Is Mara ruining the relationship between Luke and Leia?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by MASTERJEDICALRISSIAN, Dec 18, 2002.

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  1. Jet-Eye-Blah Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 2002
    star 3
    The hatred in this thread is over whelming...

  2. Jedi_Johnson Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2002
    star 5
    Well, after a break I've returned ready to debate. ;) So... here goes:

    Leia is old and wrinkly and gray-haired, while Mara stays young and luscious.

    Well, we've seen how graciously Luke has aged... maybe its a Skywalker family trait to age quickly. ;)

    Leia's government collapses while Mara excels at everything.

    Leia may have created, along with others (Mon Mothma, Ackbar, Fey'lya) the NR government, but it was no longer her government, she said so herself in SbS. Leia said she was done with politics and done with the Senate. That it was no longer her world.

    She then proceeds to say she'd kill anyone who harms Ben.

    I know she wanted to get (I assumed capture, although I'll be the first to admit I may have been wrong) Viqi Shesh, but don't you think that might be an overaggeration on Mara's part? Besides wouldn't any mother kill to save their child?

    J_J
  3. MASTERJEDICALRISSIAN Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 6, 2002
    star 3
    The hatred in this thread is over whelming.

    We don't want alot of people to think like this so as creater of this thread I'm asking nicely for us to tone it down a little.

    Thanks for your views and opinions on this subject. Keep up the good work!

    Thanks! :D
  4. Naccha Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 6, 1999
    star 3
    With Mara, he knows her completely, her deepest hopes, her most hidden fears, all of that (cf. the description of their "Force merger" in the cloning chamber in VOTF); and even after (or because?) he knows all of her, he complete loves and accepts her. In other words, it's total, unconditional love; a spiritual union.

    You know, they (these authors) started out on the right foot with Luke and Mara. But by the time we get to NJO, they really kind of pulverized the relationship. Made Mara too haughty and Luke too weak. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish. They did the same thing with L&L's relationship too. Corrupt the OT characters to allow these new Jedi to take over, to seem more in command. I don't get it ?[face_plain]
  5. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Leia may have created, along with others (Mon Mothma, Ackbar, Fey'lya) the NR government, but it was no longer her government, she said so herself in SbS. Leia said she was done with politics and done with the Senate. That it was no longer her world.

    She also told Mara that Mara was braver than she.

    It may have technically no longer been her government, but she helped build it, only to see it collapse around her.

    I know she wanted to get (I assumed capture, although I'll be the first to admit I may have been wrong) Viqi Shesh, but don't you think that might be an overaggeration on Mara's part? Besides wouldn't any mother kill to save their child?

    She didn't say "kill to save him." She said that anyone who harms Ben, she kills personally. While it's understandable to be protective of her child, it's alarming that a woman who's supposedly a Jedi master says she will kill anyone who harms him. He's undoubtedly going to be harmed many times in his life. Leia endured the death of her child and she didn't fly into a murderous rage -- and she, as the books love to remind us, is "half trained and uncertain in the Force." Mara, a Jedi master, worked herself up into a semi-murderous rage at the mere thought of someone harming Ben.

    You know, they (these authors) started out on the right foot with Luke and Mara. But by the time we get to NJO, they really kind of pulverized the relationship. Made Mara too haughty and Luke too weak. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish. They did the same thing with L&L's relationship too. Corrupt the OT characters to allow these new Jedi to take over, to seem more in command. I don't get it.

    I agree. L/M started off well enough. There was a friendship between Leia and Mara in the "Union" comic. Then suddenly, Leia was demoted; Mara was promoted again and again, Luke became totally focused on Mara; Mara regressed into the insensitive, bad-tempered person she'd been previously, while at the same time, everyone's adoration of her increased exponentially; the OT characters got trashed beyond recognition, and so did their relationships.
  6. Naccha Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 6, 1999
    star 3
    Leia has always been written as one of the most powerful woman in the galaxy. She's sarcastic, brave, strong, resourceful, yet loving, diplomatic, caring and compassionate. I loved her in the OT, she was no princess, in an ordinary sense. She didn't take crap from no one. And no one better mess with any of her loved ones, especially her brother, who always seemed to need her help, since he was always getting himself in trouble. She was always there for him. That relationship, plus the one between the three of them (Han, Leia and Luke) made the OT so special. It made you care for what happened to them. And it continued for many of the following novels. It was a successful formula. People liked to read about what was happening with the big 3.

