PT Is Hayden's Anakin iconic?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by LordThanatos, Dec 15, 2013.

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Is Hayden's Anakin iconic?

Yes 61 vote(s) 45.5%
No 73 vote(s) 54.5%
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  1. AnakinColodin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2009
    star 2
    The look on Obi-wans face at the end is classic . Really glad the EU exists for the prequels and will not be destroyed by episode 7 like the post ROTJ EU is going to be. The TCW cartoon, the last season of Genndy's cartoon tie in and Labyrinth of Evil really give us Anakin and Obi-wan as friends which the movies did not really have enough time to do. Love scenes like that or in Labyrinth when the two of the are getting drunk while cantina hopping while looking for someone who has info they need in the search of the other Sith.
    Force Smuggler likes this.
  2. SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2003
    star 6
    Tough question. Forty years ago, it might have have been easier...

    So that's where I'll go:

    Moff Tarkin was and still is, iconic... Peter Cushing was onscreen for about ten minutes.
    He was so good, I can no longer name any of the other roles he played outside of the GFFA. Moff Tarkin, he is.

    Was Ewan iconic? Or did he carry the torch that was lit by Sir Alec?

    Same with Hayden.

    They were tasked with filling in, not fleshing-out from scratch, so the iconic-decks are stacked against them.
    T-R- and anakinfansince1983 like this.
  3. Big_Benn_Klingon Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2013
    star 1
    Im guessing you don't have kids - or haven't been around them much in the last decade. Anakin is everything iconic to them - even the ones that aren't "fans". Most couldn't tell you who Han Solo is if you showed them a picture.

    I think you are confusing nostalgic importance with iconic
    Last edited by Big_Benn_Klingon, Dec 16, 2013
    LordThanatos likes this.
  4. SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2003
    star 6
    The internet has blurred everything.
  5. Carbon1985 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2013
    star 3
    I don't think you understand what iconic is. Iconic isn't just being known by fans who saw the movies, iconic is a character that first comes to mind when you mention it as it is a memorable role sometimes that defines their career. We all know who Snooki is from Jersey Shore, but she's not iconic. Now if you mention Hannibal Lector, everyone thinks of that iconic role played by Sir Anthony Hopkins.

    And I have 4 nephews between the ages of 8-15 and are all SW fans, but wouldn't say Hayden's Anakin is iconic. Although they will probably say Robert Downeys Iron Man or Harry Potter are their favorite blockbuster movies in their lifetime. And don't know why you would bring up Han Solo as I never brought his name up? What, you didn't show your kids the OT movies because if you did they would at least recognize him!

    And if you don't think Rocky Balboa, The Godfather, Hannibal Lector aren't iconic roles, then please tell me who are your iconic movie roles?
    Last edited by Carbon1985, Dec 16, 2013
  6. Big_Benn_Klingon Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2013
    star 1
    You have a very specific (yet open to opinion) definition of the term. I feel that you are putting more of a value-judgment to the term that makes it far too subjective

    IMO, "iconic" is something (ie an "icon") that is immediately recognizable as symbolically representing something greater than that something itself. Snooki is most definitely iconic of Jersey Shore and "reality tv" in general. In 2013, Anakin is recognizable by many people as representing contemporary Star Wars, regardless of his merits, or lack-there-of, as a character.

    And FYI, I only mentioned Han Solo because I assume he is somebody most here would agree was "iconic".. nobody mentioned the godfather either.
    Last edited by Big_Benn_Klingon, Dec 16, 2013
    LordThanatos likes this.
  7. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4
    Your nephews, like everyone else, are entitled to their opinions. But their opinions - along with those of everyone else's - is not the last word on which actor or actress is iconic in a particular role.
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  8. StampidHD280pro Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2005
    star 4
    [Comment removed. ~Sx3] The average person doesn't differentiate between the movies as much as the fans. Unless they've really sat down and watched them in chronological or release order, they know they'e the space movies with Luke or Anakin Skywalker. Both of those names at this point have mainstream recognizability. Really, there was Darth Maul and Queen Amidala that people knew about just by being alive in 1999, but nobody cares about that anymore. People love young Ani because of what he could grow up to be.

    You can't just act like the only thing people remember about Star Wars is the "I AM YOUR FATHER" scene. Yeah, that's out there and it's probably the most famous plot twist in movie history, but there's also so much hype that comes with it that leaves its impact. People know about Ewoks, but can't exactly say why. Consequently, you have sports and news commentators using the word "padawan" in conversation. You can't even say "muggle" is more recognized a word than padawan. Well, at least I wouldn't.

