Jedi vs Sith prequel movie idea

I apologozed if I offended you, Backdesk. I didn't mean any offense. I was simply pointing out to bgii_2000 that this was not going to turn into one person taking all the credit after everyone else did the work. I wasn't trying to imply that you were trying to do that; bgii_2000 was, and I was saying that it wasn't going to happen that way, even if (hypothetically) you actually were to take it in that direction. Basically, this will be a community project, and the community isn't going to let one guy take all the credit or boss it around (again, I mean that in a hypotheical sense, not trying to accuse you of anything).

Some of bgii's points do need consideration, though. For instance, we do eventually need to figure out how it will be funded (probably won't work coming out of one guy's pocket unless this person happens to be rich). We'll also have to do some extensive coordination if there are multiple filming units (though I still think a single filming unit is the only realistic way to go).

Still, I say we worry about the story now, and take care of the technicalities later. It doesn't cost one red cent to type up a script, so that's something we can easily do (well, relatively easy anyway). True, we run the risk of going through all the trouble of writing a script now only to figure out we don't have the means to film it later, but it wouldn't be a total loss; we'd still have an awesome script someone somewhere may be able to use in the future, and it could be enjoyed as fan fiction anyway.

 

Mainly I was offended at bgi's comments about my job not paying me enough. Not your's Jace. Some new developments though... I am training for Creative Service and Producing. Besides... for an 18 year old with no college experience, I will say I've been doing pretty good. On top of that, I make films. I have been for a few years.

I have taken into consideration the budget... but it's difficult, nearly impossible, to decide on a budget until we have a script. Same goes as scheduling. I basically just yelled out that there would be no budget. That is somewhat untrue I will admit. But it should be a VERY low cost film.

Yes, I do plan on having ONE shooting unit. BUT... if other filmmakers want to shoot battle sequences just to be thrown into the film, then I request a battle sequence be written in the script to allow them to do so. They don't have to have any characters identified because all of the characters' parts will be shot with the one shooting unit. I also suggest that the characters be involved in another struggle as a battle erupts in a different location, for the same cause, but separately.

 

Uh, dude, that info is in your sig.

First you claim to be a wonderfully charming person to work with:

...But then you blow up at me because I read your myspace profile, flamboyantly insulting my knowledge of film production:

Then you come pretty close to threatening me:

Dude. Chill out. As I said before, I don't think you're being malicious (although your recent, angry posts might suggest otherwise). I'm trying to explain to you that I've been in your position before, and you're deceiving yourself, the same as I did. I'm just being realistic. This is how things have statistically turned out for the last 8 years. Running the sort of low/no budget production you're talking about e.g.: "ride your bike", "owe for gas", "bring your own costume", "send your footage to me in an email" etc... NEVER results in a film being made, let alone "The Biggest Film Ever."

As far as the "credit" misunderstanding goes, I not saying that you would "take" credit from anyone. But what you've said just doesn't add up:

First you say, "it's my film" and then you turn around and say "it's everyone's film."

Now in your last post here, you further clarify your position by stating:

Oh. So, really what you're saying is, "I'm going to make a fan film with some battles in it, and if anyone wants to send me some filler battle shots, they can."

Regardless, "if I were you" I'd take a step back and do something smaller first. Just my opinion. If you want to garner support for your film, you also need change your attitude. "Shouting" and swearing won't get you an ounce of respect, and will damage your reputation permanently if you keep it up. Reminding people that you're in charge but that you'll need lots of free help from them also statistically does not help you. Play nice. Be diplomatic. Follow the forum rules about double posting. It'll go a long way.

PS: What's "Creative Service?"

 

"Flamboyantly insulting your knowledge of filmmaking"

Looks like we're even. Not only that, you used personal information that I released to my friends and trusted ones to insult me further. I AM a "charming person" to work with. BUT with the comments mentioned earlier, I overlooked handling this in a calm manner. The way I see it, this isn't working. The only threat I made to you was against your rude comments. I wont put up with it.

About the comments I made about the "bike" and "gas" were because I was angry and didn't really care at the moment.

Like I said, it's not my film alone. There will be more than just me working on this thing. But... if no person in this fan film community is willing to Direct the movie, then I will have to because nobody else will... that makes perfect sense.

Again... I was suggesting using other filmmakers' newly shot battle sequences to be used in the film so we can see what might be happening around the galaxy, perhaps, on other worlds. THAT IS if we want that sort of thing in the script. This way other filmmakers will have something pretty important to contribute, making it OUR film.


