Lit Is EU continuity going to be respected in ST? Shouldn't we do something to ensure it is?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by darth ladnar, Apr 21, 2013.

  1. darth ladnar Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 20, 2013
    star 3
    I know I'm new here, and maybe this has been discussed over and over, but I've been surprised that Disney has not made any announcements (that I'm aware of) saying that they will respect EU continuity -- even basic stuff, like the identity of Luke's and Han's kids. Of course, they might have to make slight alterations especially to the EU timeline that overlaps with the time period of the ST films, but I find it troubling that Disney hasn't made any press releases stating that they will preserve even the basics of the EU universe.

    Right now the 1st film is in the writing phase, and I'm the type to be proactive about things. There have been over 1,000,000 messages posted in the EU literature forum and another 1,000,000 messages in the EU community forum. Companies pay attention to those kinds of numbers. We could easily prevent some top Disney studio executive who thinks he knows it all from unnecessarily making the post-ROTJ EU universe obsolete if we start a petition, flood them with emails, or begin a call-in campaign right now.

    I know some of you are thinking that Disney wouldn't be that dumb, but I looked at the Clone Wars forum, and on early threads, they were saying that Disney wouldn't be dumb enough to close shop on the Clone Wars in mid-story arc, and now look what happened. Then the same thing happened with Detours and 1313 (which is especially strange since it was nearing completion).

    Here are the email addresses they have up on the "Save the Clone Wars" thread.
    support@disneyonline.com
    Medianet@disney.com
    That thread also suggests contacting Disney via Facebook or Twitter.

    If anyone has better contact info, please provide it.

    My point of view is better safe than sorry. Right now Disney is far more powerful than the Empire. With one bad corporate decision, they can cause all of our favorite post-ROTJ EU figures to disappear in just an instant.

    However, if just a fraction of the people who posted those 2 million messages contact Disney, then we might be able to prevent Disney from making another huge mistake.
  2. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    Thing is, TCW has demonstrated to not be able to pull of a single well connected story arc in the span of 108 episodes. Either they rush stuff, drag out unimportant stuff, have outright terrible writing or throw a wrench into other Clone Wars sources apparently just out of laziness. So somehow I really do not consider it worth saving.
    Ashoka leaving the Jedi Order was not even initially planned, but a hastily made up to serve as a series finale. They really should be able to do better with the budget they seem to have.
    thesevegetables and kubricklynch like this.
  3. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    We should totally do something about it. Someone make me a list of high ranking Disney officials. We'll take a few of them hostage and demand our continuity be respected. We'll show them the Holiday Special on endless loop, broken only by live readings of the Jedi Prince series. It will only be a matter of time until they crack.

    Oh, a petition? That's much less fun.
    Last edited by instantdeath, Apr 21, 2013
  4. Zorkel567 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 20, 2010
    star 3
    Could we even do something so horrible? That is cruel and unusual punishment right there for you.
  5. darth ladnar Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 20, 2013
    star 3
    The petition of the 2,000,000?
  6. darth ladnar Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 20, 2013
    star 3
    Oh, I agree. I was not a fan of the TCW. Never understood why it got so much exclaim. Only liked a few episodes from a couple arcs. Well, for as a cartoon for 10-year olds I guess it's pretty good. I think I'd like it if I were that age. I was just using it as an example of what Disney might do. Just another weird thing is cancelling a video game that already had millions invested in it and was nearing completion.

    I think Disney might dismiss the EU fans because 95% of people who know of Star Wars don't know about the EU. However, the most passionate fans of Star Wars started with the films and then moved to the EU. Disney may not understanding that they'd be angering their ardent base, and the EU part of the Jedi Forums are the post popular forums by far.
    Last edited by darth ladnar, Apr 22, 2013
  7. darth ladnar Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 20, 2013
    star 3
    Maybe I'm confusing a joke with outright mockery, but I get the sense that you're totally dismissing all of what I'm saying. Online petitions, write-in campaigns, email campaigns have saved countless low-rated TV series from cancellation, and that's a fact. I doubt there is a larger fan community out there than what exists on the force.net, so if other write-in campaigns have been successful, I don't see why this wouldn't have a large chance at success as well.
  8. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    I certainly wasn't intending to mock anyone, save perhaps those involved in making the Holiday Special.