    Is HAYDEN'S Anakin iconic? His posture and the way his carries his clothing is always "Vader's Prowse"-like, and I'm talking about without the suit. His voice is a clear echo of Vader's British accent. He even matches his… vibrato? He pronounces things exactly the way James Earl Jones does as Vader. It's not a "station" it's a "stayehtion"… But the thing I think he was probably cast for, and added to the character was his eyes. In the cartoons and fan art, you frequently see his gaze directed at you the viewer or off in the distance. He's MOODY and so much of it is just Hayden's eyes. So, it's a strange thing, this character. You can't just say Hayden owned it. It's in the writing the directing the costumes the hair and makeup, you know? I will say Hayden has a bit of a more… conventional-looking face than Hammil. There's something about Padme and Anakin that feels a bit like a cookie cutter couple, looks-wise, but that's kind of fitting with the Republic/Senate relationship.
    Last edited by SithStarSlayer, Dec 17, 2013
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  9. Carbon1985 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2013
    star 3
    No need to continue this conversation anymore with comments like that.

    We'll agree to disagree. [face_peace]
    Last edited by SithStarSlayer, Dec 17, 2013
  10. Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 3
    To me, I don't think it is enough that people can recognize the actor as having played the part. Or that they think of the actor when the characters name is mentioned.

    Hayden was the face of Anakin in two movies. Jake was in one and as a young kid. Shaw was just a few minutes.
    So it is not strange that people would think of Hayden when thinking of Anakin Skywalker.

    For a performance to be iconic I think it would need something more.
    Is Liv Tyler's performance of Arwen iconic? If you ask people that have seen the LotR movies about the character of Arwen they would probably think of her. I wouldn't call it iconic.
    Harrison Ford's performance of Indy is iconic to me, not just that people know he played the role but the image of Indy, fedora, jacket, bullwhip is itself iconic. If you just see that image you would think of the character and the actor.
    Christopher Reeve's performance of Superman is also iconic as he is probably the one people would think of when they hear Superman.
    Several other actors have played the part but I think him is the one people know. But more than that is how he played it.

    Or take Dracula, that role has been played by several actors but how many of those are iconic? Bela Lugosi yes, Christopher Lee, I would say yes. Gary Oldman? Not to me.

    Take Han Solo, the character and the way the way Harrison played the role has been imitated many times. So he has been become a sort of model for the "charming rouge" type of character. Particulary in SF movies.
    Yoda has become something of an icon as a representation for wise gurus or teachers.

    So I don't think Haydens performance as Anakin is iconic but not being iconic isn't the same as him doing a bad job of it.
    If I think of Anakin Skywalker, I would probably think of him but that is mainly due to him being the face of Anakin the longest.

    Bye for now.
    Old Stoneface
    Carbon1985 likes this.
  11. T-R- Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2003
    star 4
    let's look at the definition of iconic:
    an icon is:
    So, going by the definition of what is iconic and what is an icon, Hayden (and Anakin in general) is not iconic.

    He is not "famously and distinctively representative of its type" or "a person or thing that is the best example of a certain preofession or some doing."

    As SithStarSlayer said, the decks were stacked against Hayden (and Ewan) based on their roles for fleshing out the characters. Unfortunately, the iconic status is reserved for originals and something either new or distinctive.

    Luke, Han, Leia, Vader, Yoda, Ben are all iconic as they broke ground and are culturally significant and remembered. They set up archetypes for movies that came after. Same can't be said for Hayden's Anakin. Nobody copied it.

    Think Connery as Bond. Iconic. Moore, Craig, et al had good movies, but they aren't iconic like Connery. Same with Hayden.
    Last edited by T-R-, Dec 17, 2013
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  12. Carbon1985 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2013
    star 3
  13. StampidHD280pro Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2005
    star 4
    Not yet anyway. He fits *something* through and through. Fallen messiah? Reluctant hitler? Its bound to be a model of something. Like I said before, the character of Anakin was bound to become Darth Vader. Darth Vader has become nothing short of an icon. So in a sense, that's what Anakin was playing instead of his "own" role.
  14. V-2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 4
    What the ...?

    I'm British and I've never heard of a part of Britain where people speak like James Earl Jones.

    David Prowse, yarp. James Earl Jones? Narp.
    T-R- and Barbecue17 like this.
  15. Barbecue17 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2013
    star 2
    I think this is going to be a "wait and see" kind of thing. Honestly, it's really just too early to tell.

    I often think about certain individuals who may be referred to as icons like Mickey Mouse, Superman, Audrey Hepburn, Clint Eastwood, Arnold as the Terminator- they're people who can eventually be recognized by the public at large even without fully knowing all of the nuances or context of the character. They're immediately recognizable by a large percentage of people because they've in essence become synonymous with popular culture. But it takes time. I think a good test of someone being iconic is how often they are imitated, lampooned, and referenced. Think about how often Marilyn Monroe, Rocky, Rambo, James Dean, and the Terminator are referenced and namedropped in conversations or descriptions. Think about how many sitcoms and parodies use elements from the OT without any explanation.

