Is anyone else disappointed by the music during the Yoda duel?

Discussion in 'Star Wars And Film Music' started by Mace Windy, Feb 12, 2003.

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  1. Mace Windy Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 1999
    star 6
    If this is redundant, please feel free to point me in the right direction. I didn't see anything covering this topic in the index.


    The music during Yoda's duel with Dooku has always bothered me and I had been meaning to start this topic for quite some time. Ever since my second viewing of the film (I say second viewing, because the crowd's cheering during the first drowned out the music) I have felt that the music during the duel didn't quite feel as though it belonged, but I could never put my finger on it.

    A few months (weeks?) later, 20th Century Fox released a brilliant promotional commercial featuring the Yoda duel that was a parody of Spiderman. Do you remember that one? I am sure that you do. How could you forget it. The Spiderman music (or something eerily similar) played as the commercial instructed us to take a "swing" with this years biggest action hero. Cut to Yoda. There is dead silence as his saber floats from his belt to his hand. The only sound that can be heard is the click of the saber, and the sweet hum of its extended blade.
    As Yoda lunges, the upbeat Star Wars fanfare blasts, and all of our adrenaline starts to rush. The commercial is pure excitement and pure fun. It was, simply, pure Star Wars - very campy.

    The actually film itself seems to lack this fun quality that the television spot possessed. I blame the music. The tone was too somber. Think about it, this was Yoda's biggest moment, and the crowd was in a frenzy. In my mind, the music should have matched that frenzied pitch.

    I can understand what Mr. Williams was doing, he was trying to give the duel an epic feel, but did it work? Imagine Episode I's Duel of the Fates without a frantic track. Its not nearly as exciting of a battle, is it? That's the exact same way that I feel while watching the Yoda battle. To me, the scene should not be about an epic duel, it should be about a fun one. Afterall, the scene was designed to be a crowd pleaser. This is evident in all its aspects - starting with Yoda casting a shadow as he entered the hangar.

    Initially, the duel was a blast, but now a lot of the novelty has worn off. I still love it, but I find myself having more fun watching that television spot. Does anyone else feel the same way?




    :cool: Mace Windy,
    yes, there is a draft in here!

    GK edit: Fixed title.
  2. jedimastergeorge Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 8, 2003
    star 1
  3. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
    No, I disagree.

    That piece of the score is one of the few cues I will be excited to hear when (and if) a 2 CD set of all the AOTC music is released.

    It has this great variation on the "mystery theme"/"Dooku's Theme" played very loudly by the brass and is one of the most dynamically interesting pieces of action music in the film.

    I, for one, love it.

    And then of course there's Yoda's theme played very passionately by the brass as Dooku escapes and Yoda stops the pillar from crushing Anakin and Obi-Wan.

    All around, I think the saber duel music in AOTC was very well done.
  4. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    See I love the Yoda duel music. I think the epic feel is appropriate. And I love the use of the "Mystery" theme and of course the great burst of Yoda's theme at the end.

    But I thought the Obi-Wan/Dooku and Anakin/Dooku duel music was pieced together and lame. There's no feeling in it. It sounds like it was chopped up from pieces of other score bits from the rest of the film and doesn't flow well to me... Also those synth voices when Dooku is gonna kill Obi-Wan make me SICK. No WAY did Williams do that...


  5. Sithman Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    Weird, I was just going to post this same topic this week. I've been thinking about it for quite some time as well, and I agree completely.

    When I saw AOTC on opening night, I got an adrenaline rush during the Yoda fight like no other. The theater erupted in applause, and everyone stood on their feet screaming their heads off. :D Then, for latter viewings, when no one cheered, I began to realize the same thing that Windy's saying. I agree, where IS the bombastic, blaring music? I mean, this is YODA IN A LIGHTSABER DUEL FOR CRYIN' OUT LOUD! It's a truly awesome moment in the saga, and it gets... A downplayed little trumpet thingy that is mixed rather quietly, and not blaring at all? Bleh, not exactly what I was hoping for.


    "A few months (weeks?) later, 20th Century Fox released a brilliant promotional commercial featuring the Yoda duel that was a parody of Spiderman."

