals, doing food drives for the needy and walking in the march of dimes. Get this these freaks do this crap in Star wars costumes!!!! So I stopped and thought to myself of all the car clubs I had been in and rememeber even being on a council and being shot down when I said I wanted to go to UMC and have a car show for the sick kids. I was told "I'm not gonna let some kid sit in my car and screw around they will break something". Yet here are these people that have spent several hundred dollars (later meeting people that have spent thousands!) and visit these kids and play with them and even bring them a toy at their own expense (I consider a toy drive alot of work hence including at ones own expense)!!! So here I am trying to benefit from this and suddenly I am intrigued........very intrigued.....

    So a couple weeks go by and my good friend wants me to come over and when I get there he wants me to try on his costume!!! I was so excited!!! After about 30 minutes I was able to look at myself in a mirror and there I was Jango Fett!!! A week later I traded him almsot my entire toy collection just for some fabric, vinyl and plastic armor. Then comes the March of Dimes walk and I will tell you the whole time I was grinning ear to ear I was even able to meet a woman who was 102!!!

    So here I was a grown man wearing a bunch of plastic and extremely excited about it!! Trying to tell my friends and co-workers about it and then telling them how much money and time I have spent working on it and to date yes is in the thousands range! Done get me wrong I am a huge fan and enjoy all aspects of the fandom. I love collecting and displaying but my greatest joy is putting on that costume!

    (I am going to steal a few words and some of my
  25. hal9k1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2003
    star 4
    I think something needs to be made clear. Since I only have my own experiences and reasons I?m going to use myself as the example. Nobody asked that we do this it's just how we choose to serve the community.

    As far as costuming goes?. do any non costumers have any idea how much time, effort, research, money, thought, concern, communication, travel, and pride goes into making each and every costume used to benefit and improve the TFF?

    Simple answer, no. probably not.

    It?s not something that has been experienced by everyone. Just as anything else unless you go through the processes or have that experience you don?t just don?t understand it fully.

    That being said any hostile or seemly hostile opinion from pro-costumers are from feeling like we?ve put our heart, soul, blood, sweat, and tears into something just to have in belittled and told it?s not what were supposed to be doing. I?m not pointing fingers or placing blame, it?s just my observation and opinion.

    This stuff is built by hand with great care to detail over countless hours to show the community that we are not just a bunch of geeks in bathrobes or pajamas running around with toy Lightsabers or COM badges. We take great pride in what we make and what we do.

    We have to look and act like the professionals we are to garner the respect in the community so we can continue to do more in the future. Reputation is everything in this endeavor. Everyone in the TFF benefits from what everyone else does, regardless as to what it is; it?s a symbiotic relationship steaming from a common love of a single story and wanting to interact in the community and gain it's respect and understanding.

    I have 1 day off and I choose to spend it going to a children?s ward tomorrow at 10:00 am and do what I can to make those kids forget for a short time why they are in the hospital.
    Would I rather be sleeping in late on my day off, not getting up at 6:30 Am or not staying up late after working all day to make changes on my armor? Yes, I really would. But this is a completely selfless thing we all do. We have the time, energy, and money to help others that may not have all that we have available to us.

    Just to break it down. 1 scout trooper armor (I have a spread sheet with this stuff accounted for, not including S/H)

    Body armor $350
    Glue strapping and assorted stuff to shape and make it fit (tools)+ $250
    Helmet + $275
    Boots + $75 (hand made from parts)
    Blaster +$125
    Cummerbund, pouches, and vest + $125
    Voice amp, padding, under suite, extra strapping, Velcro and glue, etc + $150

    Total monetary cost: @ $1,400

    Time taken to make it wearable and research put into it well over 50 hours.

    Total amount of time worn during the year? under 10 hours.

    This does not take into the equation the travel time and gas to ?troop? an event once the costume is finished

    This take a lot or time and effort, but the payoff is seeing a child?s face light up when they see you.

    Why would I put this much time, money and energy into this?
    Because I can. Basically all it takes is one child to smile at me and however hot, tired, long the trip to the event was, amount of money spent its all makes it worth it. Even if they don?t know why you are their or who you are dressed up as they know someone cares enough to take the time to go see them. That?s enough for me. Right now in my life I have the money and (almost enough) time to do this, something to help others and the community. This is probably the one thing in my life I'm most proud of.

    Back in ?77 my mother took me and my sister to Macys (in NYC) and we stood around by the escalator in the fine china department for over half an hour just standing. I wanted to leave not knowing why we were just hanging around. After the waiting we found out why we were just standing their.
    Darth Vader showed up! Walked right though the china and crystal displays. I was awe struck! I never forgot how that made me feel. Forward to when I was about 30. I we
Moderators: DieWompRatDie, Grimby