    So, now DR comes along and decides it's old hat, this treasured relationship between the 3 OT characters. Let's screw it up. They break apart the relationship, I guess for what they deemed was to make the storyline interesting. And at one point, totally broke it apart, even separating Leia and Han. They at least mended that segment, but still left Luke out of the threesome. They could have just added Mara to the threesome, but no, they decided to keep the separation between Luke and Han and Leia. Luke has his own family so he doesn't need Leia anymore. They have kind of made a barrier between if you're a Jedi you're on one side, if you're not (and they consider Leia not) then you're on the other side. At least that's how I see it...
    Anyways, I just had to post. Found this thread on the back pages and decided to put it into circulation again... If it flies... ;)
  7. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Well said, Naccha. Very well said. The NJO has more or less repaired the damage done to H/L's relationship, but the original threesome -- Han, Luke and Leia -- has not been mended. When Leia fell in love with Han, she didn't forget Luke existed, nor did Han. But once Luke married Mara, she became his entire focus. He was so focused on her that he considered it more important to hang around Mara, uselessly, when she did not need him (she was not ill, and her baby was not in any danger), than to be there for his sister when she did need him (when she was captured and tortured). He was too busy sucking face with Mara to spare Leia a thought. And it hasn't gotten better since then. Luke lets Mara be his mouthpiece, and never stands up to her on his own or anyone else's benefit.

    It's sad. Sad that instead of Mara being included in the group, she has split the group in two. But I suppose that's not surprising, considering how selfish, self-centered, and self-absorbed she is.

    And she is. She has to be the focus of attention at all times. She's in labor -- broadcast it to the galaxy! Her nephew, who worshipped the ground she walked on and cared more about her than his own mother, was horribly killed. Does Mara grieve, or even blink? No, she orders Luke to "stop it," because HER SON might be affected! She races across the galaxy and insensitively orders around Anakin's grieving parents, because she's afraid HER SON might have been UPSET by their grief! Oh, and she and Luke are all hot for each other...broadcast that to the galaxy, just like her labor! Only once does she show concern for a woman who was there for her when she was ill, and gave much more to her than she's given back: when she asks, in an offhanded way, "How's Leia?" That's something a self-absorbed person does to try and show she's not self-absorbed.

    Sad. Sad, sad, sad, sad. Sad to see Luke change from a loving, caring, DISCREET person to Mara's marionette.
  8. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    No, she orders Luke to "stop it," because HER SON might be affected!

    She orders the man to stop projecting. Not to "Stop it".

    OWLC
  9. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    She tells Luke, "Stop it! Think of what this will do to Ben!"
  10. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    Yes she does and Luke stops projecting

    OWLC
  11. Devi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 2002
    star 4
    She's in labor -- broadcast it to the galaxy!

    So you think that she was intentionally broadcasting her pain? Can you back up your claim in any way?

    Isn't it much more likely that she was simply not shielding (i.e. not intentionally keeping other Force sensitives from picking up on what she was feeling, which is different from intentionally broadcasting her feelings to them). I can imagine that in that situation, Mara wasn't even aware what others were feeling coming from her through the Force. I can't speak from experience, since I don't have children yet, but those here who are mothers will probably confirm that when you're in labor, you aren't able to think of many other things. Giving birth is an intense thing.