    For the record, though, I don't see petitions doing much. Of course, petitions have saved many low-rated TV shows in the past... but Star Wars is far from a low-rated TV series. It's one of the highest grossing blockbuster franchises of all time. It could be downright terrible and millions will go and see it, even if they complain about it afterwards. They'll be wanting to please as many people as they can, and unfortunately for us, that probably means ignoring or altering a great portion of the EU.

    I love the EU, and I was of course very apathetic about this at first... but I've personally warmed up to the idea of a different artistic interpretation to the sequel of ROTJ, particularly the post-NJO stuff. Of course, they will be alienating a portion of their fanbase by ignoring the EU... but the crucial thing is, that fanbase will be much smaller than those who just see the films, and the fans of the EU will, inevitably, go see the movies as well, if only out of curiosity. Or maybe they'll torrent it, who knows. Point is, the vast majority of people who go see the films will have not read the books or comics, and if would be almost impossible to follow FOTJ and remain completely divorced from it. I despise the pop culture stigma that visual mediums, like movies and TV, are superior to books and comics as much as everyone, but for a marketing machine like Star Wars, they are going to be playing the numbers game.

    I'll admit, I was and am skeptical at the idea that we can really do anything, hence my less than serious post. For something this huge, I see the greatest chance of success being certain elements of the EU retained; maybe Luke is married to Mara Jade, the events of the Thrawn trilogy happened at some point, and Han and Leia have three kids named Jacen, Jaina and Anakin. Maybe if they're really generous, the Vong war happened. Really, my personal hope is that the post-ROTJ EU be acknowledged and kept in print as a "possible future" of ROTJ, with the films being the other.

    I can guarantee you, though, that they'll never outright say that they plan to respect or ignore the EU. Too much bad press either way. The first we'll know of it is a trailer, at earliest.
    Last edited by instantdeath, Apr 22, 2013
  9. darth ladnar Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 20, 2013
    star 3
    Yeah, this is more of what I was talking about. I don't see any real reason that this type of stuff can't be recognized. I mean, for instance, it wouldn't be hard for Disney to simply recognize that Han's and Leia's three kids are Jacen, Jaina, and Anakin. If those types of characters really won't fit the 3 films, then just kill the ones who really can't be fit into the story at the beginning of the films or have the audience learn that they have died sometime before the time period of ST begins. It's that basic type of continuity that I think a lof of people in the EU community would like to protect, not that every little detail has to be preserved.

    To me, killing off characters is much different than saying that those characters never existed, and since in most cases it is so easy to kill them off and make things fit the new ST, I think a write-in campaign could possibly achieve that minimal goal. Studio executives can be really stupid and not recognize that something like this is easy to achieve. Also, it's really not that hard to type up an email. It takes 5 minutes.

    I do agree with your basic analysis of what Disney's mindset will be. It just seems to me that certain aspects of the EU can be easily preserved. Of course the stuff after around 30 years ABY will be radically altered b/c the ST is set then, but the entire post-ROTJ EU universe doesn't need to be tossed out along with it.
  10. Starkeiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2004
    star 4
    Death and destruction is obviously the only response. It's time we showed the world that you just can't cancel out the EU without seeing everyone you love evaporate in a thermonuclear blast.

    So, shall I set up one of them Kickstarter things so we can get money for an atom bomb?

    :p



    On a more serious note, I see "elements" of the EU being preserved as a defeat, not a victory. Disney bought Star Wars, and it came with the characters that populate it. Characters, not names applicable to any other personality the new writers they hire can come up with. This is not a superhero comic book where you can keep the character separate from the identity. Many a time have the EU heroes acted out of character, of course, but they still have a very explicit history and personality.

    If Disney wants to go the "reboot" route like every other slobbering money-hungry idiot in the entertainment business, I'm with them. What do they need to butcher the EU for?
    Last edited by Starkeiller, Apr 22, 2013
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  11. _Catherine_ Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    I'd rather see the EU "finished" as a body of ongoing work and set off to the side than contorted and rewritten just so LFL can keep making money off the disingenuous promise that "everything fits." Why would it matter if they kept Jacen, Jaina, and Anakin's names if their personalities and backstories weren't preserved? Seems like kind of a pyrrhic victory.

