"Is Darth Vader my father?"

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by geordiejedi1982, Jul 8, 2004.

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  1. geordiejedi1982 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2004
    star 1
    This is a question for the older members of the forum. Seeing as I was 1 when Return of the Jedi came out, it was common knowledge that Vader was Luke's father by the time I saw the films (I don't actually remember when I first saw the films, but I was only about 3 or 4).

    However, in some interviews/documentaries that I've seen, people say how they weren't actually sure that Vader was his father until Yoda confirmed it in ROTJ. For example, James Earl Jones said in an interview how he didn't want to believe it and didn't until ROTJ was made.

    So for anyone who was around for the original release of ESB, what was your view on it? Did you just accept that Vader was telling the truth, or did you think it was some sort of trick of his?
  2. Sanctuary_Moon Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 20, 2004
    star 3
    I was 11 at the time of the original release of ROTJ. My answer is yes, I accepted that Vader was indeed Luke's father and was fascinated to see how it would play out in the final film.

    I never doubted that Vader had told Luke the truth in ESB - mainly because of the absolute resignation on Luke's part towards what Vader has revealed to him. He keeps repeating "Ben, why didn't you tell me?" - rather than "Ben, is he telling the truth?" (or something similar). Because Luke had "searched his feelings and knew it to be true" - so did I, I guess!

    (edited for spelling)
  3. DS615 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 30, 2003
    star 4
    There was a facinating study done with children and the acceptance of evil and the use of this idea.
    It was found that children under seven simply thought Darth Vader was lying to Luke, and that was that. Seven and older were able to accept the existance of evil, and knew it was true.

  4. hofie Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2002
    star 2
    I was 7 when ESB came out, and I was one of those kids who didn't believe it. I was sure Vader was lying to Luke in order to get him to not jump and ultimately join the Empire. As time passed and it got closer to when ROTJ came out, I understood that Vader could actually be Luke's father.

    Side note: when I was growing up my mom used to say that Darth Vader was my real father and he would one day come and get me and take me back, and I would get so scared and wind up cleaning my room.
  5. gotyoda Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2003
    star 3
    "Side note: when I was growing up my mom used to say that Darth Vader was my real father and he would one day come and get me and take me back, and I would get so scared and wind up cleaning my room."

    HAHA that's great. I was 1 when ANH came out so Jedi is what I remember most other then crappy VHS tapes. So I guess the training with yoda spoiled it for me. That being said my fondest memories were the burger king Jedi glasses.
  6. DarthToeJam Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 28, 2002
    star 4
    The question of whether Vader was telling Luke the truth was THE great unanswered question between TESB and ROTJ. I was a teenager at the time, and for three years people debated back and forth. The question was "Is Darth Vader really Luke's father?" Some believed it, other's didn't. As a 15 year old, I even had my own theory. I was positive that Darth Vader WAS Luke's father but he was not Darth Vader. I believed that Vader and Anakin were both young Jedis and that Anakin assumed Vader's identity, faking his own death and blaming the "murder" on Vader. Pondering the answers made the years between 1980 and 1983 unbearable! (also, for some reason time moved slower back then. Weird!)

    What is interesting is to hear all the same compaints from back then being repeated now. "Lucas can't possibly tie up all the loose ends in 2 hours!" "Lucas has lost it. Star Wars would be so much better if ________."
  7. DarthLassic007 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2002
    star 6
    After TESB came out, people were left with a cliff hanger and had to wait 3 years to find out whether Vader was telling Luke the truth. I found out years later that many people thought that he was lying. For some reason I never question it and when Vader said that he was Luke's father, I took it as fact.
  8. Fettcrom Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    Yeah i was about 7 or 8 at the time and I didn't want to believe he was his father. I too thought it was Vader trying to temp him and something different would be revealed in ROTJ. Looking at it now it seems more obvious that he is. Couldn't really take it all in at that age. My Dad took my to see it on holiday and I couldn't believe the way it ended. He had to convince me that it would be another three years to get the answers to my questions. I thought if i sat there long enough the next part would come on. Not to be I'm afraid.

    Like DTJ said, that three years seemed a lot longer to wait in those days. I suppose we didn't really have video yet and you wait for a year or two for films to come on video then and they costed about 80-90 Pounds (I live in England) to buy a rental copy new. There was no internet then to keep you going with tidbits of info and even the soundtracks were minimal in content, scared I would snap the tapes they were on.