    Add to that the fact that Mara had only just escaped death by an inch, and was still weak (as it is said at the end of the book), and it's very likely that Mara was in no condition to consciously control what others could pick up from her through the Force. She didn't have enough strength and concentration to spare to be able to consciously shield herself, or consciously broadcast anything, for that matter.
  12. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Isn't it much more likely that she was simply not shielding (i.e. not intentionally keeping other Force sensitives from picking up on what she was feeling, which is different from intentionally broadcasting her feelings to them).

    Probably. She's so self-centered that such a thought would never cross her mind. After all, when her kid is briefly missing, she talks about murder and chews out grieving parents. When Leia's son dies, she refuses to wallow in self-pity, and instead shows concern for other people.

    Yet Mara is considered stronger and braver than Leia. Go figure.

    When Leia was in labor -- and she was giving birth to twins -- she didn't broadcast it to the galaxy. And when she was tortured (she almost died, twice) despite being "half trained and uncertain in the Force," as the books love to remind us, she didn't broadcast it to the galaxy. Mara, meanwhile, is a Jedi master, yet lacks the discipline and control to avoid broadcasting her pain to the galaxy.

    Add to that the fact that Mara had only just escaped death by an inch, and was still weak (as it is said at the end of the book), and it's very likely that Mara was in no condition to consciously control what others could pick up from her through the Force. She didn't have enough strength and concentration to spare to be able to consciously shield herself, or consciously broadcast anything, for that matter.

    Wait, I thought her giving birth was what cured her, because she Force-bonded with Luke and with HER SON. She emerged from giving birth and from her disease more youthfully gorgeous than ever.

    Despite all this gushing over Mara's strength and courage, Leia is much stronger than she is. And even though Mara is a Jedi master and Leia is "half-trained and uncertain in the Force," Leia has much more discipline than Mara.

    No wonder Jaina turned into such an arrogant, undisciplined brat in the NJO. She was looking up to and admiring Mara instead of Leia.

    Yes she does and Luke stops projecting

    She did not say "stop projecting." She said, "Stop it!"
  13. Guinastasia Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2002
    star 6
    But that's what she MEANT!!!

    Besides, Mara was in labor, she was sick, she couldn't help it. *shrugs* Remember too, when Leia gave birth, she was a lot younger and it was under much better circumstances.

    *shrugs* Although I do agree that the NJO has done a disservice to Mara's characterization. Well, not all of them. (Allston wrote her pretty good. But then Allston is God)
  14. Jedi_Liz Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2000
    star 6
    Devi made a good point. When Leia was in labor with the twins, she was using pain supressing force abilities to help with the pain. And, we don't know if she did or didn't project her pain. She probably didn't - but she was also a LOT YOUNGER.


    Mara said to stop projecting, not to stop grieving.

    I really wish we had seen her grief for Anakin, there would probably be a lot less resentment.


  15. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Devi made a good point. When Leia was in labor with the twins, she was using pain supressing force abilities to help with the pain. And, we don't know if she did or didn't project her pain. She probably didn't - but she was also a LOT YOUNGER.

    But Mara is a Jedi master. Leia wasn't even a fully trained Jedi when she had Jacen and Jaina.

    Mara said to stop projecting, not to stop grieving.

    She said, "Stop it!" She did not say "Stop projecting!" Then later, when she was racing across the galaxy to save HER SON from...being upset, Luke "felt her terror."

    I really wish we had seen her grief for Anakin, there would probably be a lot less resentment.

    We couldn't have seen what didn't exist. Mara didn't feel any grief. All she cared about was other people's grief upsetting HER SON.
  16. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    Yet Mara is considered stronger and braver than Leia. Go figure.

    When Leia was in labor -- and she was giving birth to twins -- she didn't broadcast it to the galaxy. And when she was tortured (she almost died, twice) despite being "half trained and uncertain in the Force," as the books love to remind us, she didn't broadcast it to the galaxy. Mara, meanwhile, is a Jedi master, yet lacks the discipline and control to avoid broadcasting her pain to the galaxy.


    Since you enjoy looking at SBS I am curious. Would you say that someone who is able to inspire an entire republic to fight harder would be considered brave and courageous even after losing their son?

