ST Is the Emperor really dead?

"The Dark Side is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural", Palps to Anakin, Rots. There may be a deeper reason to have this line included in the movie than just for Anakin's sake, and he is talking about the power of immortality. At the time of Rotj, Lucas was done with post Rotj stuff so he didn't need to worry about how he would bring Sids back but now with the last of the prequels and, obviously with the ST at least in the back of his mind, he introduces this concept to not only lure Anakin to the Dark Side but to also set up Sids' return in a future ST movie. This is where we could see Sids "become" ancient, like he was originally intended to be, according to making of Rotj book. Maybe we're seeing the beginning of Sids becoming ancient instead of catching him at the end. Now, how they go about it?..........

 

Nowhere do any of the movies say or even suggest that he's not ancient. For all we know, he killed Plagueis in 800 BBY (if Plagueis even existed).

 

You argue this point very well. In fact, I'm surprised so many people think Anakin really loved Padme. She was not a person to him, but a possession.

So marrying again makes perfect sense. Anakin has always been seeking that fantasy woman (angel), the lost love object, an impossible object. That obsession wouldn't die with Padme, but grow ever stronger.

Mystery_Roach: It's a good argument that we've only seen Anakin interested (or obsessed, as Pevra points out) in Padme in the movies, and so the sudden appearance of a second wife would seem surprising to the audience. But I think Pevra and I are pointing out that that kind of surprise could be really cool. As she said, it would create tension and mystery and we'd want to know how something like this could have happened (like the revelation of Vader being Luke's father).

But a good counter to your point, in addition, is to point out that the ST sort of has these kinds of issues built into it. For example, we might see Luke with a wife in the ST although we never saw anyone other than Leia who he was interested in. This wife will just suddenly appear, as well as Luke's children (if he has them). There might be a lot of things that happened offscreen between ROTJ and E7 that we don't know about, so they'll all be surprising in the sense that they're new. Some might be surprising developments as well.

But I think Pevra really nails it when she points out that Anakin-Vader's love for Padme was not real love. Real love is healthy, not possessive.

 

He's dead as a doornail. It would be completely unoriginal and shallow for numerous reasons if he was resurrected. Now a sinister force ghost or Sith Holocron presence to guide and train the new villain would probably work. But not much else....

 

I honor of the finally reunited Monty Python, I'd like to say one more time that the Emperor is an ex-Emperor. I believe that this is also the 25th time someone references that skit on this thread. Woo hoo!

 

True, but he also never mentions the good ol' days either and this is only if you go by the movies, which I do 90% of the time but...... If you go by the Palgueis book, he killed Plagueis right before/after he was named chancellor. Plagueis found Palpatine and trained him like 10-20 years before TPM, because in the book Palps knows and talks with Padme's parents about becoming queen, while Mr. Plaqueis is still alive. Before you hit me with lightning, I'm not a big EU guy, but because Plagueis dealt directly with a significant movie character, you know that book has GL's hands all over it. It might as well be a companion piece to the movies. Or, just have him come back and say something like, I am ancient evil incarnate and can never be truly killed. Stemmed, held up for a few decades, yeah sure, but I will always return at some point. This way it doesn't invalidate Anakin's prophecy either.

 

Funny, I said the same thing about bringing back Khan.

 

Well I've argued against Luke being married and/or having children on the exact same principle, so at least I'm consistent.

As for Anakin's love for Padme, it might not have been the healthiest kind of love, but I don't think that makes it any less real. My feeling is that in his own way, he did truly love her. I've had both kinds of love, and I know the difference, but I wouldn't call one realer than the other.

Anyway, it probably wouldn't sit right with me, but who am I to get in the way of anyone having fun with their speculation? I've thrown plenty of ideas out there that I don't even like myself.

 

That makes you my kind of speculator. Let the imagination flow, imo, and maybe something cool will jump out. Possibly in Vader armor. Or maybe not.

 

And that was true.
The main thing with STID wasn't so much that Khan was in it, more than the story was really just a remake of WOK itself which wasn't very original. Bringing back great villains is a common thing in movies, especially main villains. Bond brought back Blofeld numerous times, and Doctor Who has done that was the Daleks repeatedly.

