ST Kylo Ren turned to dark side after losing lover?

The story of Kylo Ren seems to pick up where the story of Anakin Skywalker left off had he not sustained heavy injuries in ROTS. However, very little is known about Kylo's past. I surmise that Kylo, like Anakin, turned to the dark side as a result of losing at love. The following are a couple of scenarios that I've imagined:
1. Kylo was in love with one of the Jedi at Luke's academy. Luke forbid their relationship resulting in Ben hating him for it and destroying his academy.
2. Kylo was in love with one of the Jedi at Luke's academy who died tragically on a mission. Ben blames Luke for the death of his lover, as Luke is responsible for protecting all of the Jedi. This leaves Ben vulnerable to Smoke, and results in destruction of the academy.
3. Kylo was specifically in love with Rae, and this was forbidden by Luke for some reason. I find this scenario to be the least likely given the age of the actors, and the age that Rae appears to be when she is left on Jakku.

I looked up the meaning of Ren, and it is a Confucianist concept that emphasizes relationships between two people. I find this particularly interesting. Why would Ben destroy the new Jedi order and establish a new one that emphasizes relationships between two people and delves deeply into the dark side? Also, if one of these scenarios is true, how does Rae figure into all of this? It's obvious that her and Kylo have met before. Are they related? Are they merely acquaintances from Luke's academy? Why does Anakin's lightsaber call to Rae instead of Kylo?

 

I thought Snoke was his lover.

 

Rae?

It's more likely that Snoke and the knights of Ren were the only factors in his fall.

 

No.

 

twirls around before the lock.

*twirls*

 

Yes, it's very unlikely that Ben and Rey were ever a thing. It's also very unlikely that Ben has a vagina.

 

I think it's gonna be more like a reflection of the end of ROTJ, and someone, assumedly Snoke, will threaten young Ben when he learns something Ben and his family have always tried to keep secret... Ben has a sister. They were wise to hide her. But now they have failed. And if Ben doesn't turn to the dark side...perhaps she will...

Ben is forced to go to the dark side to save his sister from the same fate. He hides her on Jakku and then becomes Kylo Ren.

 

Boom goes the head canon

 

I find it highly doubtful that Ben Solo/Kylo Ren ever got laid.

Edit: Allthough.. just to get past the funny... something struck me here. If they go the whole Garden of Eden analogy being the genesis of the origin of the split between Sith/Jedi.. could the first person to fall to the Dark Side, basically be Eve?

 

according to the abrams commentary (before it turns out to all be just from a certain pov ofc), kylo ren and rey never met. and he's like ten years older. and she was supposedly left on jakku at age 5 (i mean, also from a certain pov). therefore kr and rey having an in-person past (prior to tfa) is basically just short of impossible.

don't let obi-wan weigh in on this though.

 

what an interesting think piece on character assassination

also 12 year old rey was already on jakku for years when 23yo ben fell so i doubt she has anything to do with it. which says to me that maybe the reason he fell isn't going to be explained too thoroughly in the movies. it may not be that important


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

 

nope, none of this happened.

 

correct. he's just a guy who made bad choices. he felt distant from his parents and then found out who his grandfather was and that his parents never told him. i'd be pissed off too. he also feels imo that he could never live up to the greatness of his parents. he also has mental issues if he can murder people.

 

Maybe the one who dropped Rey at Jakku saw the events of Kylo/Ben coming for years. Rey and Ben could have been at the same place until someone decided to bring Rey to a better place.

 

i have problems too but i'm not a murderer. that takes something more and a dark side mentor to convince you it's right. he was conflicted but he went through with patricide.

gl, jj and kasdan always talked joseph campbell and the cycle of myth. most of them concern surpassing or killing the father which is about assuming manhood, your own identity and getting out of your father's shadow.

gl chose to twist it into saving the father in rotj but it makes sense to have kylo kill his dad. he thinks he can achieve the greatness that has eluded him. the myths have all of this in them. kylo is sucked into his own trap but that doesn't mean he isn't evil. when he killed han he made the choice to go beyond the point of no return. some fans don't like that but i love that decision because it makes sense. it also makes kylo a much more interesting character. redemption would ruin his journey.