This isn't double posting... this is a new idea in the works.

Creative Service: Commercials, Developing video and graphics for television shows. You know, creative stuff.


Can we get back to the story development please?



might i add this is the longest living topic i've ever had on this forum.

 

Technically, in that bit he didn't necessarily say that this one shooting unit would have him in charge of it. Maybe that is what he had in mind, but that paragraph doesn't say that specifically. He might have simply meant that the plan was to have one shooting unit, run by whoever agrees to run it. That was my suggestion, anyway. Makes it easier than trying to coordinate people shooting various different shots.

Anyway, I will try and do my part to keep this going (not in a "now it's my film" sort of way or anything), even if, for instance, Backdesk changes his mind and decides not to do a movie. My suggestion (if the community agrees) is to go ahead and write the script. After that, we have some storyboards drawn uo by someone with that paricular skill, and perhaps any other pre-production sketches/concept art we may want/need. Then we worry about the technical details. My plan is to, at that point, try to recruit a group of people to actually film the movie from our script & storyboards. The reason I say this is because trying to get a production crew signed on now is silly, because we have nothing to show that we are serious. Right now, it *is* just hot air.

If we can get a script done, then we have an easier time getting someone to draw quality storyboards. If we get the quality storyboards, we have an easier time getting someone to film as we have something to show. If we can get someone to film, we have an easier time getting people to help with FX for the same reason (something to show).

You see, we take things a step at a time, and there's a chance that something might come of it. If we get ahead of ourselves, then we bite off more than we can chew. If we concentrate on just getting the script, then we can get something to show without having to spend on red cent.

Anyway, this has become a community project, so even *if* backdesk is going to try to take complete charge of it, the community might just plug ahead anyway despite any orders coming from him (not saying he will try, I'm just saying hypothetically). Once the movie is done, the community will give credit where it's due.

 

If this was "my" film then why wouldn't I be writing it? Why would I share any information stating I was planning on making this film if it were mine? I would already be busy making it. The idea was to have anyone or everyone in the fan film community to come together and put together a masterpiece that is a fan film.

One way or another, through criticism and doubt... this film will be made.

That's right Jace... 1 shooting unit. We were thinking on the same track there. I knew it would have to be at the very beginning of this topic. If your goin to read my first post, read it carefully. It would seem I was going to have more than one shooting unit. Refer to the SHOOTING section I typed up about Director's shooting their own battles. That's all I was thinking about regarding shooting units. I knew the main characters would have to be close because we cannot afford to fly everyone around.
1 shooting unit, directed by whoever wants the job... but IF nobody wants it...I will have to do it.


I don't plan on taking complete control over this project. It's the community's film. Made by the community. Credit will be given where it is due. But because there needs to be a producer... and currently that looks like me... my credit is "producer".


Back to the script development. Any more ideas?

 

Jace, what I'm trying to say is that you're already ahead getting of yourselves by attempting this without first doing something smaller.

Backdeskproductions, I fail to see how an anecdote from your public myspace profile (to which you post a link in every post) constitutes "personal information that you released to your friends and trusted ones."

I'll say it again: Chill.

Do you really believe that I'm hellbent on destroying your reputation, your film, and your life? Dude, I'm just trying to save you some grief. I've watched others walk down the same path you're starting down, and it takes them years to recover; if they recover at all. Haven't you seen Chris Hanel's The Formula?

I was honestly curious about the "Creative Service." I'd never heard of the field being referred to as "Service" before. I was just wondering what sort of work you were trying to break into, that's all.

 

You may not be writing the movie, but I can see why bgii_2000 would think that you might think that it was your movie. The reason for that is simply because there have been a lot of people in the past who have actually come in here stating that they were going to make the greatest fan film ever, but that they needed people to write, shoot, and edit it, yet they wanted the credit for it being "their movie" (after having done none of the work whatsoever).

This time around, it's an actual community project (or at least that's what it's become; even if someone wants to argue about Backdesk's original intent, it's become/evolved into a community project), and you just happened to be the one to suggest doing a community project.

So, regardless of whether Backdesk's intentions are honorable or not, I think the commmunity should carry on with it (and as a side note, I say we give backdesk the benefit of the doubt; I mean, he's at least offered to do some *work* for it, unlike 99% of the people with "greatest fan film" ideas who insist that someone else do everything while they sit and watch).

So, back to story then, eh?