    The same with a continuity "cutoff point" at the NJO or whenever. Once you start throwing out entire books, series, and eras wholesale, nothing is sacrosanct and I don't know why anyone would care anymore. If they set a precedent with the ST overwriting the NJO and Legacy eras but allegedly keeping earlier continuity intact, the later spinoff films can easily obliterate pre-ROTJ EU like the HST or TotJ. It's a continuity built on sand.
  12. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    This would be a respectful, classy way to do it. Best idea for a resolution to this issue yet.
  13. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    I agree, actually, that this iteration of the EU should have an ending. Or rather, it should have had an ending with The Unifying Force, and then called it quits for the stories of Luke, Leia, Han and the rest. Less than a year ago, I would have told you that Star Wars would never have a proper ending, that it would keep going on, and the heroes of the OT would continue to be dragged through the mud until they're no longer profitable.

    That said, I personally enjoy the idea of incorporating EU concepts and characters, not as an attempt to "salvage" anything, but just as a way to give a nod to what came before, and what in many ways laid the groundwork for it. The EU played a large part in keeping Star Wars alive between the trilogies, and after (no matter how much some, including the creators say otherwise, TCW is part of the EU. If Han and Leia have twins, I really feel they should be called Jacen and Jaina, even if they're totally different characters than they are in the EU.
    Last edited by instantdeath, Apr 22, 2013
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  14. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Petitions and emails don't really get that much attention, letters? Can be more effective.

    Beyond that? There is but one solution: If you don't like what they do, you hit them in the pocket! You don't buy the new stuff, or the last of the old stuff even.
  15. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    Considering this is Star Wars we're dealing with, that's even less likely to work :p
  16. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Effectiveness is irrelevant ID. Corporate execs know fans will post loud, incendiary messages of condemnation, furious onslaught of e-fire and brimstone, flame each to the point of magma and beyond....

    And then, all but a very few, will go out to the cinema to see ep 7, they'll buy the Blu-Ray and then the special extended cut and, all the while, they'll be online raining down vitriol upon the same corporation they've just supported.

    Me? I'm likely to buy Ep 7 on Blu-Ray as it'll be cheaper than the cinema but that's dependent on reviews and reception, though I generally like Abrams work.
    Starkeiller likes this.
  17. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    "Rest assured, I was on the internet within moments, registering my disgust throughout the world."
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  18. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Already happened with the Marvel Star Wars comics which are considered S-Canon and not really worse than a lot of the normal C-canon stuff.
    Maybe I come off harsh, but anyone who thought the EU was sacrosanct was fooling him/herself.

    Personally I could care less whether they keep continuity intact or not. I read EU because I want to enjoy the stories on their own merits or am curious.
  19. Starkeiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2004
    star 4
    If I bought a ticket for a historical movie set during the wars of the early 19th century and watched a movie where Napoleon Bonaparte is an English Admiral fighting the Duke of Wellington's French Revolutionaries, I wouldn't walk out of the theater saying, "I appreciated how they respected history by preserving the characters".
  20. Obie-2-Kenobi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2008
    star 2
    It only took 25,000 to petition the government to build a real Death Star, and they got a detailed response from the White House!!!
    Robimus likes this.
  21. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    And they're still made use of- Lumiya and Fenn Shysa have both been used in C-canon works.

    And the Saga Edition game has mentioned the Nagai-Tof war, in some detail, in splatbooks. As well as the Tagge family and their plots.
  22. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    That is what I expect with the current EU to happen. Some stuff freely being used in whatever new EU continuity we will get, other stuff being ignored.

    But no regard for old continuity.
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, Apr 22, 2013
  23. Starkeiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2004
    star 4
    The Marvel comics have made their way into C-Canon. If we go by the rule that something from the Marvel comics has to be referenced in a C-Canon source to become C-Canon itself, then they're all C-Canon by this point, not only through novels and Dark Horse comics, but largely through a series of excellent RpG articles published by Wizards of the Coasts. Even the "Jabba the Hut" stuff is accepted now.

    The comparison is not at all accurate.
    Arawn_Fenn likes this.
  24. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    If the old works are treated like Marvel Jabba was treated, then we basically have an parallel universe situation at hand anyway. It is not what I'd call respecting the old continuity.
  25. Zorrixor Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 8, 2004
    star 6
    Or there's the third option: we begin a mass mail bomb with everyone sending them Gloves of Darth Vader until Disney Castle is overflowing with gloves and they are forced to surrender to the demands of the Gloves.
    Alpha-Red likes this.