Either Dyas ordered the clones or he didn't. So the audience analyzes the information provided and comes to one of the two conclusions knowing it can't be both. So what is the message Lucas ultimately conveyed? The act of ordering the clone army is very central to the plot and has an enormous impact on future events. Lucas gives the team of Sidious/Dooku the motive, means, and opportunity to have performed the act while supported by evidence (not necessarily the same evidence the Jedi get, but evidence). Dyas on the other hand is never given a motive on screen and the opportunity for him to have done it is snatched away just minutes after the character is verbally introduced into the story. Once that happens, he is never brought up again. So you weigh the two and the learned experience or takeaway message becomes the conclusion with the most weight behind it in the end. Well at least we agree that he should still be considering the possibility that Sifo's role in initial contact was faked. A record of initial contact has to exist either way but the fact that the Kaminoans never saw him leaves the door open quite a bit for fraud. Lama Su implies in the AOTC novel that they conversed with whoever ordered the clones and that the person explained a few things to them about preferring living beings to droids. Then again, Lama Su also says in that book that Dyas hand-picked Jango himself and then a scene or two later Jango says he's never heard of him and that he was recruited by a man called Tyranus. What I was saying there was that the dark side of the force was not on the side of Plagueis in the end. It wasn't helping him navigate around his death (in that his apprentice was playing him) or if it was, he wasn't interpreting what it was telling him very well. It didn't help him avoid his near death either. The dark side had chosen Sidious. Plagueis says there may be a way to place the order in the name of Dyas but also says the force tells him he will do it. Excluding "always in motion the future is" he then goes on to say a second later "we have become invincible." At the time, he just doesn't come across as someone seeing things clearly. But again, just because he sees it, doesn't mean it happened. Plus he's the guy to say Dyas can possibly be framed. And the proof that he met the criteria was not explained to Mace. "If what you told me is true, you will have gained my trust." As in he doesn't already have Mace's trust. He could have at least told Mace that Palpatine confessed or about Palpatine reading his worst nightmares. Some sort of proof that he met the criteria if it was just going to be Anakin's testimony. I'm giving the Jedi the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn't be that incompetent. Or are you saying I should say they'd be stupid enough to exclude the Supreme Chancellor from a Senate investigation? Or maybe the Vice Chairman? etc It should have though. To which you'll say "not it shouldn't have." etc etc He can be open minded, but that doesn't mean the name isn't something rather dark in basic. The audience doesn't need to know that Dooku = Tyranus for them to recognize a name sounding like tyrannous is disturbing. Same with the Jedi. If there are a million bounty hunters in the galaxy and you picked one and I picked one, what are the odds that we picked the same bounty hunter? Create a situation for the Jedi and Republic to search for Kamino? Hire someone expendable to get their attention and then hide your actions in a "maze of deception." Seems to be a common way of going about things for Sith. So Kamino needs to be erased from the Jedi Archives so that the Kaminoans do not eventually contact them? That's not making much sense. The Kaminoans know where to find the Republic. And again, the Jedi and Senate discovering the clones 4 years into the project isn't a benefit to the project. Federation types are cowards. Negotiations would be short. Especially when the Sith are involved......or Grievous.... or just about anything more physically and mentally powerful than Gunray.