I think we should stick with the Galactic Civil War period. X-Wings, Stormtroopers, and even the Force and lightsabers could be used (if we use RG's idea). I say we take RG's idea and build from that. Tweak it, refine it, add to it, etc, and then we can write the script from that. Not sure who of us will write the script, but I'd like to try, at least if no one else can or wants to.

 

Now that we're getting this out of the way... I just want to say that my profile on myspace does have personal info on it... but I haven't changed it in a loong time. The TV job is getting better... I've been doing a lot more. But that doesn't matter because we dont have to worry about a budget until we get a script. I'm not worried about disappointment... I've been disappointed before and it really doesn't bother me. I will even let you see my Heinz Ketchup Commercial for the first contest. THAT was diappointing.

just go to youtube and type in A PAINTER'S TOOLS... and click on the one from joncmaxwell. It's soooo bad lol.
Oh yeah... that's not me as the painter. I'm the judge with the hat on eating the fry.

 

Writing a script is not getting ahead of ourselves; it's certainly not "attempting a movie." Writing a script costs nothing, and once it's done, there's still a chance to look at it and make sure we can actually pull it off. Anyway, having a script might mean that someone with the equipment would be willing to film it, since the script would show that we're serious about it (though I think we'd want a step in between where we have someone do storyboards, as that would make it even more likely to draw someone's interest).

If the worst happens and no one will film it, then it's not a huge deal; we still have a script that someone in the future may be able to use, and the script would still have value as a piece of fan fiction either way. At every step of the way, we always have a chance to back out before we bite off more than we can chew. More than likely, reality says that yes, this is more than we can chew, but I fail to see how writing a script would be some huge mistake. Besides, once it's written, perhaps we'd luck out and find a fellow fan filmmaker wanting to make a fan film but struggling to come up with an idea (by that, I mean a fan filmmaker with the resources/skills/experience skills necessary).

 

Writing a script like the one being discussed is a waste of time no matter how you look at it because it will never be made. If you start with something smaller, there's a chance you might have something to show for it.

And seriously, three people does not a "community" make.

 

Whoa wait a minute... did I just hear a filmmaker say that writing a script is a waste of time? Even if it is written and not made... it can be saved for later like Jace said. It's what many of the great filmmakers do anyway. They write something, see it's not going well and then put it off for later to fix and finish when he/she has an idea.


plus we've had plenty of input from other people, still not considered to be a community but that's because we've spent the last page and a half arguing over whether this film is possible. With your help, everyone was scared off.

 

Other people have been giving input, not just three people. RocketGirl has been giving input. She even pitched an idea that had lightsabers in it (who knew ). Seriously though, I realize that we haven't had a lot of people chiming in with willingness to actually film it, but then, like I said, I think it's waaaaaay premature to be getting onto that. And anyway it's not like every one of the posts in this thread have been written by the same three people. Perhaps there have been some people more active than others (backdesk, RG, and myself, for instance, which I'm guessing is the three you're talking about).

Anyway, I'm willing to write the script. I wouldn't consider it a waste of time. Like I said, I'd consider it a work of fan fiction at least, so even if it never gets made, I'd still feel some pride that I created a work of art. Saying that a script is throughly, 100% useless & a complete waste of time if it doesn't end up getting filmed is sheer idoicy, at least if the writer doesn't feel that way.

Howewever, while I may write this script (and if there was anyone else who was hoping to be the screenwriter, go ahead and write a script of your own if you're so inclined; you just have to be quite aware that it may never actually get filmed), I think you've got a good idea about starting smaller. One way of doing it is to write a script for a five or ten minute fan film. One with story, of course. It wouldn't be a lightsaber duel, but perhaps a space battle, or just one short scene from the bigger script.

Then, we can try to film that. If it fails miserably, then we'll know not to try the larger-scale one. If it works we can continue on (though even then we may decide to only step it up a little, rather than assuming it's OK to jump headfirst into the large-scale project).

However, that won't stop me from writing the script. Like I said, I wouldn't mind writing it pretty much as fan fiction (in script form, yes), and I wouldn't be crushed if it didn't get filmed.

 

Great! Let's see what you can come up with. Can't wait to read some good material. We could do the "start small" thing and make a video that relates to the script your writing, just to have a demo.

 

I actually think bgii_2000's "Tales of a..." idea is pretty interesting and would allow for multiple shoots, especially if we were to make my Sith War idea (which like Rocketgirls idea, had no real feedback).

Oh and for the record...as well as being a screenwriter, I did win both the Classic trilogy and prequel trilogy fanfiction rewrite contests on multiple occasions and I'm the story supervisor on the KOTOR Machinima trilogy, so i guess i fit the bill as being part of the fan fiction community as well as the fan film community.