    Second you bring up Leia giving birth to the twins. Tell me who could Leia have accidently projected too? Since jedi were so plentiful when she gave birth to Jacen and Jaina I mean she obviously was amazing to not have projected her labor pains with her finely honed Jedi skills towards the huge number of jedi that were around. Especially those who were closely related to her.

    She did not say "stop projecting." She said, "Stop it!"

    actually she says "Luke stop!" "you've got to shut it down. Ben will feel you. Think of what this will do to him!" Then Luke goes and dampens his presence in the force. After this he goes ahead and smashes a machine with his fist. Mara does not tell Luke then to stop displaying his anger.

    Wait, I thought her giving birth was what cured her, because she Force-bonded with Luke and with HER SON. She emerged from giving birth and from her disease more youthfully gorgeous than ever.

    It says this where?

    Going back to the original question. I am curious, can we look back further than the NJO to see possible relationship problems between Luke and Leia. Leia had trouble accepting who her father was, she did not wish to join Luke in looking for their mother. Could these events been what had possibly splintered their relationship?

    OWLC

    OWLC
  17. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Since you enjoy looking at SBS I am curious. Would you say that someone who is able to inspire an entire republic to fight harder would be considered brave and courageous even after losing their son?

    Yep. So why isn't she?

    Second you bring up Leia giving birth to the twins. Tell me who could Leia have accidently projected too?

    Luke. Her brother. The son of the Chosen One. If the Solo kids could feel Mara's pain, Luke should've been able to feel Leia's. But he didn't. Leia had the discipline and strength Mara lacked, even though Mara was a Jedi master and Leia wasn't even a Jedi yet.

    Especially those who were closely related to her.

    Mara isn't closely related to the Solo kids. In fact, she isn't related to them at all. Yet they were doubled over in pain, crying, when she was in labor.

    actually she says "Luke stop!" "you've got to shut it down. Ben will feel you. Think of what this will do to him!" Then Luke goes and dampens his presence in the force. After this he goes ahead and smashes a machine with his fist. Mara does not tell Luke then to stop displaying his anger.

    I wonder how much of a neurotic mess Ben is going to grow up being, with such an insanely overprotective mother, who insists he be shielded from everything.

    It says this where?

    Let's see...the references to her red-gold hair (no gray), her still-radiant complexion, the fact that she's drawn as a 20-year-old pinup on various book covers, that she's never, ever described as middle-aged...meanwhile, Leia, who's younger, is described as middle-aged, her wrinkles and gray hair are pointedly referred to; she looks old on the book covers...

    Going back to the original question. I am curious, can we look back further than the NJO to see possible relationship problems between Luke and Leia. Leia had trouble accepting who her father was,

    (Spoiler warning for "Tatooine Ghost")














    She seems to have done so by the end of "Tatooine Ghost,"














    (End spoiler)

    and she named her son Anakin.

    she did not wish to join Luke in looking for their mother. Could these events been what had possibly splintered their relationship?

    No. It didn't hurt their relationship any that I saw. What hurt their relationship is Luke's obsessive focus on Mara, to the exclusion of everyone else.
  18. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    Yep. So why isn't she?

    Didn't the whole republic listen to her and fight on? Doesn't that tell you how much they respect and revere her?

    Luke. Her brother. The son of the Chosen One. If the Solo kids could feel Mara's pain, Luke should've been able to feel Leia's. But he didn't. Leia had the discipline and strength Mara lacked, even though Mara was a Jedi master and Leia wasn't even a Jedi yet.

    Where does it say he didn't? Plus you just said that Leia had the discipline. How can you know this? Leia was barely trained in the force at the time and had trouble with many simple jedi tricks. This also means she lacked the knowledge to tap into the force the way A jedi master does. Wouldn't someone who was barely trained and not able to tap into the force not project a great deal through it?

    Mara isn't closely related to the Solo kids. In fact, she isn't related to them at all. Yet they were doubled over in pain, crying, when she was in labor.

