ST Kylo Ren and Rey in VIII and IX (See new guidelines on page 228)

And I don't see Luke giving up on Ben after all.

Spoiler

See you around, kid

sure sounds like Ben is getting a spirit guide whether he wants to or not.

 

Definitely feel like Luke had a change of heart at the end, between his optimism with Leia and new perspective on Rey.

 

renperor on the throne getting unsolicited advice from force ghost luke is what i wanna see...lol.

 

Im not sure, he said if he killed him he would hunt him as his father.

And han solo of course its not a force ghost

 

That's what it takes? Even if he murdered 3/4 of the galaxy's population? Even if he killed his mother and all of Rey's friends? You still have hope that Kylo Ren would be redeemed and Rey would forgive him?

What kind of message does that send to children? The target audience of Star Wars?

 

The same one the redemption of GOAT Villain Darth Vader did.

 

Vader died though so it's a little bit easier. Everyone else wants Kylo to be redeemed and LIVE. Not exactly the same situation.

 

You mean redemption equals death? Where Vader dies as a broken man and his only comfort is the knowledge that his son is safe?

And then still the galaxy hates his guts for the crimes. And Leia doesn't forgive him.

Oh, and the only reason he got a chance at redemption was because his irredeemable boss was still around bossing him around and torturing his son. He gets to do the right thing. Kylo Ren just killed his master for power. He has no eviler boss bossing him around. He is that boss. And thus any crimes the First Order does will be on his hands.

Perhaps it's time to accept that Kylo Ren doesn't want to be redeemed and we should respect his choice. And that Rey should just let him go and kill him for being a monster. I don't care if it would end the Skywalkers in darkness.

 

And then he got to be a shiny young force ghost smiling with his forgiving old friends while he watched his happy children

 

I know I've never said specifically that I WANT him to live, but that I could see a scenario where he could still be alive given what we've seen so far and still be okay with it.

Vader killed much more in terms of population than Kylo has. Anakin also went through an extreme plot to assassinate nearly all of the Jedi, whom he made the same exact pledge for the galaxy with. As fans, we have an adoration for Han Solo that made his death strike deep and gives us a bit of character bias.

 

I appreciate you feel so certain about this. It could go either way as the end of TLJ however being Star Wars I feel we always err on the side of hope. The validity of redemption for the repentant is wrapped up a lot in our own sense of justice.

 

How are you so certain what his motivations were for killing Snoke? I think there's multiple influences in that scene.

 

i'm still hours away from seeing tlj in full but...

from the few short clips i've seen online, it doesn't seem like rey has very much dialogue or is given much to do compared to her male costars? i hope that's not the case throughout the movie.

 

You can justify a thousand atrocities in the name of good, but there has always been one thing consistent about the Dark Side.

Greed.

Power is something that many cannot let go.

Palpatine is in it for power. He's greedy for it.

Anakin has grown too attached to the things he love. Greedy and selfish, he betrays his friends to get the power to save his wife. Then he simply cares about that power alone.

What did Kylo Ren after killing Snoke? Disbanding FO? Atone for his sins? Or becoming Supreme Leader Ren and try to kill the Resistance because Rey rejected his offer?

 

It had nothing to do with Rey rejecting his offer- he wanted to disband EVERYONE, the Jedi, Sith, FO and the Resistance to begin with. For all you know, he could wipe all of that out and go off on his own somewhere.

 

Look... I get that Ben felt neglected and decided to become the complete opposite of what his parents stood for, but to say he has gone too far is an understatement. This isn't 'you wanted me to be a doctor so I became a sidewalk artist'. This is him killing his own father and then leading an organization that has killed billions of individuals.... one that is set on killing your mother and uncle.

This isn't 'he rebelled a little'. This is him embracing the worst actions and beliefs this galaxy has to offer. I'm not sure if I can buy that he had good reasons that make up for all that after TLJ.

 

The dark side = going too far. I mean that hasn't changed since TFA, or ROTS. Like you can't fall to the dark side in a moderate way. Haha.

 

Same, I'm sorry Edward! At least Edward cares about fruits


and trees

 

It's kind of like being pregnant. You either are or you arent.

 

I'd like to go lightly on the dark side, please. I'm on a diet.

 

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but couldn't resist. Just in case anyone is still in denial about the dynamic between Rey and Kylo being meant as romantic, Mark Hamill himself calls it "romantic tension" between Rey and his "naughty nephew", and calls it "titillating" and how "girls like the bad boys".

 

i remember him also calling kylo a dangerous dreamboat. then deleting the tweet (which he does rarely).

 

Yeah it's looking like romantic tension to me from the bits of things I've seen online. It's like a proto-romance at this point.

 

Fascinating that Luke couldn't have a family because he's a jedi, but the central premise of this trilogy is our new jedi hero having the hots for a psycho.