Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker

Ah but in 1 and 3 his age wasn't an issue cause he didn't act like a kid. There really wasn't any way of telling either way. No young kid voice, and it didn't matter because his age wasn't added into the personality of the game. Difficult to describe but I didn't feel like I was playing a kid whereas in OoT and MM I couldn't avoid being reminded of that fact. And when he looks even more goofy it just compounds my bias.

I don't have a problem with cel shading per say (some games and genre's actually benefit from it) btw as it does allow them to do more since it lowers the poly's but I can't help the fact that they went from a really kick ass Zelda promo that had me at hello, to what is coming out now. And again no offense but I read the interview of why they switched, and it was because that type of game just wasn't possible for the level of detail they wanted. But the mere fact that it was cel shaded wasn't the deciding factor for me, it was Link himself that drove me away.

I just can't pass up on a game because of a the look or graphics.

Well graphic quality, no as I still play old NES games sometimes, but as smooth and great as the game might be if I don't want to be link I'm not going to enjoy myself. It's not the graphics it's the style and the direction and the fact that they are gearing it towards a different audience other than myself. The link from 1 & 3 worked on multiple levels and audiences because he wasn't a kid or an adult, he was just Link. I'm not looking for 19 year old link with a huge sword like Cloud's from FF7, I just want a game that doesn't look like something straight out of a Pokemon movie.

If that was the case, I wouldn't be picking up the next Mega Man game and next Castevania game or Contra game for GC because they will be in 2D.

I've no problem with 2D in the slightest. 2D, 3D as long as the game's good and you don't make them look stupid I'm there when I get my GC (which is a ways off, but I've got so much to play right now it'd just be collecting dust anyway).

 

Are there actually going to be CastleVania, Mega Man and Contra games for GC? I had not heard anything.

 

Link from the Spaceworld 2000 demo (the one that "had you at hello") looked like a homosexual shemale ready to march in the gay pride parade (not that there's anything wrong with that).

To be honest, it looked like a real cop-out to me. So many games are trying to market to the "mature" crowd that they all look the same. I think it's funny that some people are so adamant about avoiding "kiddie" games like Mario and the like that they won't play them no matter what. They feel they've "matured." To be truthful, I believe a person has "matured" when they aren't bothered by what anyone else thinks and are comfortable doing whatever they want, regardless of what it is.

My friends and I are all over the age of 25. We all have our own lives. We don't live in our parents' basements (not that there's anything wrong with that). We've grown up, moved out, moved on, have social lives (with actual women), etc. When we kick back at a get together what game do we bust out? Some uber-cool blood gore fest deathmatch-o-rama game?

Nope.

Super Smash Brothers Melee, Mario Kart, or Mario Tennis. Not one of us looks like a person you would normally think as a person who would even like a game like that, let alone a video game in general. Hell, some of us look like someone you wouldn't want to mess with in a bar. But we enjoy those games and have no problems in letting other people know that. We enjoy them because they are fun. That's "mature."

I know that's not really the debate that's going on here, but I needed to say that.

I don't care if Link is a kid. Playing a kid in a video game doesn't bother me. It doesn't make me feel like any less of a man. Just as I have no problems proudly announcing my Star Wars fanaticism. Link's art design may not be the series' best, but it doesn't bother me. I knew from the moment Miyamoto announced this game in it's current form that it would be an amazing game. I knew it long before the masses were converted at last year's E3. I still know it.

You have your weak conformists who've lost all sight of great, original gameplay in order to please those "kiddiephobic" guys who ironically can't grow up, and then you have Nintendo who bows to no man (as this game is a testament).

In the end, like what you like. Everyone else does. If you don't like a game, don't buy it or take it back.

-Jomero thinks that one could argue that a make-believe movie based in space with "laser swords" and furry dog-men is pretty childish at first glance and would have no real depth

 

The lines seem to be split right down the middle on the new look issue. I hope it works out well for the company.

I like it. Granted, some of the shots I've seen are amusing, I think it adds a whole new world of charm to our favorite hero. I'll be putting my money into it. ;-)

 

ignCube has posted information on the pre-sell bonus for the US.

"Beginning February 16 of 2003, gamers who pre-order Wind Waker at participating retailers will immediately receive access to the bonus disc which contains the two Zelda adventures."

And by immediately I assume we get the bonus when we pre-order, not when Wind Waker comes out.

 

Translated into more understandable language:
If you preorder now, you can pick up the bonus disc on February 16. If you preorder after February 16, you get it right there when you preorder.
_jOBO

 

Just looked at some of the new video captures on planetgamecube.com (well, as well as I could, seeing as how the damned things want to re-buffer every 2-3 seconds, even on a T1 line... anyone know of any more functional sites with new vid captures?) and it does appear that this is more a cel-shade hybrid than the more or less straight cell-shade animation it appeared to be in earlier vid captures. I still can't stand the Pokeman look they gave Link, though. It's not a question of being a "kiddiephobe", it's basically just an aesthetic thing. I think it's possible to not like the design choices without demanding that every game be a gore-fest, y'know?