    Luke and Mara are not related and yet they have quite an intense force bond. Why wouldn't an Aunt who has been accepted into the inner circle of a family have a pretty close bond?

    I wonder how much of a neurotic mess Ben is going to grow up being, with such an insanely overprotective mother, who insists he be shielded from everything.

    You mean like a mother who tried to prevent her children from flying star fighters even though they were easily some of the best pilots on the planet? Or a mother who freaked out when her daughter did not arrive with them at a hyperspace jump point, even though she was told it was a test?

    Let's see...the references to her red-gold hair (no gray), her still-radiant complexion, the fact that she's drawn as a 20-year-old pinup on various book covers, that she's never, ever described as middle-aged...meanwhile, Leia, who's younger, is described as middle-aged, her wrinkles and gray hair are pointedly referred to; she looks old on the book covers...

    Yes cause book covers are always truthful. As for the book covers. Other than the BP book cover I can not think of another where she "looks old" and even that cover only makes her look old from the gray on her hair.

    and she named her son Anakin.

    According to everything we have been told she did that to redeem what he had done in the end. Not to accept the evils he had done.

    No. It didn't hurt their relationship any that I saw. What hurt their relationship is Luke's obsessive focus on Mara, to the exclusion of everyone else.

    Isn't Luke hurt by Leia not wishing to know more about their mother? In the subsequent books after that trilogy we do not see a great amount of interaction between Leia and Luke. How do you know it did not hurt things? Has it ever been stated otherwise?

    OWLC
  19. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Didn't the whole republic listen to her and fight on? Doesn't that tell you how much they respect and revere her?

    And isn't that about the only time in the entire NJO? The rest of the time, the people she's fought for and beside can't seem to deride her enough for her mistakes.

    Where does it say he didn't?

    Leia is in labor and Luke doesn't show any kind of reaction to it.

    Plus you just said that Leia had the discipline. How can you know this? Leia was barely trained in the force at the time and had trouble with many simple jedi tricks.

    She knew enough to use it to help her pain, and to calm the babies' minds.

    This also means she lacked the knowledge to tap into the force the way A jedi master does. Wouldn't someone who was barely trained and not able to tap into the force not project a great deal through it?

    And wouldn't a Jedi master like Mara know enough to not project a great deal through it?

    Luke and Mara are not related and yet they have quite an intense force bond. Why wouldn't an Aunt who has been accepted into the inner circle of a family have a pretty close bond?

    And why wouldn't they be more closely bonded to their mother? How come they're doubled over in pain, crying, when precious Mara is in labor, but not when their mother experiences pain many times worse? How come Anakin doesn't spare a thought to his own mother when she's recovering, but frets and cries when precious Mara is in labor?

    You mean like a mother who tried to prevent her children from flying star fighters even though they were easily some of the best pilots on the planet? Or a mother who freaked out when her daughter did not arrive with them at a hyperspace jump point, even though she was told it was a test?

    Even though she had given them up for their own protection, at Luke's suggestion, when they were babies despite it breaking her heart? And even though they were almost fully grown and weren't neurotic messes?

    Yes cause book covers are always truthful.

    Evidently the readers think so, with remarks like "Mara's a smokin' hottie!" And evidently the writers think so, because they write Mara as looking like she does on the book covers -- young, gray-free hair, no wrinkles.

    As for the book covers. Other than the BP book cover I can not think of another where she "looks old" and even that cover only makes her look old from the gray on her hair.

    The Japanese "Rebirth" cover. Leia looks like a guy, while Mara looks like a pinup.

    "Rebel Stand" -- Leia has wrinkles, gray streaks, and crow's feet. And other than that, I can't think of any covers she's even been on.

    According to everything we have been told she did that to redeem what he had done in the end. Not to accept the evils he had done.

    Oh, I think she had more or less made peace with her parentage.

    Isn't Luke hurt by Leia not wishing to know more about their mother? In the subsequent books after that trilogy we do not see a great amount of interaction between Leia and Luke. How do you know it did not hurt things? Has it ever been stated otherwise?

