Discussion Keep the Midi-chlorians out of the sequels please!!

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by Sith_Knight087, Mar 6, 2013.

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  1. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 4
    Well, if Plagueis is still alive, maybe he'll elaborate on who created Anakin. Only he can put this to rest.
    Last edited by DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR, Mar 6, 2013
  2. Darth Chiznuk Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 5
    In my opinion it didn't need expanding because Palpatine gave Anakin and the audience everything they needed to know. Anakin needed a way to save his wife and Palpatine suggested a way without outright saying it and for the audience we get a little backstory on Anakin's conception without explaining it too much and taking away all the mystery. Interestingly in an earlier draft it is expanded on and Palpatine actually tells Anakin that he created him and that he is his 'father'. It was awful and I'm so happy GL decided to leave that out. There's nothing wrong with a bit of mystery and IMO it just makes it more interesting.
  3. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    Selective quoting there mate. I followed by saying I don't know that for sure but it's a good bet. I've stated my reasons for believing it's a safe bet. That's what these forums are for, discussion & conjecture.
  4. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Still missing the point. You have no way of knowing if it's a "good bet" or not. It could be a very bad bet. And chronic bettors eventually lose, as Qui-Gon will tell you.
    Darth Chiznuk likes this.
  5. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    Sorry but you're missing the point. None of us know anything for sure but part of the fun of discussion is to make predictions. I've stated why I think it's a good bet that they won't feature in the ST. I also don't think we'll hear the lines "icky icky goo" or "yippee" repeated, or have another retarded cartoon rabbit in the sequels. Do I know this for sure? No but it's a safe bet
    Captain Tom Coughlin likes this.
  6. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Others have stated just as many reasons why it potentially is not.
  7. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    But...Palpatine made 2 comments about Plagueis:

    1. that he could influence the midi chlorians to create life (the throwaway line, IMO)
    2. that he had such a knowledge of the dark side that he could stop people from dying

    Line 2 is important as you said & played a key role in Anakins turn. He didn't say however that this ability to cheat death had anything to do with the midichlorians, which is what we're talking about. He said it was knowledge of the dark side, ie perhaps "dark magic" & abilities that are unnatural. You can assume it involved midi's if you like but you'd just be guessing.

    Line 1 is the one I called throwaway bcs taken with Shmi's comments in TPM it infers that the Sith might've "created" Anakin. A plot point this huge should'nt be just hinted at IMO. That it just gets these hints & isn't expanded upon makes it IMO a throwaway. Whether it's a good throwaway or a bad throwaway is debatable I guess.

    Getting back on point, your comment that "Plagueis' experiments into midi-chlorian manipulation is instrumental in Anakin's turn to the dark side. It is the power he seeks to save his wife from death" is just based on your assumption that the midi's are involved in the cheating death ability. Palpy never said this, thus midichlorians can't be given credit for this important plot aspect & therefore they still suck, IMO
    Last edited by Darth_Downunder, Mar 6, 2013
  8. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    & they are entitled to state their predictions. Am I entitled to state mine?
  9. Darth Chiznuk Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 5
    Not cheating death just keeping others alive and the Darth Plagueis novel explains it this way so I wasn't just assuming.
    Last edited by Darth Chiznuk, Mar 6, 2013
  10. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    Fair enough, but just sticking to the movies I think it's a throwaway. If you edited out the comment about midi's & creating life, Palpy's other comments would work just as well in relation to Anakins turn. Just the dark side ability to prevent death was all that was needed IMO. Anakin wasn't interested in creating life
  11. Jedi_Ford_Prefect Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2003
    star 4
    At the very least, I for one hope that midichlorians aren't swept under the rug or disparaged in a trite line the way that past Bond films were in "Skyfall" (you know what, Q? **** you. some of us like exploding pens).
    Prodigy_Knight likes this.
  12. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Are you talking about the same Skyfall that featured the car from Goldfinger, complete with guns and ejection seat?
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Mar 6, 2013
  13. LANDO_ROCKS Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2002
    star 4
    I was hoping for a scene where someone says

    Jedi 1 - "Remember when the old Jedi order thought Midichlorians had something to do with the Force?"

    Jedi 2 - "Yeah how bloody wrong they were eh? All a bit Scientology E-Meter-y for me!"