    Actually, if you would have gone to the Celebration II, you would have seen it along with thousands of other screaming fans. :D But, I mention this because I would agree that the music in the commercial is what I always thought the music in the duel should be. I mean, Yoda's duel is a cultural icon, a green Muppet kicking the crap out a Sith Lord... THAT is what Star Wars is about: the adrenaline rush of something as cool as that! The Star Wars Main Theme in the commercial (it's on the AOTC DVD, in case you guys didn't know) fit exactly in with the scene. It's blaring, it pumps you up, and it IS Star Wars, that's why the Star Wars Theme fits so well there.
  6. Drac39 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 2002
    star 6
    I am sorry but I hate Prequel Music,I was very disapointed by both Episode I,and II's score
  7. Sithman Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    That's his opinion, I guess. :D
  8. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    Wow Drac are you kidding me?

  9. Mace Windy Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 1999
    star 6
    "And then of course there's Yoda's theme played very passionately by the brass as Dooku escapes and Yoda stops the pillar from crushing Anakin and Obi-Wan."

    Oh, I absolutely love this moment as well. Yoda's theme is completely appropriate and welcome here. What I have a problem with is the music during the physical duel itself. The pace of the music simply does not match the sheer speed of Yoda and Dooku. It is too slow to provide energy, and too generic to provide much emotion.





    :cool: Mace Windy,
    yes, there is a draft in here!
  10. batvader Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 23, 2002
    star 3
    I usually applaud the lack of swashbuckly music in action scenes in SW as ''subtlety''. It'd be a piece if cake for Williams to make a crowd-pleasing upbeat thing for that spot, but IMO the existing cue gives some ''weight'' to the scene. After all, if we see it in the context of the film (and not as ''Yoda is holding a freaking saber to kick b__t'' or as ''this green goblin jumping around is funny'' like average movie-goers), it's not a happy scene. Yoda faces a former Jedi (a former good guy) that has become an enemy, much like Obi and Vader in EP4. It's not like Obi and Qui going up against a guy they don't have a backstory with (Maul was a Sith trained from childhood).
  11. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    Well said, batvader. That's how I feel as well...

  12. RONDC20 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 10, 2001
    star 1

    I agree on both points. On one hand I like the music that accompanies the scene, but on the other I would have liked a more prominent use of the Yoda Theme simular to how it was used in Empire Strikes Back when Luke was in Bespin in Cloud City, very swashbuckling and heroic.

    Ronald C
  13. VoijaRisa Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 12, 2002
    star 5
    I'll have to really go back and listen to it again but I'll just say that it was the duel itself that disappointed me.
  14. dehrian Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 1999
    star 6
    I have no problem with the tone or mood of the piece, but I wish it flowed better. It feels very choppy, like it's continually stopping and restarting.
  15. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    I'll have to really go back and listen to it again but I'll just say that it was the duel itself that disappointed me.

    Man there's something I have never heard before.

  16. Mortimer_Nerdly Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 19, 2002
    star 5
    The music eduring the Yoda Vs Darth Tyranus duel was absolutley mad-ass! I love it! Too bad it's not on the soundtrack...
  17. doggans Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2002
    star 5
    I think it should have played Weird Al's "Yoda" during the duel. :D
  18. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    The music eduring the Yoda Vs Darth Tyranus duel was absolutley mad-ass! I love it! Too bad it's not on the soundtrack...

    mad-ass? Is this good? God... kids' slang these days.

    :)

  19. Mace Windy Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 1999
    star 6
    Heh. I've never heard of that one either, stril. :D





    :cool: Mace Windy,
    yes, there is a draft in here!
  20. Sithman Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    [face_laugh]

    Stupid junior-highers repeating things that they don't know the meaning of. :p
  21. General Kenobi Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 31, 1998
    star 6
    Sithy, you should never use a preposition to end a sentence with.

    :p
  22. TwiLekJedi Pretty Ex-Mod

    Member Since:
    Jun 14, 2001
    star 10
    In a thread about something Yoda-related he should be allowed to. ;)
  23. Utility_Belt Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2003
  24. slavegirl Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 4
    I can't say I remember the music for the Yoda duel. [face_blush] I was probably too busy trying to pretend it wasn't happeneing - sorry, I'm a fierce hater of the Yoda duel. :(
  25. Blast Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 8, 2002
    star 3
    >I'm a fierce hater of the Yoda duel<

    As am I
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