Now the way I see it, if we were to tell multiple stories that make up one overall arc, then you could have multiple directors and muliple crews. I'm speaking hypothetically at the moment, since there's no guarantee that this will ever happen, but let's assume it does.

Once the overall story is laid out...each individual "tale" could be written by a different screenwriter, with one supervisor (most likely the creator of the general story) looking over the development of the scripts. Once the scripts were completed (say 6 or 7 scripts), each one would be taken on by a different production crew to go out and shoot. So each tale could very well look and feel different, with each director having their own particular style. The only thing that would link each film, aside from the overall arc, would be the technical details of how it's shot, in terms of format (HD, SD, aspect ratios...all that stuff).

With Post Production, you would probably need multiple editors, to work with the individual directors, as well as sound designers etc. visual effects would need a large team, split up into groups to work on each "tale" with a VFX supervisor overseeing everything to ensure consistency in the quality of the vfx.

Music could be handled by a single composer, or different composers for each "tale" depending on preference. Once each individual short is finished, the overall producer would then put them together.

So esentially what you'd end up with is a series of shorts about the Sith War...6 or 7 stories that make up a 2 hour movie.

Here's an example of how the story could be laid out:

Tales From The Sith War

Prologue: A Long Time Ago In A Galaxy Far, Far away....

Essentially a quick intro, detailing the state of the galaxy and the reason there's a war going on. This would be one of two parts where every individual production would contribute something, making up a montage of events.

Chapter 1: Mission To Xenthar

a group of Jedi are sent to a remote world in the Outer Rim to protect a group of refugees from the armies of the Sith until an evacuation ship can arrive. This was my original Sith War story idea.

Chapter 2: Hunted!

Three children with amazing Force potential (but no powers or training), travel across a world, being hunted by a Bounty Hunter who has been employed by the Sith to capture them so they can be trained in the Dark Arts. Their only protection is a former slave of the Sith who betrayed his masters and joined the jedi army (which isn't made up of Jedi by the way) only to desert them out of fear and is now a gambling alcoholic, humiliated and hoping he can find some redemption by delivering the children to safety.

Chapter 3: In The Beginning...

Set long before the war, it tells the story of a young Jedi, Darth Ruin (Yes, Darth would be his actual name as opposed to title...future Sith Lords would use the term "Darth" as a title out of respect to the first Sith), who begins to learn the Dark Arts, believing that they shouldn't be ignored. He starts to gain followers, who call themselves the Lords of the Sith, a sub-group within the Jedi Order. But after a horrific accident caused by Ruin using the Dark Side, he is put on trial, where he must not only defend his actions, but his very beliefs. The result is that the Jedi Order is split down the middle, with Ruin and his followers leaving to follow their own path, returning centuries later as the Dark Lords of the Sith to take control of the galaxy.

Chapter 4

 

How come, except for Wendy, there were only lost boys in Never-Never Land? I would have expected at least some girls to have gone missing in a magical land where children can be immortal and unaging. I'da jumped at the chance.

 

I can actually answer that one...

The Lost Boys weren't actually lost in Neverland. They were children, who like Peter, ran away (though some were indeed lost) but not to Neverland. Peter Pan found them in "our" world and if they weren't claimed within seven days, only then were they taken away to Neverland. But girls were too smart (or too stupid, if you follow Pan's point of view, not mine of course) to get lost or run away, and any that did were usually found within seven days by their parents or returned by Peter (either because he thought that girls would be useless at fighting pirates or, because he was a child, found them "icky"). It wasn't until Wendy, that he saw any use for girls, in her case as a mother.

And that's why there are no Lost Girls...what? why are you loking at me like that? It was the first book I ever read, ok!

So, any thoughts on my idea?

Of course, the outline I laid out called for 6 shorts, each around 15-20 minutes long, with the prologue and epilogue being around 5 minutes, making a film that's just over 2 hours. You could add more stories to that and make an even longer film. The ones I came up with were mostly off the top of my head.

 

As long as we're already off topic: Why did Jack and Jill go up the hill to fetch water? You don't find water on top of hills, and if you're going to say the well is up there, only a rank idiot would build a well at the top of a hill.

 

No, of course not...the Lost Boys were lost in Santa Carla. That's the problem with Santa Carla...all the damn vampires.

