Isn't It About Time The US Stopped Killing Innocents?

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by KaineDamo, Jul 2, 2002.

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  1. Warsloth Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2002
    star 1
    I find it quite comical that someone got a 24 hour ban on my account... you can call me whatever you want, I just have one thing to say to you, and I have said it quite a bit... arguing on the internet is like participating in the special olympics, whether you win or lose, you are still a retard...
  2. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Post zee picture. I think they'd like it. ;)
  3. Yodave27 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2001
    star 4
    Lock this please, it's completley biased and one sided. The title is also completley offensive. Oh but wait, it won't get locked, well if it won't then I'm sure my:

    Why does the rest of the world support mindless killers thread won't get locked either. In fact, let me go make that...
  4. Jarik Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 2000
    star 4
    "And don't say "it's different because of the war" because that's bs. War doesn't make cheering for civilian deaths acceptable."

    They were cheering because we were just about to win the war not because of the civilians' deaths.
  5. sharkdawg Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 16, 2000
    star 4
    And what about all those who cheered when they found out about what happened at the World Trade Center? Oh, that's right, they were just expressing themselves freely. Or when the American soldier was seen being dragged through the streeets in Somalia? What about that?




  6. imzadi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 19, 2000
    star 4
    It doesn't make it right. A miniscule percentage of people doing reprehensable things does not mean that the entire region is guilty.

    Furthermore, I'd be careful when saying "Isn't it about time terrorists stopped killing civilians?" because that is implying that "US" and "terrorists" are interchangable.

    Also, holding up 9/11 as an example is not helping the situation. You killed our civilians so it's not incredibly wrong for us to kill yours? By killing civilians, even when it's an accident, the people there see it as no different than a terrorist attack and the hatred for America will grow. Afghanistan is not guilty of terrorist attacks against America, they allowed the terrorist who is to stay there, just like half a dozen other countries. The civilians there are just as much victims as people killed in 9/11 and their families, if not more so because they have lived in terror for decades.

    If the West wants the cycle to stop, some sensativity is needed.
  7. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Yes, but this opinion is that only the U.S. kills civilians and he neglects that terrorists do the same thing, but on purpose. Or at least that's the way his thread topic and some of his posts have been phrased.
  8. KaineDamo Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2002
    star 5
    Wether terrorists kill innocent people or not is not the point here. Of course they kill innocent people, thats what they do. There is a huge difference between terrorists killing innocent people, which is of course wrong, and a government killing people, even if it is accidental. You need to take responsibility whenever it happens and stop trying to cover it up or justify it by saying "well they killed some of ours too". And for goodness sake have some compassion, and stop acting like their deaths are their own fault and that it doesn't matter, which some of you have been doing. America needs to be very careful that it doesn't make some bad mistakes that could lead it down a very dark path.
  9. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Wether terrorists kill innocent people or not is not the point here.

    Sure it is, since you're giving the U.S. a class in how not to kill people.

    Of course they kill innocent people, thats what they do. There is a huge difference between terrorists killing innocent people, which is of course wrong, and a government killing people, even if it is accidental.

    Yes, there is, we apologize for it, they don't. And if it's accidental that usually implies that they didn't mean for it to happen in the first place. Which of course terrorists do.

    You need to take responsibility whenever it happens and stop trying to cover it up or justify it by saying "well they killed some of ours too". And for goodness sake have some compassion, and stop acting like their deaths are their own fault and that it doesn't matter, which some of you have been doing.

    Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't we apologize for that foul up or was that my imagination? Actually if they're firing in the air while pilots are on patrol, they certainly aren't saying "Please don't fire on us, American pilot, it's tradition."

    America needs to be very careful that it doesn't make some bad mistakes that could lead it down a very dark path.

    Hmm.....if we did it your way we would be on a dark path allowing crap like terrorist bombings to happen. I think the ends justify the means in this case. I feel bad that they died, but they're not even supposed to have guns. Remember that nice civilian disarming policy that Afghanistan was supposed to implement?

  10. Yodave27 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2001
    star 4
    You need to take responsibility whenever it happens and stop trying to cover it up or justify it by saying "well they killed some of ours too".


    Um, didn't President Bush offer his condolences to the families of those killed? What else do you want the US government to do? It was an accident, and unfortunate. I feel bad for those who died, but what else can you do? Do you want to see the pilot dragged through the streets? I don't understand where you're coming from.

    And if your main complaint is a few people on this board, I hope you realize that not only are they a minority on this board, but in America..

    EDIT:
    And I still feel that this thread should be locked. It asks a one-sided question that only has one answer. And its extremely broad and makes gross-generalizations.

    Like I said before, maybe my
    "Why does the rest of the world continue to allow the support of terrorism to continue?'" thread to be opened. Its just as broad and one-sided as this. I expect some fairness here, Bane.
  11. KaineDamo Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2002
    star 5
    Hey, if American civillians can have guns then why not Afghanistans? Its one rule for one person and an entirely different rule for the other.

    Theres no doubt that no matter what the results of the investigation are, all involved will still get off scot free.