 

yep I agree, with killing his own father, Kylo went into a region beyond redemption. Kylo may survive this trilogy, but if so, he will probably as a villain. Maybe more powerful, evil and twisted than ever before.

 

i think that this matter is open personally... i also think these two things often get intertwined as being the same thing:
- the villain's journey and if it would be followed in a conventional way (assumes convention)
- the feeling by fans that killing han solo is unforgivable, and the need to see the character get what he deserves

the latter often will override redemption, which i see as a central star wars theme. that doesn't mean they have to redeem kylo ren. i don't think some kind of redemption-ish arc is impossible. it just depends. i've said before that i think it might work better for eps. 10-12 if they made those.

i can see predicting a straight-forward villain arc, but i don't think it's guaranteed.

also, i've tried to leave my preferences out of this. as they're kind of in the kylo ren killed or redeemed thread.

 

i just hope it is a straight forward villain. vader was the redemption arc in my opinion. for kylo to do the same thing would be reductive. i could see him killing himself or destroyed by snoke like like han said.

that's also why the new trilogy is awesome nightangel because it's uncharted territory.

 

there are things about the villain arc that can be interesting... but i don't really want the story where he just goes more and more evil and so the hero kills him. i also don't think that a redemption arc would have to be identical to vader. i don't see this as even black and white. the character is already defined as being a focal point between light and dark, and it's possible a sort of middle ground, dark enforcer, anti-hero, sort of thing is possible too. i would be happy with anything other that just become more and more evil so the hero kills him, or being the precise repeat of vader's redemption. oh and i don't like suicide either.

 

I think the reason why Kylo fell will be important in the trilogy because his fall has a connection to the ongoing story and Episode 8's title. Episode 8 is called "The Last Jedi" so how the last Jedi (Luke and Rey or Luke, Rey and Kylo or some others) became the "last" Jedi is relevant. Based on what we know so far, Kylo is responsible for these "last" Jedi and he is also a "fallen" Jedi so I would be surprised if that was not important to the story in some way.

As for the OP's point, I think it is highly unlikely Rey and Kylo knew each other before Episode 7. I also did not see any evidence in Episode 7 that Kylo had a lost romantic love, so that is an improbable reason for his fall, imo.

I do not see how redemption would ruin Kylo's journey, especially since we are not 100 % certain what that journey fully entails yet, including his reasons for going down this path and what it all means.

I would almost agree that Kylo killing Han could have been a cut and dry sign of surpassing the father and a point of no return from his "dark" path if his response to the killing had been to become more powerful and confident. However, the result was the opposite. He was rendered a mess, shocked and weakened. It did not give him what he wanted which implies the ongoing consequences will not be clear-cut or what was expected from the act. I do not see Kylo's journey being a straightforward evil villain's journey

 

Right, and in the data bank it says that Kylo feels weakened and more lost than ever after killing his father. This is not even speculation. It is confirmed that killing Han did not make him stronger like he thought it would but rather the opposite. You can see the shock and disillusionment on his face. I don't know how someone can look at that and think he is just going to get darker.

 

come on, what did he expect after killing his father? He should have thought about it before. Now it is too late and a 'sorry' won't do it. Kylo has to pay for the consequences.

 

There must be fifty was to lose your lover

Just slip out the back, Dak
Make a new plan, Han
Don't need to be coy, droid
Just get yourself free

Hop on the bus, Bossk
Don't need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, Shmi

And get yourself free

 

He hass been lead down the garden path by Snoke. The supreme leader dangles the promise of greater power and calls facing his father the greatest test that this "Master of the Knights Of Ren" has ever faced. Passing this test amounts to murdering an unarmed man with no escape route. Although Ren clearly chooses the walkway as it forces him to go through with it as much as it allows Han no room to maneuver.


Han almost turns Ben. But to fail to show Snoke that he can pass this test, and take the power he feels he's entitled to in the process, is to confirm his weakness.

 

Yes, Han nearly succeeded. I think the entire, "I know what I have to do but I don't think I have the strength to do it, will you help me?" was about leaving the FO and going home with his father. Especially after hearing JJ's commentary which clears up the ambiguity of the scene.