    Empire is now my fav of all the movies. I've rarely seen a film that gave such a cliffhanger that so many movies aspire to rival, especially recently.

    Personally I would love for George to throw something in EPIII that would give another twist to it. We all think we know the outcome of this tale, but I would love him to throw something in that would turn the saga on it's head, just like he did in 1980.

    "Take care you two, May the force be with you......"
  9. JohnWesleyDowney Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5

    ditto DarthToeJam's post!

    I remember having many, many conversations with friends, relatives and fellow fans for the 3 years between ESB and ROTJ about the "Vader father" issue.
    We exhaustively discussed EVERYTHING in the first two movies looking for clues to the truth.

    It was THE discussion topic regarding ESB.
    Everyone left the theatre talking about the big revelation.

    It created great suspense and anticipation for
    ROTJ!!!!

    I remember very clearly on the day ROTJ was released seeing it with a full house and when Yoda says
    "Your Father he is", there was a BIG buzz in the audience.

    I also recall a guy paying off on a bet in the parking lot afterward. :)
  10. hofie Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2002
    star 2
    Our big discussion was always who the "another" was that Yoda spoke of. Was it Leia? Han? A new character? Maybe we didn't talk about the Vader as dad thing b/c no one wanted to believe it.
  11. Fettcrom Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    Yeah I remember the "another" converstaion. That raged on too. I think had it in my head that it was Han. I remember thinking (In my young mind) that only a Jedi can use a light sabre and that as Han uses it to cut open the Taun Taun. I think I thought it would be really heavy in someone else's hand if they had no force ability. Cor the Mind of a child. I for one was very suprised when he said Leia.
  12. Ghost_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2003
    star 5
    Just wanted to throw my 2¢ in, and I thought Vader was lying, in order to get Luke to join him. Come on he was a bad guy, and good guys don't lie . . . :p
  13. Tigue Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 29, 2003
    star 1
    My father took me to see ESB when I was about six years old. As a kid, I never really thought of any Star Wars villain as either sinister or evil ... except the Emperor, I was pretty certain that he and The Devil were good buddies. I always thought of the bad guys as "the bad guys" only because they were usually giving "the good guys" a hard time (LOL). I never really thought of them as being evil, I just figured they were doing what they were supposed to.

    I was amazed (to the extent that a six year old could have been amazed) when Darth Vader revealed that he was Luke Skywalker's father. But I was still just a kid, so I accepted that Luke's dad was Darth Vader (and that was that).

    During the drive home, I remember asking my father if Darth Vader was really a bad guy. After all, we were talking about Luke Skywalker's dad here (not just anybody). How could he have possibly been a bad guy?

    It's funny now that I think about it. Kids probably get more out of Star Wars than any grownup ever will. The irony being that kids probably won't understand what they got from the story until they think about it when they're older.


    For what it's worth,

    -Tigue
  14. zeva Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 2
    I remember a guy in my class who saw the movie, came to class, and as soon as he got a chance he yelled out that "oh yeah, Vader is Luke's father...no, really!). I didn't want to believe him, but after the rest of the class saw the movie, he was the most hated guy in the class. In fact, he was ostracized for the rest of the year.

    At that time, we all knew it was true, because of the way the scene was set-up, Luke's reaction to the news, the music, even Vader's reaction after seeing Luke falling (how he kept his hand in the air for a couple of beats, as if he could not believe his own son would prefer death to rather than join him). Add to that the fact that in that movie we already knew that Luke had advanced in his force training (he was able to force-pull his lightsaber in Hoth), and that he was able to invoke Leia using the force, while Vader was also able to invoke him using the force (reinforcing the idea that the family ties between them and the Force were one and the same)...so no, there was no doubt that Vader was NOT LYING.
  15. DamonD Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2002
    star 6
    I also recall a guy paying off on a bet in the parking lot afterward.

    Heh!

    And I'd echo Tigue's thoughts...I was only 2 years old when I saw ESB the very first time, so I can't remember it myself, but according to my mum I did indeed accept Vader was Luke's dad. The idea of Vader lying, even if he was a bad guy, just didn't occur to me back then...aww, I was so young and naive :p

    By the time ROTJ swung round, I'd gotten the hang of lying but Vader was confirmed as Luke's dad anyway ;)
  16. sweetcaroline Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2004
    star 4
    I was 11 when ROTJ was released in '83 and I accepted the fact that he was Luke's father. I remember it freaking me out and it led to all sorts of reasons for him going to the dark side. Back then, one's imagination was all one had. Now that we're all awaiting for epi. 3 this is an exciting time for all us SW fans to see it happen.