    Jedi 1 - "Give me a cold dark cave on Degobah to sort out the men from the boys! Lift that ship out of the swamp son and we'll talk about how super awesome you are!"
    Darth_Cornish likes this.
  14. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
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    They've already been swept under the rug haven't they? They got a fair bit of focus in TPM then barely a mention for the rest of the PT & obviously no mention in the OT. Not only are they under the rug, the rug's been lost & forgotten
  15. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Nope. Or is this one of those "stated predictions" again? Did I miss the part where you say you're not sure?

    Assuming that what you want to happen is a "safe bet" - because you want it to happen - makes it look like you think the world revolves around you.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Mar 6, 2013
  16. Jedi_Ford_Prefect Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2003
    star 4
    They were mentioned at a key moment in ROTS. And... well, yes, they aren't mentioned in the OT. I'm willing to bet they probably hadn't even been concieved of at that point.

    Anyway. I'd like to think that midichlorians could find positive mention in the ST, as part of the Jedi Renaissance. Either be supportive of them or leave'em alone.
  17. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    Bit of an agitator aren't you? That's ok. My comment "the rug's been lost & forgotten" was more of a joke than a prediction. It's actually based on fact though. We're told to look at the movies as 1 big saga. So here's a midichlorian snapshot so far:

    Ep 1: midichlorian this, midichlorian that. A midichlorian bonanza!
    Ep 2: nothing
    Ep 3: one brief mention
    Ep 4: zip
    Ep 5: zilch
    Ep 6: nada

    So when we get to Ep 7 if midi's don't feature would you say they've been suddenly swept under the carpet? As I said, in the context of the story they already have.
  18. Ice1605 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2006
    star 1
    Not a fan of midichlorians, personally, but they don't bother me that much. What does really bother me is when people use them for Dragonball Z-like "power level" comparisons. Luckily, I haven't seen any of those recently.
    Last edited by Ice1605, Mar 6, 2013
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  19. Jedi_Ford_Prefect Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2003
    star 4
    I'm sorry, but you just made midichlorians something like 100 times more awesome to me.
    In the context of the saga-- yeah, you can get away with not mentioning them, because they haven't been mentioned in a good long while. I will add that the OT didn't have an institutional Jedi Order present in any way that would've had the resources to spend any time researching them at all. A rebuilt Order very likely would rediscover them, and make them part of the general procedure of checking out new candidates.

    But that being said, I'd rather the new films not go into midichlorians if it's a choice between that and making fun of them. If they can be taken seriously, fine. But please-- no "lol 007 exploding pens" moments.
  20. Ice1605 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2006
    star 1
    Ha, well, to each his/her own :p
  21. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    The thing is in RotJ Yoda says to Luke "when gone am I the last of the Jedi will you be". As far as we can tell Ben & Yoda didn't mention anything to Luke about the midichlorians. So if Luke is the last Jedi & the one rebuilding the Jedi order then it's unlikely IMO that he'll be banging on about them to his students - thankfully.
  22. Jedi_Ford_Prefect Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2003
    star 4
    I would assume that he's going to find information about the Jedi Order in research between the old and new trilogies. I mean, if we're starting from ground zero and Luke only teaching abilities that he had in ROTJ, then we're going to have some dreadfully boring action sequences. He's got to learn how to do big Force jumps/pushes/anything-besdes-mind-tricks from somewhere.
    VMeran likes this.
  23. Jedi_Knight_Darkarna Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 18, 2004
    star 1
    I think for the sake of less tears it best not be mentioned, i personally don't care
  24. Master Blaster Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2013
    star 1
    Perhaps Midichlorians weren't mentioned by name in the OT, but it was said *repeatedly* that the force runs strongly in Luke's family. How the heck is it possible for force strength to be inherited through a familial line if there is not a biological/genetic component??? THINK ABOUT IT. Midichlorians are completely logical in that regard, but unfortunately the concept conflicted with many people's misconceptions of the force from incomplete information.

    Will Midichlorians be in the ST? Well, if Luke or others is going to be finding Jedi recruits to train, he might want to have some way to find who might have force abilities. It would be enough for Luke or another Jedi to be able to "feel" who the force is strong with. Besides, who is going to school him on the ins and outs of the biology of midichlorians? The knowledge probably didn't survive the Empire. Well....Jedi ghosts could impart some information about it, I suppose.
    Darth Chiznuk and lbr789 like this.
  25. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 4
    Yes but the passing of traits from parent to child is a commonly known fact. A new cellular organism didn't need to be invented to explain this. Two athletic parents are likely to have athletic children.
    When Luke spoke of the Force running strongly in his family, prior to TPM did any of us sit there thinking "I'm confused, how can this happen? I need a biology lesson to understand this" ?
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