It doesn't look terrible, but it definitely doesn't look as good as I'd have liked it to have done. Not from what I've seen, anyway.

 

Jomero you've made a whole world of assumptions (we both know what happens when we assume, yes?). First off the Spaceworld demo wasn't what I was refering to. I remember that short lived idea and yes you could tell if link was a boy or a girl (but then he looks like he got ahold of his moms lipstick in the current version)
Prior even to that there was a concept video that had Link looking like the older link from OoT that was fantastic.

As for maturity in games, I agree that blood and violence do not a mature game make, but there are elements that nintendo has always thrown into their games, that as time goes on just do not appeal to me. I consider mature games, games that are thought provoking and games whose puzzles are complicated, not simplistic to the point that I'm overestimating the difficulty or complexity. Simply put my demands for a game have grown, while many franchise games I enjoyed as a kid have not. Strategy games, open ended RPG's are my game of choice, not mindless bloodbaths.

My friends and I are all over the age of 25. We all have our own lives. We don't live in our parents' basements (not that there's anything wrong with that). We've grown up, moved out, moved on, have social lives (with actual women), etc

Congradulations, I'm 25, married (to a homecoming queen), going to have a kid in 2 years, own my own house, a 50 hour a week job, lots of friends....BFD. And my social and economic status makes a difference because? Because I disagree with you and so you assume I must be virgin Johnny Pot McSmokey living in my parents basement? (not that there's anything wrong with it of course)

I play it all. From Mario Kart (SMSU dorm room champ '97 ) to Halo to Morrowind to OoT to Masters of Orion 2. I also like watching Veggietales with my nephew. I don't need an M rating and I'm not a kiddiephobe by your definition but there are certain elements that I don't like in a game. So what? How horrible that I don't like Pokemon (loved Monster Rancher though) and I don't like a Link bowing to it's style. They might as well have made him a purple dinosaur or a weird seamonkey like creature with a TV in his belly. That's how unappealing Link is too me.

You have your weak conformists who've lost all sight of great, original gameplay in order to please those "kiddiephobic" guys who ironically can't grow up

There are some excellent M games out there. Amazingly they do have real plots, real strategy and are more than just bloodbaths. Shocking that we're not all just dillusional weak minded people who are kiddiephobes but we actually enjoy a realisitic game from time to time. How horrible I know.

and then you have Nintendo who bows to no man (as this game is a testament).

Yup, instead they bow to the whims of kids. Oh wait, Nintendo's got integrity and is the preserver of freedom in the gaming world and they're morally superior to any other multinational corp, right?

To clarify I still like nintendo and most of it's franchises, but sometimes they do go too far to appease the younger crowd to the point that it drives away gamers such as myself. This doesn't mean the GC is just for kids by any means. Like what you like with pride but sometimes you're the most critical on the things you like the most (I've got a laundry list of things I'd fix for every game I've loved over the past 2 decades). If I'd have never picked up that golden game years ago, I would have just shrugged my shoulders and moved on, but just because I didn't make the GC my first console this time doesn't negate my feelings as a fan of the series.

 

I don't care about graphics if the gameplay is good.

 

Can't we all just get along?



Anyway Wind Waker will kick major ass in a way that we have never seen before.

 

Tenor: I don't recall ANY Zelda footage before the SW2K demo. This is the gay shemale Link I am talking about from that demo. Please enlighten me if there was some Zelda footage before this that I missed.

I never made any assumptions about you. You assumed that I did. I was just stating facts about myself and speaking about people in general.

Of course I know some "mature" games have depth. I am a PC gamer primarily and a console gamer secondarily. I just don't discount console games based on the fact that the main character is a kid or is cosmetically "cute." I play games for fun, not to be continually thrust into a deep, dark world where everything must look like it came from H.R. Gieger's brain. Sometimes I enjoy games like that. But other times I enjoy other kinds. Variety is the spice of life.

Sorry to hear you believe you're not going to enjoy this game from a franchise that you used to like. I 100% certain that I am. I felt the same way about fans who couldn't enjoy the first two Star Wars prequels. I enjoyed them immensely.

Good luck in your quest to get a Zelda game you'll enjoy. That's about all I can say. Maybe you'll get lucky and the big N will release a "realistic" (hate that word, because it still looks fake and cartoony) Zelda in the future and if they do, I'll be right there with you buying it and adding it to my collection. Not because of how it looks, but because it's a Zelda game.