    And how do you know it hurt things? Has it been so stated?

    Leia still cared about Luke after that. It's Luke who couldn't have cared less about Leia, especially after he married Mara.
  20. Stackpole_The_Hobbit Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 6
    We couldn't have seen what didn't exist. Mara didn't feel any grief.

    Can you prove this? Or is this your interpretation being presented as fact? Clarify, please.

    Thank you :)
  21. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    And isn't that about the only time in the entire NJO? The rest of the time, the people she's fought for and beside can't seem to deride her enough for her mistakes.

    They speak of her like this all the time?

    Leia is in labor and Luke doesn't show any kind of reaction to it.

    It cuts to him while she is giving birth? It shows him pacing and such?

    She knew enough to use it to help her pain, and to calm the babies' minds

    Yes she did and she did a wonderful job with that.

    And wouldn't a Jedi master like Mara know enough to not project a great deal through it?

    Under normal circumstances I would say yes, but after having just fought off a life threatening disease which has eaten away at you for almost a year if not longer. Something which you had let turn you into a grey sickly being while protecting your child. I would think some things may slip your mind.

    And why wouldn't they be more closely bonded to their mother? How come they're doubled over in pain, crying, when precious Mara is in labor, but not when their mother experiences pain many times worse? How come Anakin doesn't spare a thought to his own mother when she's recovering, but frets and cries when precious Mara is in labor?

    How do you know he didn't? We never get his side of things while Leia is being tortured.

    Even though she had given them up for their own protection, at Luke's suggestion, when they were babies despite it breaking her heart? And even though they were almost fully grown and weren't neurotic messes?

    I am not exactly sure where you were going with this.

    Evidently the readers think so, with remarks like "Mara's a smokin' hottie!" And evidently the writers think so, because they write Mara as looking like she does on the book covers -- young, gray-free hair, no wrinkles.

    Other than a bit of gray in one book cover I have never seen any wrinkles on Leia. Some have said Leia looks like a guy on the japanese rebirth cover, but if she does she looks like a young guy. At the same time Tahiri looks like she is in her late teens so again I say, why should we take the covers seriously. If we did then the remnant cover would make Luke and Mara out to look rather different than most have seen them before and jedi eclipse has han looking like some one in desperate need of a nose job. Do you let covers dictate what you think of a character?

    And how do you know it hurt things? Has it been so stated?

    Luke is hurt that Leia did not wish to know about their parents.

    Leia still cared about Luke after that. It's Luke who couldn't have cared less about Leia, especially after he married Mara.

    Luke thinks constantly about Leia and his family during the Corellian trilogy. He has a huge internal struggle when he has to decide whether to rescue Mara or stay and help with the Camaas issue. He let the force decide that time. Just as he let the force decide what he has done from the beginning of Star Wars. He let the force fire the torpedos. Its been a constant part of the man's life. Perhaps its the force which has ruined Leia and Luke's relationship.

    OWLC
  22. Elori Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2002
    star 4
    Where does it say he didn't?

    Leia is in labor and Luke doesn't show any kind of reaction to it.


    I don't know about anakin, but for the twins, luke wasn't there, and hasn't had much training past yoda when she gave birth.. he did feel it however, if not something grand since he was so far away with the Noghri.


    edit: I might be mistaken about him feeling it, I haven't read the thrawn trilogy in awhile, but I wouldn't expect him to feel something like that when he'd only been practicing on his own for a few years and hadn't fine tuned as well as later on. :)
  23. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    They speak of her like this all the time?

    When?

    It cuts to him while she is giving birth? It shows him pacing and such?

    Does it show him doubled over in pain, crying? Thinking of how he has to get to her?

    Yes she did and she did a wonderful job with that.

    Wow...Leia gets credit for something.

    Under normal circumstances I would say yes, but after having just fought off a life threatening disease which has eaten away at you for almost a year if not longer. Something which you had let turn you into a grey sickly being while protecting your child. I would think some things may slip your mind.