Similarly I don't see a problem with bringing back Palpatine, it would mainly depend how they do it.

 

I still haven't seen STID, but it seems to me that a lot of the problem with bringing back Khan lies the fact that by resetting the timeline, you lose the whole "Wrath" element that made the character interesting in the original movie.

 

They changed the character so much I didn't mind it. And while some people think they followed the old plot too closely, I thought they deviated from it nicely. Khan isn't really even the major villain of the film anymore. It's Fleet Admiral Alexander Marcus/starfleet.

 

I can't believe people are still asking this question:

 

Uh...

 

That pic would apply to any Sith, not just Palpatine.

 

Crap, I totally wasn't thinking when I posted that

 

I agree. Palpatine is a fantastic, iconic villain, and if he were to return I would hope he would be a shadow of his former self. Otherwise it is difficult to understand why we should care to fear for our heroes safety in the midst of this innocuous threat, with which was dealt, defeated and resolved in Episode VI. Might he create enough doubt in the minds of the celebrants to suspend the belief that our heroes might not vanquish him? Or would vanquishing him seem 'all too easy' and predictable? I've seen that movie. Give me another.

 

There are several things working for bringing back Sidious as the overall puppet master lurking in the shadows.

The way he was designed in ROTJ made him feel like he thought he was going to live forever long before there was any serious talk of cheating death. The man looked ancient and was concerned about his next servant rather than his legacy. Plus with Luke telling Yoda "you can't die" and Yoda replying with "strong am I with the force, but not that strong" and then proceeding to tell Luke not to underestimate the powers of the Emperor, it ends up accidentally working rather well.

With the PT came talk of actually cheating death. It's a power we have yet to really see displayed since force ghosts don't physically count. It's an unnatural ability and who better to use it on than Sidious? With so many villains dying in ROTJ, sparing one wouldn't hurt.

It would also make his apparent retraction in ROTS when Vader was kneeling before him that much more sinister. Plus it would add a new twist on "if we work together, I know we can discover the secret." I'd call Vader tossing him down the shaft TEAMWORK.



So I am not all that opposed to the idea. Though he doesn't need to be all over episode 7 or even in it at all for this to play out. Establishing a new Vader or what Maul could have been would make for some good groundwork. Or at least if he's in it, we don't have to know its him. Theoretically his body could be something different and maybe his voice too for the time being.

 

He is not fantastic. On the oh so popular villain lists, he doesn't feature or has a low rank. But aside from his lack of popularity compared to Vader, he is also an incredibly flat character. Pure Id, but not in a novel, innovative form like the Joker, but rather as the stereotypical darthk sorcerer in black robes like in any other fantasy story. Additionally, he is entirely predictable. He will just do whatever is most evil at the moment.

 

And that is why he's so cool, he just oozes evil its how to describe it... Delicious

 

That's what makes Palpatine a good villain. Not only does he want to be evil, he relishes it and he wants to cause others to fall as well. That's what separates him from other dark wizards. They want to kill you, he wants to turn you.

I think he is dead, but there are ways to bring him back. If executed PROPERLY, I would not have a problem with it.

 

I'll render it that Sidious is a classic villain that helps define StarWars...I'll give him that. But after SIX EPISODES SPANNING NEARLY THREE DECADES of film, you'd think that his physical presence is over. Sidious can still have an influence as a force ghost or something, but what I'm looking for is a whole new Sith villain that we can grow familiar with and enjoy for the next trilogy or so. I want creativity....creativity that works of course.

 

I'm pushing more for Sith Holocron than Palpy Force Ghost. Even Force Ghost I'm kinda on the fence about if only because Sidious isn't supposed to figure out how to cheat death. On the flipside, if his afterlife is really, really, really nasty and while he's a ghost he's a hellfire angry spirit I would be okay with that.

But, really, I wouldn't put it past Sidious to lay out entire tomes about the Dark Side with his own interactive Sidious hologram to chat with. Which the bad guy can fall into a hole and find then immediately start shooting lightning from his fingertips.