-Jomero

 

LOL I forgot how much like a woman he looked like, but I wasn't refering to that link. Prior to that release, shortly after the release of MM they released a concept video before the GC's details were ironed out. They used the wireframe from OoT link, bumped up 10x and it looked freaking awesome, but they hadn't even finished designing the GC at that time to know if it could run it, which sadly it couldn't and do what they wanted as well.

After that the shemale link showed up which pissed me off, and then they went with the Pokemon link.

Honestly I don't know which would have sucked worse.

Not because of how it looks, but because it's a Zelda game.

I think this is our biggest difference. I'm very judicious about my time and money and I don't have the time to spend playing, what I consider to be a poor incarnation of Link. While I'm a fan of Zelda, it does not resign me to buy a crapfest just cause they throw Link in some game just to up sales. (Star Fox adventures, Mario RPG come to mind as games that could have introduced a new genre but they opted to recyle their characters again.)

Anyway I do mean it when I say have fun playing Zelda.

 

Although the new cartoonie graphics for this game are a letdown, im still gonna get it. That is if Santa is nice enough to put a GameCube in my Stocking.... Ive enjoyed all the Zelda games, Ocarina of Time being my utmost favorite, because of the story line, and how it provoked thoughts that were surprising for me to have over a game.
For those who arent getting the game just based on the graphics and becuase you think that it will be too kidish, he still has an awesome sword, moves like backflips and all that junk, and who knows what kind of magic will be avalible to him in this game. Im gonna get it the first week its out.
Zelda has never been a letdown for me ever. And i dont expect a little looney toon Link will this time either.

 

That's one huge-as-hell stocking if it can fit a Gamecube.
_jOBO

 

ha yeah.
My brother came home for christmas, and he had this huge one, so my mom, feeling that id feel left out if i didnt have a huge one too, went out and bought the biggest stocking she could. Probably couldnt fit a GC, but hey...

 

Like any game, we should all wait until the game actually comes out to pass judgement.

 

it has come out.
You just need to read downward to understand it...
But yeah, if i had gotten a GC instead of an xbox, i would have gotten this right away. I love Zelda.

 

Has anyone but me noticed all the references to LOTR in Zelda? Some might be conincidences but some are undeniably not:

Here's thread on it:

LOTR and Zelda

 

I like the concept, but I think he's stretching it a bit thin to try and compare the two. Many fantasy elements are similar between many other fantasy games/stories. Most things can be traced back to Tolkien, just because, well, he was practically there first.

Awesome idea, but thinking that Lon Lon ranch was based off of Rohan? I dunno about that.

Thanks for the link though!

-Jomero

 

Truer words were never spoken. I myself was appalled by the look initially, but this game could end up being very fun (Aren't most Zelda games?).

 

Check out some of the movies at cube.ign.com

Some of the best graphics I have ever seen. I didn't like the cartoony look at first, but it has really grown on me. I am truly thinking of buying a Gamecube just for it and Metroid Prime, when I already own a PS2!

As for the Legend of Zelda link I posted, the GondorianRanger guy is actually my username, and while I will admit some of the things I have mentioned are a stretch, there are some that are almost indisputable, like Death Mountain and Mount Doom, not only their names but their looks.

When Gandalf called Shadowfax in TTT with his whistle I was thinking of Link completely!!

 

When they showed the first movie of the cel shaded Link, I didn't like it at all. It just didn't look good to me. But once I got to see actual shots from the game where link is being controled, I realized that these graphics fit in very well with Zelda. If I had my choice, I'd rather have the realistic Zelda, but who knows, once I get this game I may very well change my mind.

 

Having seen some of the video of GC Zelda that's now online, the most I can say is that it doesn't look as bad as I thought. I'm still not crazy about the design, though, particularly Link's Pokeman look. Most of the enemies I've seen look way too goofy too... Zelda enemies have always been a BIT on the goofy side, but still had something vaguely creepy about them (for the most part). Most of the ones I've seen just look like the designers went for sheer comedy, which IMHO puts the whole thing off-balance.

Hopefully what we've seen is just a small part of what exists, and not all the enemies will be straight out of a bad Disney cartoon.

As long as it controls as well as OOT and has an immersive storyline that tries to be something more than just comical, I'm sure it'll be a fun game.

 

People who've played through the game on the IGN boards are raving about it. They're saying it takes at LEAST 40 hours to complete the game. They are also saying it is the most in-depth and plot-heavy Zelda to date. This is good.

As for getting a Gamecube just for Zelda, well, I would. I already own one, however. Still, knowing that Zelda was coming was one of the biggest reasons for my purchase. Heck, Zelda was the reason I got a N64.

Metroid Prime is also a great game. I don't know how they did it, but it truly is a Metroid game and a very-well done one at that.

-Jomero

 

This game is going to be great, I'm just about to preorder my copy so that I can get OoT and URA
_jOBO