    The true test is going to be a few years from now: can people make jokes/ references to the prequels without needing to render any explanation? I think the Big Bang Theory has made a few but we'll see. One that comes to my mind is the Friends episode where someone dressed like Leia in her metal bikini. That was probably about 13 years after ROTJ and little had to be explained to set up the joke. If someone is doing something slightly adventerous and I call them Indiana Jones, most people will probably get the reference. If someone looks like they're ready for battle and I say "go get them Rambo," most people will probably get the reference even if they've never seen any of the films.

    Yes, there are always going to be people who don't recognize some of these iconic individuals because we know there are Americans who can't recognize the president of the USA. I think part of icon, perhaps not as a strict dictionary definition, is that something or someone becomes easily recognizable and referenceable even over time. Go to a college poster sale: you can still buy posters of John Belushi in Animal House, Marilyn Monroe, James Dean, Marlon Brando as the GodFather, Darth Vader, and Clint Eastwood as the man with no name. If in 20 years college kids are buying pictures of Anakin (I'm not arguing that they will/ won't be- so please don't accuse me of trolling-) then perhaps we'll have a more definitive answer.
    V-2 likes this.
  16. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    I say it depends on the context. Within the Star Wars culture, he's an icon. Outside of it, he's not - yet. He still hasn't served as a role model for the portrayal of other, more or less well-known, fictional characters, but the day may still come when that happens. When the filmmakers of tomorrow, who grew up with this trilogy, get to work, we'll see what happens.

    Right now, though, he's an icon only in Star Wars land.





    - I wish I'd known him.
    - I wish that I could just... wish away my feelings...

    /LM
  17. SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2003
    star 6
    If there are any more comments about trolling/other users, things won't end well for the offender(s).

    This thread has been warned.
  18. LordThanatos Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2013
    star 1
    A Jedi eating animals.. interesting. Not exactly the view I had of them. I always viewed them as some sort of peaceful, civilized and spiritual buddhists who wouldn't consume other sentient creatures for ethical reasons. Keepers of the peace... respect all life forms.. apparently only if you have a certain level of intelligence.. guess I'm taking philosophy too seriously in a fictional franchise. By the way, is that show good? I've never watched any of the animated SW shows.
  19. Darth_Laudrup Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2004
    star 4
    I am sorry to say that I believe his Anakin will be remembered but sadly not Iconic in any possitive way among the general movie watching crowd.
    Carbon1985 likes this.
  20. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    To take part in the circle of life is not disrespectful. Quite the contrary; to live off of what nature has to offer is only natural. Primates eat plants, fruit and bugs. That's simple reality. To go against that is to break the circle and cause imbalance.
    Besides, bugs are full of nutrients ;)





    - How you get so big, eating food of this kind?
    - Mesa show you. Come on, mesa show you!

    /LM
    Seagoat likes this.
  21. LordThanatos Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2013
    star 1

    Yeah that's what school, parents, media and The Lion King taught me too.
  22. T-R- Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2003
    star 4
    Well, the OP didn't ask us to speculate if he was bound to be a model of something, he asked quite clearly "Is Hayden's Anakin iconic?"

    You're asnwers of "not yet" and "bound to be" answers the question asked by the OP - Hayden's Anakin is NOT iconic.
    SithStarSlayer and Carbon1985 like this.
  23. Force Smuggler Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    Watch the micro-series! It is awesome. Won't take long. Couple of hours max. It's all part of the circle of life. Hakuna Matata and all that.
    LordThanatos likes this.
  24. GGrievous Prequel Trilogy Trivia Version 2.0

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2005
    star 5
    For those who say that Hayden's Anakin can't be iconic because of the wooden acting and horrible dialogue, well I can honestly say that it's not his fault. It's George Lucas's fault. My proof: Watch Shattered Glass and see Hayden's roles prior to Star Wars.

    It's disappointing when people look at Hayden and go:

    [IMG]

    Acting is one thing, and I agree that he could've preformed better, but it's stunning when people over look the director.
    Last edited by GGrievous, Dec 17, 2013
  25. Big_Benn_Klingon Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2013
    star 1
    There is nothing that isn't totally subjective about your opinion and interpretation. I would argue that Anakin is 100% "famously and distinctively representative of its type".

    There really isn't much utility in debate at this point

    Also it's worth noting, I don't think one can separate the Clone Wars (cgi) Anakin from the movie Anakin in the mind of most younger ppl. I think if you were to take CW out of the equation, the story and my opinion would be much different
    Last edited by Big_Benn_Klingon, Dec 17, 2013
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