    And if she's so sick and weak, how come the Solo kids could feel her pain so strongly?

    How do you know he didn't? We never get his side of things while Leia is being tortured.

    Of course not, because all that mattered was Luke sucking face with Mara. And Anakin didn't spare a single thought to Leia when she was recovering from her torture. He was too busy thinking about Mara, Mara, Mara.

    I am not exactly sure where you were going with this.

    Leia's kids are grown. Ben is an infant, with an insanely overprotective mother who wants to foam pad everything around him. He's going to grow up into a neurotic mess with that kind of mother, completely unable to handle distress or emotion or pain. He's also going to grow up thinking he and only he matters, what with his mother not caring when his cousin was killed, only caring about what other people's grief would do to him.

    Other than a bit of gray in one book cover I have never seen any wrinkles on Leia.

    Then you saw a different cover of "Rebel Stand" than I did.

    Some have said Leia looks like a guy on the japanese rebirth cover, but if she does she looks like a young guy.

    While Mara looks like a 19-year-old Playboy centerfold.

    If we did then the remnant cover would make Luke and Mara out to look rather different than most have seen them before and jedi eclipse has han looking like some one in desperate need of a nose job.

    Yep. While Mara consistently looks like a young pinup, the other characters are all over the map.

    Do you let covers dictate what you think of a character?

    No. I loathe Mara because of the rotten, disgusting way she acts in the books, while at the same time everyone adores her. That she's made to look like a young pinup on the books while other characters are drawn unflatteringly only adds to my loathing.

    Luke is hurt that Leia did not wish to know about their parents.

    Does it state that her wish to not know about their parents hurt their relationship?

    Luke thinks constantly about Leia and his family during the Corellian trilogy. He has a huge internal struggle when he has to decide whether to rescue Mara or stay and help with the Camaas issue. He let the force decide that time. Just as he let the force decide what he has done from the beginning of Star Wars. He let the force fire the torpedos. Its been a constant part of the man's life. Perhaps its the force which has ruined Leia and Luke's relationship.

    No, it's Mara. Luke evidently cared about Leia up until he married Mara. Since he married Mara, all he cares about is her. He envelopes Mara in his love when she's upset, but doesn't offer any kind of comfort to his sister when she's tortured, being too busy sucking face with Mara. He sits there mute while Mara orders around his sister. He doesn't stand up for Leia when Mara rips into her. He judges Leia but he never judges Mara, although Mara has done a lot more to be judged for than Leia.
  24. Jedi_Liz Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2000
    star 6
    While Mara looks like a 19-year-old Playboy centerfold.

    She's not naked on ANY cover. And she didn't look 19 on the AMERICAN Rebirth cover. She certainly looked OLDER than 20 on that cover.


    I have no idea what a typical 20 year old looks like, but the japanese Rebel Dream cover picture of Mara is certainly **older** than 20. And how does this have to do with the original topic?


    Luke would have gone after Leia, but he learned from the Cloud City experience. Instead, through the Force, he was helping Leia's children find her. It wouldn't have done him any good to get injured as well as Leia. Who would have contacted Han then?


    Mara wasn't in immediate danger at the end of Balance Point, but there was still the chance that her disease could come back.







  25. Devi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 2002
    star 4
    (Shelley:) It cuts to him while she is giving birth? It shows him pacing and such?

    Does it show him doubled over in pain, crying? Thinking of how he has to get to her?


    Had Leia only just barely escaped death at that point, with Luke not even knowing that she had overcome her deadly disease (like the Solo kids had no idea at that point in Rebirth that Mara had been healed from her disease)? Isn't it that she was perfectly healthy, safe and sound, with Han at her side to support her?


    (Shelley:) While Mara looks like a 19-year-old Playboy centerfold.

    (Jedi_Liz:) She's not naked on ANY cover. And she didn't look 19 on the AMERICAN Rebirth cover. She certainly looked OLDER than 20 on that cover.

    Exactly.
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