    Just remember guys... terrorists act outside of government, they stand for everything immoral and wrong about society. Because no matter how bad your situation is, blowing things up and killing people isn't the way to get your point across. Your government is supposed to be civilised, its supposed to stand for freedom, its supposed to stand for democracy and whats right. Act like it! Thats all i ask.
  12. Ramius Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 3
    How else do you think we are supposed to fight the terrorists? When someone is willing to go blow himself up in a crowded area to kill civilians, do you think it is going to be easy reasoning with that person? Bush did try to reason with them, and if he had waited longer to try a diplomatic solution, that would have given more time to the terrorists to train, plan, and undertake more attacks on civilians. The only way to neutralize these people is to kill them, because they don't want to talk to us, and they sure as hell want to kill us.
  13. Yodave27 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2001
    star 4
    Hey, if American civillians can have guns then why not Afghanistans? Its one rule for one person and an entirely different rule for the other.

    Becuase if an American shot an AK-47 into the air in the middle of a war zone and this happened, the result would be the same.

    And it seems to me that whenever the US maes mistakesm you automatically go into, "Oh, look at the USA, its not perfect, ha it made a mistake, look at its mistakes, look!!!!"

    Now if our government made a mistake like this and didn't apologize, you have every right to complain, but they did so your argument is mush.

    And comparing the US to the Empire in Star Wars, well its idiotic.
  14. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Hey, if American civillians can have guns then why not Afghanistans? Its one rule for one person and an entirely different rule for the other.

    Theres no doubt that no matter what the results of the investigation are, all involved will still get off scot free.



    Because there's a difference, our right to bear arms never put our nation into chaos. And who says they'll get away with what they did? If it's proved to be an accident, they will, if it isn't then they'll spend time in the jail.


  15. JediLord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 15, 2000
    star 4
    Isn't it about time we stopped pretending that the culture over there is wrong? I know some cultures are different, but any culture where women are oppressed to the extent that if they reject a man's advances they could be locked away, or have their clitoris cut off against their will, or where killing civilians is a thing to celebrate, needs to be slapped around.
    I know you will think me crazy, but we have to admit that something inherent in the Muslim religion makes SOME people become fantatical. Our way of life is better than theirs. We are trying to help them. Sometimes people die. it happens.
  16. KaineDamo Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2002
    star 5
    I can't believe you just said that about Muslims. Do you know anything about the Muslim religion?? You quite obviously don't. I suggest you do some research into it. There are fanatics in every religion. Just look at christians. What you said is extremely ignorant. And don't kid yourself, the US would have been quite happy to let the Taliban rule Afghanistan if it wasn't for Spet. 11.
  17. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    A few points.

    1. Do not confuse the term civilian with non combatent. If you want me to explain the difference I will.
    2. Another important semantic difference. True the US has killed non combatents, but it hasn't atacked them. The difference being that they haven't knowingly targeted them as the terrorist did on 9/11.
  18. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
  19. JediLord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 15, 2000
    star 4
    Ok, let's look at Joes Padilla. It was only after he became a Muslim that he decided to kill Americans. Doesn't that tell you something? I did not say ALL Muslims. But enough of that religion in that region of the world is too intent on killing other people. Christians, who piss me off too, don't even compare. If you can't see the difference, then it is YOU who are ignorant.
  20. Vaderbait Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 26, 2001
    star 6
    It's not the religion that is bad, I think it's just that more mainstream terrorists cling to it and spread the word than any other religion.


    Also, what makes you think that if an American shot at an invading force that he wouldn't be shot as well?

    Americans don't TARGET non-military targets, some may die in accidents. If we are attacked, we have no choice but to defend ourselves, regardless of if it's military vs. civilians. Military men have their lives to protect, just as civilians do.

    I fail to see how this makes the American military bloodthirsty. It does seem most "foreigners" are really reaching for reasons to critisize us Americans, and they're not picking the most obvious ones.
  21. KaineDamo Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2002
    star 5
    Aren't there any Muslims on this thing? If there are, defend yourself for goodness sake. Its such an unfair generalization your giving to Muslims. You might as well say "c'mon, you have to admit that alot of black people take drugs and shoot peope and live in the hood, there must be something wrong in their culture that teaches them this". There is no more violence in the Muslim religion taught than in any other religion. Jeez.
  22. JediLord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 15, 2000
    star 4
    Once agian I did not say ALL Muslims. There is a faction that wants to destroy this country. Why? Because they believe it is part of their religion. you tell me different without lying.
  23. Kit' Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 30, 1999
    star 5
    Yes, but there have been large factions of Christians who have gone and killed other people. You are deciding that a tiny percentage (and I mean tiny) are speaking for the whole, in other words you are generalising.

    Do some research before you make comments like that.

    Kithera
  24. KaineDamo Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2002
    star 5
    What about the IRA? They kill people on behalf of their religion, but is that because theres something in the Catholic religion thats messed up that makes them that way?
    The Taliban have taken their religion and twisted it to suit their own means. Its not the religions fault.
  25. Vaderbait Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 26, 2001
    star 6
    Aren't there any Muslims on this thing? If there are, defend yourself for goodness sake.

    yes, we know you like to twist words and not understand events so you can attack people. No one here has attacked Muslims. [face_plain] In fact, if you bothered to read our posts you'd see that we are always referring to the extremists. I'd be doing the same thing if a bin Laden was Catholic (as I am).

    Now please, stop trying to turn us against each other and leave and read up on new material. [face_plain]
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