PT In light of the "Plagueis" novel, how would you rewrite the prequels? *SPOILERS*

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by ANAKINSKYWEEZER, Mar 15, 2012.

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  1. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 15, 2004
    star 7
    The Jedi never figured out Dooku was Tyranus, as far as I recall. Yoda posited it in Labyrinth of Evil, but that is all.

    I don't see that any retcons need to be made. It segues neatly with the movies on purpose.
  2. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Obi-Wan figures out Tyranus is Darth Tyranus (and, I think he figures that it's Dooku as well)- in the Other RotS Novelization (the one by Patricia C. Wrede). This is, however, shortly after Order 66. Obi-Wan says "Why didn't I see it before?"

    In the Stover Novelization, Grievous's words to Obi-Wan on Utapau are different- he claims to have been trained by Darth Tyranus- and Obi-Wan replies "Do you mean Count Dooku? What a curious coincidence- I trained the man that killed him."
  3. Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 3
    Wrong again, I have said several times that Obi-Wan should simply be thought to be correct until we have reason to think otherwise. Nothing irrevocable about it. If AotC or RotS showed him to be wrong then good, he is wrong. But it is different to assume that he is wrong for no reason at all.
    And we get additional info that supports what Obi-Wan says, Jango has never heard of Sifo-Dyas, he was hired by Tyrannus which we later learn to be Dooku. We know about Palpatine/Dookus overall plan. In all, the army being ordered by Palpatine/Dooku makes lots of sense. The army ordered by some Jedi we never see for reasons unknown makes less sense.

    And if Obi-Wan is thruthfull about what he says about the date of Sifo-Dyas death and the date of the ordering of the clone army don't you think he has a reason to say this? That he does in fact know both of these dates and is simply telling Yoda and Mace what he knows?
    You have been trying to make up alternative scenarios where Obi-Wan doesn't know the date when the order was placed but instead some other date. However no movie evidence exists for this.
    If Obi-Wan tells the thruth then he knows the date Sifo-Dyas died and the date the army was ordered, case closed.

    Bye
    Blackboard Monitor
    Last edited by Samuel Vimes, Oct 1, 2012
  4. Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 3
    Well that was in response to the reasoning that "Simply because we don't see it happen doesn't mean it didn't happen." used to justify Obi-Wan knowing when Jango arrived on Kamino despite the movie never showing anything like this.

    As for the Jedi, they did know enough to SUSPECT that Dooku could be this Tyrannus. Jango works for him, he is a former Jedi so he could have deleted the Kamino file and he would know about Sifo-Dyas and could pose as him. The timeing is also curious, ten years ago Maul died, creating an opening in the Sith order. Then shortly after that Sifo-Dyas was killed, someone placed an order for the clone army and Dooku left the order.

    Bye for Now.
    Old Stoneface
    Last edited by Samuel Vimes, Oct 1, 2012
  5. Eternal_Hero Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 1
    Personally I wouldn't rewrite the prequels, that wd destroy the "magic" of DP which is like a filter that reveals a layer of story hidden before. The fun is looking at what is already there again in a new light.
  6. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Jango probably works for more than one person. Just like Boba Fett.

    They do not know that the order was placed after Sifo-Dyas was killed. Nothing in the film proves this to be the case or proves they would come to that conclusion. In the EU they come to a different conclusion.

    Sifo-Dyas being manipulated into it by the Sith makes 100% sense, and that is one of the possibilities. If the reason involves Sifo-Dyas having visions of the future, this also makes sense, because Jedi are sometimes known to have such visions.

    Who said the lines about Sifo-Dyas handpicking Jango still count? You're the one trying to use that, to make Jango not meeting Sifo-Dyas into a contradiction of Sifo's involvement. In the released and canonical version of the film the Jedi were not told Tyranus was a Darth, so it is pointless to try to hold the earlier script against them.

    Nor does it prove that he does know it.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Oct 1, 2012
  7. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    I'll admit, I think the expanded universe, with a few exceptions, is way more detailed and cool and fun than the star wars movies. It adds a lot to them. It makes the movies much more fun.

    Plageius in the movie was so vague. We didn't know if he was real or not, what he looked like, his backstory was, was he the emperor palpatine his apprentice or not (implied), his motives, etc. The book Plageius was awesome.

    I also liked how they explained him creating Anakin. I'm not sure how that goes along with the force creating Anakin as the chosen one to destroy the sith, though. Vader is either the creation of a darkside sith experiment, or a holy being created by the Force to destroy evil. Both sound equally cool.
  8. TOSCHESTATION Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2003
    star 4
    [face_whistling]
  9. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    Now that I think of it, Darth vader having a miraculous birth is one of the best ideas from the Prequel Trilogy.
  10. Sitara Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2001
    star 3
    This novel was utterly ridiculous. It totally butchers TPM and multiple characters in it (Palpatine for example, making him look like a fool) This is the reason I dislike the EU with a passion, and am very glad Lucas consistently overrode it whenever he felt like it (just like Disney is going to do by the way. No Yuhzan Vong! :thumbsup:
  11. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    And you know this because of insider information you just made up, I assume.
    And the book was very good. And :thumbsup: isn't a smiley....
  12. Sitara Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2001
    star 3
    And you know this because of insider information you just made up, I assume.

    Nope. It was announced by Disney that EP 7 would be an original script. Not to mention it just makes sense: Most of what is in the EU is does not feel Star Wars. The Vong for instance, appear like something out of Star Trek aka Science Fiction rather than Space Fantasy. Not only that, they are utterly ridiculous with elements like Lightsaber proof armor, cannot be felt by the Force, etc etc. The Force binds all living things, it is impossible for anything not to be affected by it.

    That is your opinion, true, but not mine. In fact, from what I can tell people who liked TPM dislike the Plagueis novel.
  13. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    "An original script" is not the same thing as "will retcon out of existence all previously existing post-RoTJ EU".

    Partially Lightsaber-proof armour (organic included) also appeared many times before the Vong did.

    "Not being sensed" isn't the same as not being affected, either.
    Random Comments likes this.
  14. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    I enjoyed TPM as well....and all the prequels, and the OT.
    I don't like the Vong, but "overriding the EU and erasing the Vong" is not what the words "original story" means. More information will have to be released before such a statement can be made. And for all we know, the story might be set after "Crucible"....
  15. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    Doesn't mean they are not going to take stuff from the EU and incorporate it into the movie.
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