PT It's all Obi Wan's fault

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Gorrie-Wan kenobi, Oct 25, 2013.

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  1. Gorrie-Wan kenobi Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2013
    However unlikely it was that Anakin would survive after losing both legs and being set on fire, it still happened, and Obi Wan is to blame.

    A true Jedi would have lightsabered Anakin's head off for the greater good, and then lightsabered himself, to prevent himself from joining The Dark Side.

    It is for this reason that I believe Obi Wan should be stripped of master Jedi status
  2. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    I'm sure poor Obi-Wan was in shock at that point, but you're right, he should have put Anakin out of his misery.

    Hindsight is 20/20, though. I can't imagine what it would be like to go through what Obi did with regards to loosing his best friend in that way (not to the loss of his entire Jedi family). Who knows? Maybe there was so much hurt in his heart that cutting Anakin down in that moment would have been an act of vengeance, which we know is taboo for the Jedi.
    Last edited by Son of a Bith, Oct 25, 2013
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  3. CT-867-5309 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    He's jealous! He's holding me back!

    /thread
  4. Derek4799 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 2013
    You weren't exposed to kill a unarmed person by the Jedi code even though Anakin did with Douko and probably the women and children of the sand people; and Mace Windo tried to with Palps.

    If Obi Wan would of killed himself and Anakin the Emperor would of token another apprentice in so he can hunt the remaining Jedi left. And that being said Luke would of never gone with Obi Wan to learned the way of the force and that the rebels probably would of lost at the first death star because it was Luke that destroyed it when everyone else failed. Leah wouldn't be alive because she was to be exicuted or if the rebels somehow would of managed to destroy the death star she would of died there. Then there would be no hope for the rebels then.
  5. Vaapad Master Daeg Tynan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2013
    star 3
    I understand what you're saying and agree... however I have a hard time rationalizing that with Windu's quote in ROTS... "he's too dangerous to be left alive..." would Kenobi not have been tutored under the same philosophies and pulled on that argument??
  6. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    Yes, Windu's words do add to the discussion (excellent point). We've debated here whether or not it would have been right (according to the Jedi way) for Windu to cut down Palpatine in a similar fashion.

    I don't think the Windu/Palpatine situation is necessarily the same as the Obi/Anakin situation (though it may be). On-the-spot execution may have been right in one instance and not the other. Or, it may be wrong in both circumstances, or right in both circumstances. The "morality" of killing is tricky stuff, especially when talking about a group like the Jedi.

    No matter how you "slice" it, they were dealing with a cluster-f#%k. I'm sure Obi-Wan relived that moment a million times while in hiding on Tatooine, and had a lot of regrets.
    Last edited by Son of a Bith, Oct 25, 2013
  7. Vaapad Master Daeg Tynan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2013
    star 3
    No doubt... I just wonder what teachings (if there were any) within the Jedi Code allow for such a distinction... and how (or if) it would apply to Kenobi's thinking at the time where he defeated Anakin.
    Last edited by Vaapad Master Daeg Tynan, Oct 25, 2013
  8. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    Me too ;)
  9. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    If an organization were to strip me of a status for not committing suicide, that organization is not worth my membership.

    I'd say it's Anakin's fault for turning to the Dark Side in the first place. If he hadn't done that, Mustafar would have never happened.

    I did once consider putting "It's all Obi-Wan's fault!" in my signature once though, in response to a long convoluted conversation in which Obi-Wan was blamed for Satine Kryze's death, Anakin's turn, getting himself captured on Geonosis, Jar-Jar being annoying and the lack of good liquor in the Star Wars universe.
  10. son_of_skywalker03 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2003
    star 4
    I see that as Windu veering from the Jedi path to his and the galaxy's detriment. I see Obi-Wan not killing Anakin there as NOT veering from the Jedi path to his and the galaxy's detriment.
  11. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    I tend to agree.
  12. Alienware Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 19, 2013
    star 1
    Obi Wan not killing Anakin is one of the most important moments in the Saga. Sort of like Bilbo not killing Gollum in The Hobbit. :)
    In both cases, it proves to be an act of character and one of many crucial points towards fulfilling the prophecy. From my point of view, anyway ;)
  13. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4



    I feel that Windu, Yoda AND Obi-Wan had all veered from the Jedi path in their determination to preserve the Order and its position within the Republic.