Anyway, you should already know what I think out your idea: too much focus on Force-users, not enough rest-of-the-GFFA for my tastes. S'why I proposed MY idea; it may not focus specifically on Jedi and Sith as organizations, but there's enough lightsaber-and-Force use to satisfy even the most rabid fanboy, AND you get more classic elements of Star Wars--you know...the Original Trilogy that started it all?--like the Rebel Alliance. Best of both worlds...balance. Like an actual Star Wars movie.

 

So basically what you want to go for is how the Clone Wars animated series was put together. In chapters.

I was thinking more of a movie made up of 1 storyline and the same main characters. Although the series idea is a good one... I am just mentioning what my idea was from the beginning. It's all up to the fan film community how this "thing" is going to work.

Basically I'm acting as a guide to keep moving this project forward.


We could use more input from other people. Movie... or Series to be put into a 2 hour movie like SW Clone Wars?
The series does get more filmmakers involved.

 

That still doesn't change the fact that you left the profile set on "public", left the link in your sig, didn't change your myspace name, didn't change your tfn name, and didn't tell anyone about the change (or the pseudo-privateness of your myspace account) until just now. You're putting yourself in a public position. You should be prepared for public scrutiny. And you should tone down your reactions.

I'm sorry I offended you.

To better times.

I like your comparison to the Clone Wars cartoons better than my "Tales" idea. It's exactly what I was thinking. And it's a great way to get a lot of individual filmmakers involved.

Also, I had another idea. This is far in the future, but there's a lot of resources that could be pooled. For instance: Visual Effects. Not artists mind you, but scenery, matte paintings, models, animations, textures, fonts, logos, decals, titles, etc... It would help to bring a little uniformity to the series, and help the artists. Same for music and sound effects. A theme could be written for the series (I'd do it) and that theme could play at the beginning of each chapter. I've never done an entire soundtack, but I could give it a go. Again, this would serve to unify the pieces.

I'm still a little iffy on any ideas that have anything to do with "massive armies in massive battles." or "Jedi armies descending on the Sith capital." That stuff is utterly impossible to do, even with a small server farm. You could refer to large battles in the dialog, or even have an ultra extreme long shot (like in ROTJ from the emperor's throne room) But depicting actual gargantuan battle scenes is impossible for any VFX artist to cook up. It requires insane computing power, and some really expensive software. I think the largest battle to date has been Reign of the Fallen, which had like 15 sith doing battle against one Jedi. Or maybe Wilka's MS-III. But even that was like, 20 people. Revelations had the most ambitious space battle ever rendered, and it's 4 on 1.

Thousands, and tens of thousands just don't happen in the fan film world. Ask ANY VFX artist here. They'll tell you the same thing

But back to story.

The clone wars series had the advantage of having two characters that were almost always in every episode. This series wouldn't have that, a least in the same visual sense. If we were careful though, dialog could be crafted to provide threads of continuity between the chapters.

Some collaboration could be possible. Say the filmmaker shooting the Bounty Hunter chapter needed a shot of Bane for a holo message. It would be feasible for the filmmaker doing the Bane chapter to shoot one or two scenes.

The story needs to have an arc of some sort. A beginning and an end. Something for all of them to tie into and reference. I like Jedisithor's individual ideas, but they lack a central thread. Should probably have a couple more chapters in there too. Throw in a good love story, and a comedic one (think: JarJar or C3PO; I'm not talking about spoofing).

And my take on the ending: You could do it from the POV of normal citizens on the ground. They see the battle from far off. In the end perhaps one of the characters turns out to be Tarsus Valorum. Or maybe, as the the family cowers in the cellar, the boy goes out side to see Darth Bane escaping into the shadows. But whatever you do... No huge battles.

 

to better times.

I fixed the myspace problem... I'm getting rid of it since I'm really never on it.

I really like the chapters idea. Even though it wouldn't be a feature film, it still does get more filmmakers involved.
About huge battles, that really depends on who you can get to fight. Again it depends on how the story goes. We don't have to write in any big scenes but it someone can get together people to shoot a big scene, the be my guest, we'll try to fix the story so it'll work. Scripts for these things are changing all the time anyway.


About the sound effects, I have a massive library full of star wars sounds. I request to the fan film community that I do sound design.


So for the story... still goin for ideas.

 

Not quite sure what you mean here. Do you mean pulling together pre-existing FX sources (for instance, the 3D models found on scifi3d.com)?

 

*psigh* Count me out of this. Even if I didn't desperately need to finish my own fan film, after reading the last page or so, I frankly don't really have much confidence in the people involved in this one.