Amph JJ Abrams' Star Trek Into Darkness

Discussion in 'Community' started by Ulkesh2, Sep 8, 2010.

  1. Darth Guy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2002
    star 10
    o_O

    I don't have a problem in particular with Cumberbatch playing an Indian (I do have a problem with everything else the film does with the character), but I hate, hate, hate when people pretend there isn't a huge racial problem in Hollywood and that Cumberbatch's casting isn't symptomatic of it.

    EDIT: Sure, objectification of women in Hollywood films exists, but Alice Eve's underwear was an integral part of the story!
    Last edited by Darth Guy, Sep 6, 2013
    Adam of Nuchtern likes this.
  2. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
    I hope stuff actually happens in the next movie. Like Borg invasion or army of golden Robocops.
  3. Darth Guy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2002
    star 10
    Robocop is black now. Racial problems solved.
  4. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
  5. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    I'm not pretending there isn't racial issues in Hollywood. I'm just acknowledging that there is a tendency to cast against previously established skin color. You wouldn't exactly call it racist to cast Michael Clarke Duncan in a role that's originally white.


    No, I admit that wasn't necessary, other than to have a "Slave Girl Leia" moment in Trek.
  6. Backbench Jedi Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2013
    Del Toro turned down the role.
  7. Darth Guy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2002
    star 10
  8. DarthLowBudget Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2004
    star 5
    Didn't you know, Guy? There's only one latino actor in all of hollywood!
  9. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Just think - what if they released a live-action Akira and whitewashed the entire cast!

    At least things aren't that bad.

    Well, obviously. Cumberbatch apparently came in, crushed the audition, and had everyone swooning with his gravitas and Saruman-like vocal abilities. But there's more to casting than just acting ability.

    I should clarify that "plastic surgery" has not been specified by anyone official, it's just fan speculation that Orci said could be possible. All that's been said is that the issue of Khan's appearance will supposedly be addressed in a comic in some way, which at the very least seems to indicate that TPTB are aware that there was an issue to address. Something appearing in a comic may not be "canon", but will likely still be consistent with canon.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Sep 7, 2013
  10. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9

    Chronicle! (which was awesome, but basically live-action Akira). Weren't they ACTUALLY planning on white-washing Akira though in the live-action version Dicaprio was attached to or whatever?
    Rogue_Ten likes this.
  11. Adam of Nuchtern Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
  12. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
  13. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Bankability. Though in this case, Cumberbatch isn't exactly famous in the US, so that's probably not the point in his case.


    That's just to shut the fanboys up. The same way the Klingon helmets were to shut them up about their appearance.
    Last edited by darth-sinister, Sep 7, 2013
  14. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    Sorry, that was my bad... still getting over a fever and my sarcasm meter is teh broke... :p
  15. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    I always thought the helmets were a way to put off taking a side in the "ridges or no ridges" debate.
  16. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    It was, that's my point. I understand why not to include it in the film, since the larger audience doesn't know about the whole arc. But really, it was done to shut up the fans who would find something to complain about with the reboot.
  17. Darth Guy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2002
    star 10
    Oh, it's not nearly that difficult to find something.
  18. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Finding is one thing. Going on about it is another matter.
  19. Jabba-wocky Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2003
    star 8
    Really? The Trade Federation employs several tens of millions of people at least. It controls whole star systems. Multiple planets are listed as its power base and an entire species constitutes its leadership core. Something so sprawling would easily count several thousands of people in its cadre of senior executives, and have ready mechanisms (and candidates) for replacing them all. So even if Sidious managed to threaten the current policymakers, they'd only be replaced as the gulf between their actions and the organizations interests widened. Unless you're saying Sidious was threatening to dismantle the entire Trade Federation and killed thousands of individuals.

    This is also where the whole thing becomes silly. If it was supposed to be the case that they are in a partnership with Sidious, the movie should demonstrate how that partnership would actually be a rational choice for the Trade Federation. If the point was simply that Sidious is so powerful that he could bully them into doing something that doesn't benefit them at all, then A)why raise the prospect of an alliance in the script and B)why even bother having/using the Trade Federation at all?

    What does their quality as military strategists have to do with anything? I didn't complain about their battle tactics. They were trying to get Queen Amidala to sign an unfavorable agreement. They're supposed to be cutthroat, ruthless businessmen. This is basically their number one skill in the whole universe. If they can't do anything else, they should be adept at pressuring people into doing stuff like this. It's just another business negotiation. So why did we watch two hours of them being completely feckless about it?
  20. Rogue_Ten Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 18, 2002
    star 6

    i got thrown out of the theatre for standing up and screaming "TET-SUUUUUuuuUUuuuooooOOOOOOoooo!!!!" at the climax of chronicle
    Ramza likes this.
  21. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
  22. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Sidious would kill Nute, Rune, Lott and all the rest and put someone else in charge. By the time of TPM, Nute was in charge of the whole thing. He was at the top.

    The benefits are that once the treaty is signed and acknowledged by the Senate as legally binding, they will have a leg to stand on against taxation of trade routes. More and more systems will start siding with them and the Senate would be forced to kill the bill, thereby restoring order. It's not an equal partnership. Sidious is using them because he wants to start a war. They're the scapegoats in all of this. The Republic and the Jedi will focus on the Confederacy, while Sidious manipulates the Senate and the Republic into giving up their freedoms for security, allowing him to become Emperor.


    They're not that cut throat and ruthless. This is evidenced by Qui-gon's assertion that this is unusual for the Trade Federation, because they have never resorted to invading a planet to get what they want. At the outset, he is convinced that they will fold like a deck of cards.

    OBI-WAN: "Yes, Master...how do you think the trade viceroy will deal with the Chancellor's demands?"

    QUI-GON: "These Federation types are cowards. The negotiations will be short."

    Then after going to the hangar...

    QUI-GON: "Battle droids."

    OBI-WAN: "It's an invisible army."

    QUI-GON: "It's an odd play for the Trade Federation."

    Then on Naboo...

    QUI-GON: "The situation here is not what it seems. There is something else behind all this, Your Highness. There is no logic in the Federation's move here."

    The Trade Federation has a reputation for being shrewd, but not overtly aggressive and violent. That is because of the Sith pushing things.
  23. Jabba-wocky Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2003
    star 8
    Yes, I realize he might kill them. But if what he was doing still didn't make sense for the Trade Federation, those leaders wouldn't cooperate either. Is he going to kill everyone in the organization?

    Yes, but the part that doesn't make sense is that, according to you, Sidious repeatedly stops them from doing what's necessary to get the treaty signed. Even though they would have plenty of opportunity to do so. This is why they would probably stop cooperating with him.

    Are you kidding me? The evidence they're not ruthless is that they've never launched a full scale military invasion before? In a Galaxy where standing armies of any kind are uncommon? This is one of the most hilarious and terrible arguments I've seen in this thread. Including the plot of Into Darkness.

    Do you have any idea of the history of business? Worker exploitation? Assassination of union leaders? Bribing government officials? Cooperating with (or turning a blind eye to) criminal enterprises? Are you familiar with the modern day abuses among Western companies that are well-regarded and "responsible" members of the marketplace? Where on Earth are you getting the notion that businesses can't be extremely ruthless? Especially the sort of business the Trade Federation is supposed to be?
  24. DarthLowBudget Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2004
    star 5
    Excuse me for a second, but are we seriously derailing a thread about Star Trek Into Dankness in order to discuss the finer points of trade negotiations in The Phantom Menace of all things?
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  25. DarthTunick SfC Commish on an "All-Star" break

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2000
    star 10
    Yes, that indeed is what has been happening lately.