    And by the way, leaving Anakin to slowly burn to death on a lava bank is not my idea of staying true to the Jedi path.
    Last edited by DRush76, Oct 25, 2013
  14. son_of_skywalker03 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2003
    star 4
    He didn't strike down a defenseless person. However, he didn't help him either. Though, Anakin was just as likely at that point to still attempt to kill Obi-Wan during an attempts to save him. Force Choke was still an option for Anakin at that point. Obi-Wan lets his guard down and *BAM* his esophagus is closed shut.
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  15. hlc88 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    The way I see it: if Obi-Wan had killed Anakin then someone else would have taken his place. The Emperor would still be in charge of the galaxy. The fate of the galaxy would be worse. And if Obi-Wan had killed himself too... well who would have trained Luke or Leia? In fact who would have got Padme to a medical facility in time? The droids were waiting for either Anakin or Obi-Wan to come back...
  16. SkywalkerSquadron Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2013
    star 4
    There was no reason for Obi-Wan to commit suicide. Most Jedi don't turn to the dark side, and Obi-Wan was one of the best. After all, if he had killed himself, Luke would not have defeated the Empire.

    Although, he probably should have killed Anakin as an act of mercy. However, to give him some slack, it would most likely have caused a lot more pain for him, and it seemed unlikely that Anakin would survive.
  17. TX-20 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 2013
    star 4
    "Only a Sith deals in deathblows!"
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  18. Vaapad Master Daeg Tynan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2013
    star 3
    Well said....
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  19. timmoishere Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 2, 2007
    star 6
    That sums it up right there.
  20. The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 4
    Killing Anakin and then committing suicide is pretty out there man.
  21. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    Yeah I'm not sure where that came from...

    Though years later, Obi would commit suicide by Vader.
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  22. Vaapad Master Daeg Tynan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2013
    star 3
    I have to admit, it's a very radical alternate to entertain.... I'm not sure Kenobi's suicide would bring any resolution to the situation... what purpose would it serve except to satisfy his guilt... which wouldn't be very jedi-like.
  23. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4
    As far as I'm concerned, walking away and leaving Anakin to slowly burn to death, which he knew would happen, was act of attempted murder to me.

    Also, the length that many fans go to excuse some of Obi-Wan's behavior or mistakes is amazing. I realize that most of SW fandom tend to blind themselves from his faults and view him in an idealized manner. But I haven't regarded Obi-Wan in an idealized manner since audiences learned that he had lied to Luke about Anakin's true identity in ESB. Some of his mistakes and behavior in the PT - especially what he did on Mustafar - has not removed this less than stellar view of him . . . at least in my eyes.

    And to be honest, I don't mind. A flawed Obi-Wan is a hell of a lot more interesting than an ideal Obi-Wan.
    Last edited by DRush76, Oct 26, 2013
  24. SlashMan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 5, 2012
    star 3
    The way I take it, the "killing an unarmed prisoner" rule pretty much applied to someone who could be taken prisoner instead. This definitely applied to Dooku, but no so much to Palpatine, who not only could still fight back, but had too much political influence. Anakin falls somewhere in between. In his current state, he isn't capable of doing anything, but there's no way to imprison him, and the Jedi already consider his acts irredeemable.

    When it comes down to it, Obi-Wan couldn't bring himself to kill his old friend. He could only manage to indirectly let him expire on his own against the harsh climates. Which seems pretty cruel, but I think Obi-Wan had a lot on his mind at this point.
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  25. Vaapad Master Daeg Tynan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2013
    star 3
    I guess my question is whether or not Windu thought that Palpatine had anything left to "fight back with" at the point where he collapsed on the edge of the window sill?? He looked pretty helpless, and I'm guessing that Windu wasn't quite positive he had Force Lightning at his disposal... Not sure "political inflence" is a reason to kill an unarmed prisoner... I'm not sure I'm buying this logic...

    Agreed.... not sure that was the right choice either... probably safe to say "Kenobi felt it was the right choice for him at that time."
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