    Back then I had always hoped that Lucas would do the prequels and show Anakin as a child and his unfortunate journey to the dark side so waiting for epi. 3 is more exciting for me I think....
  17. solojones Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2000
    star 9
    I certainly wasn't around then, but I have an interesting story about that. I had a friend who had never seen any of the Star Wars films before over to watch all 5 in one of my big get-togethers. We started with the OT because we figured this would be the most logical way to do it with someone who was unfamiliar with SW.

    We figured, though, that she knew the basic things. I mean, how could you not, right? She indeed had seen clips of Vader saying he was Luke's father and knew about that whole cultural phenomenon.

    The shock to us came when watching ROTJ. When Yoda replies, "Your father he is," my friend almost screamed, "What?! I always thought he was lying!"

    Needless to say, everyone in the room just stared at her for a moment then bust out laughing. Apparently she had never heard it confirmed that Vader was actually Luke's father, only known that there was a famous scene with him saying he was. I was pretty amazed that she had escaped this detail, but it was also cool. I got a glimpse of someone unfamiliar with SW getting the shocking revelation, and I felt like perhaps future generations will still feel the same (if you show them the OT first, of course. I'm not sure, but I think Episode III can't preserve that mystery).

    -sj loves kevin spacey
  18. arielthalandra Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 10, 2002
    star 2
    I was almost 18 when I saw ESB, and I was stunned when Vader made his big announcement. The whole theater, which was packed, gasped at once. My feelings about it - I distinctly remember walking home from the theater with my friends and just geeking on the whole thing - was that, while it would be fantastically cool if Vader really was Luke's father, he probably was lying to him just to mess with his mind. I wanted Vader to be Luke's father (largely because I had a crush on him and needed him to have been sexual at ONE time)but I figured it was just too cool to be true. It took forever for ROTJ to be released so we could find this out and I for one was pumped. That was why I was so thrilled to learn GL was going with prequels: I was going to get to see Big DV as a young man. That is also why I love the prequels, even though I agree with much of the criticism directed at them.

    I am 41 years old and it still feels like forever between AOTC and Ep 3, even though I know what's going to happen!
  19. Fox609 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 1999
    star 1
    "Come on he was a bad guy, and good guys don't lie . . . "

    Unless you're Obi-Wan. I wasn't around for the original release, nor do I recall me reaction to Vader's announcement. I probably accepted it as fact from the first time I heard it.
  20. Diogonese Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2002
    star 2
    ...yes, there was a good deal of speculation between ESB and ROTJ, as to whether or not Vader was actually Luke's father. For my part, I believed it from the first. Afterall, in Star Wars, ONLY the good guys lie.
  21. AdamBertocci Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Feb 3, 2002
    star 7
    Was I the only one who was sort of hoping that this thread was going to be geordie asking if Vader was HIS father? :p


    Anyway, while I was NOT around for the ESB original release, I WAS unspoiled when I saw it for the first time, and I believed Vader was bluffing.



    Rick McCallum loves you!
  22. geordiejedi1982 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2004
    star 1
    Was I the only one who was sort of hoping that this thread was going to be geordie asking if Vader was HIS father? :p


    I already know he is, I done a bit of family tree research. Come on, do you really believe the most evil man in the galaxy only ever slept with ONE woman? He had women scattered all over the place :p

    Thanks for that comment, made me laugh so hard when I got into work this morning!
  23. WookieSeeWookieDo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 1, 2004
    star 2
    I remember being the only kid in my grade 1 classroom who believed that Vader WAS Lukes father. Boy was I proud of myself when it was finally confirmed... of course, I was also arguing that R2 and C3-P0 were real robots...

    (just a note: ESB was the first movie I ever saw in a theater!!!)....yay... whatever, its late.
  24. ShinobiWan1 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2004
    one thing's for sure, luke sure didn't want to accept it at first, and i quote:

    "...noooooooo..."
  25. origjedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 27, 2001
    star 3
    Definitely believed it, all the way. I never once thought Vader was lying. I was just completely shocked at the statement, though. I still to this day don't see how some people say, "Oh, I knew Vader was Luke's father, I could tell". What? I was totally blind-sided by Vader's claim, never saw it coming. I guess that was the whole idea. I can just think about that scene at the theatres when I first saw it and I still feel shocked over it!
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