Lit LitBoard: Torches and Forks..

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CeiranHarmony, Oct 30, 2012.

  1. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2004
    star 5
    I know enough topics are spammed with hating, complains and worries...

    But this is, at least I hope it stays that, about WHO of you my friends will quit SW if the EU is hurt or killed by this? Be it turned infinities, overwritten and reshuffled with all post ROTJ EU in 3 year after ROTJ only.. or turned into a Marvel multiverse with crossovers after Dark Horse license is up...

    Who of you will stop buying SW stuff and stick to the old they had? Who will sell their collections or cancel preorders now to show them we will not accept this? They only learn through money sadly.. not listening to fans ever at all.


    My dream currently is of most if not all fans traveling to Skywalker Ranch.. thousands upon thousands of fans storming the fences and walls and blockading it to demand their money back, justice and a fair continuation of Star Wars with respect. Sadly.. I lack time and funds to do that.
  2. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    I know I won't.

    Star Wars is about joy, love, and a galaxy, far, far, far away.

    Turning it into something horrible and painful because of a marketing decision seems like the antithesis of what the series is about.

    New movies and cartoons means that new fans will experience the magic of Luke, Han, and their successor's journeys.

    Why would you want to deny that to your kids or nephews or those of your friends?

    Saying you'll storm Lucasfilm and do all that also seems pretty....ill-conceived. I mean, have you done this for wars or famine abroad?
    colojedi7 and TheRedBlade like this.
  3. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2004
    star 5
    I want my kid to experience quality, respect and love. Not money-dependant products that ignore fans and what came before, rip off the fans with their products that are ignored or overritten later on.

    sure I am angry and over the top currently and have to be careful to not say something that might get me banned here ;) but still I think one should not whitewash all they are doing. I am an optimist usually, but I am not nodding to all they do.

    True new fans will enjoy new Star Wars. Old Fans though? Not so much! EU fans? Hardly! that is the point.. it is great news, lots of new stuff. SW living on.

    BUT...

    it lives on and produces new stuff for NEW fans, not the old ones. that is the crux here. disrespect for us in favor of a next generation. disrespect to authors works and efforts to build the universe around the movie core, to expand it and keep it alive when there was no movie or tv to bridge decades!

    and I was not talking about storming Lucasfilm ;) just to protest peacefully and force them to finally talk to the fans truth and honest and not lie like at Celebrations and in interviews just so that money keeps flowing!
  4. Reveen Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2012
    star 3
    There's only two things I want from Star Wars.

    1. Good stories.

    2. For something inspired and interesting to be done for a change..

    I don't really care much what has to be done to make this happen.
  5. The Loyal Imperial Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2007
    star 6
    I don't feel disrespected in the slightest.
    Darth_Duck and JoinTheSchwarz like this.
  6. Ulicus Lit'ari

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2005
    star 6
    If they're straight up about it, retire the current EU and move on into an entirely new continuity branch for the Star Wars mythos, I'll have no problems. If they keep changing, tweaking and retconning the current EU to suit the true-vision-of-the-saga-of-the-week, I'll be considerably more annoyed. But I'm not a pitchfork kinda guy, so I'll probably just shake my head sadly, keep calm and carry on.
  7. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    I don't honestly care whether they keep the old continuity or not, and I've been an EU fan for EIGHTEEN YEARS.

    Continuity is like my 5th most important thing from a comic.
  8. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    I'm not interested in paying for fan fiction. I jumped ship when Star Wars moved in a direction that I didn't care for before. It doesn't invalidate what I have enjoyed about it - and I'll always watch the original OT - but I won't waste my time or disposable income on the franchise any more if it comes to that.
    KenKenobi likes this.
  9. Whuffa Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2001
    star 1
    If they steamroll over continuity im done with the EU. I've invested so much time and money into this and I feel that would be a slap in the face.
    LawgSkrak likes this.
  10. Ulicus Lit'ari

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2005
    star 6
    Continuity (internal consistency) is hugely important to me. "Canon" (what 'actually happened') isn't.

    If stories A, B and C take place in universe X, I don't expect them to contradict one another. If you want to give me universe Y, too, however, go right ahead.

    Just no crossovers please. :p
    Nom von Anor likes this.
  11. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    Eh, this strikes me as cutting off one's nose to spite the face. While I am on the pessimistic side about all this, life does go on, and I want to enjoy the products that I will enjoy.

    Tautological...a bit I guess. But still...ultimately, what I care about is my entertainment. I will buy those products that interest me, and I will use them to my enjoyment. While I believe that a strong continuity produces better products, I will still buy a continuity harming product that is interesting over a pro-canon story that does not interest me.

    Plus, truth be told, there is no guarantee that they will interpret you actions the way you hope. Matter of fact, this strikes me as something that could very easily backfire. In any case we are a very small percentage out of all the people who buy Star Wars stuff, so I can't imagine them making any major choices based off of this.
  12. Zorrixor Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 8, 2004
    star 6
    Like others have said, I'll just wait, see what happens, and just move on if I don't like it.

    The main thing I may do, however, is finally carry through with what I've been meaning to do for the past couple of years: stop reading everything and just wait and get the novels or comic trades that get good reviews.

    When it was one universe? Sure, there was a completionist value in reading The Crystal Star even if the book sucked. Now? If it does go the way of multiverses, then I'll find it much easier just to ignore the stuff I have little immediate interest in. So with any ST tie-ins I may be much more conservative about my purchasing choices.

    For instance, if the ST totally reboots Post-ROTJ and, say, Luke marries someone else, then I'll just stick to the films and abandon my hobby of reading badly written tie-ins and switch to some decent books instead. The EU is the only series of popular literature I read, so a reboot would for me be no different than reading Mass Effect tie-ins - which I don't either. I've only followed the EU out of habit more than anything.
    Last edited by Zorrixor, Oct 30, 2012
  13. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    It's not fanfiction if it's internal to the story it creates.

    But yes, here's my view.

    1. 365 trillion dead.

    2. Darth Revan dying corrupted.

    3. Jacen Solo corrupted and not redeemed.

    4. Darth Krayt

    5. The End of the New Republic

    6. The death of Mara Jade

    7. The last Solo child is an Imperial.

    8. Luke's lineage ends with Cade.

    9. Ventress escaping her crimes along with Aurra Sing.

    10. IG-88 the Death Star.

    These are just 10 reasons I don't consider everything done by "OFFICIAL" sources canon.
    Last edited by Charlemagne19, Oct 30, 2012
    Darth_Foo likes this.
  14. Jeff_Ferguson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 15, 2006
    star 4
    100% this. I'd be totally OK with the current EU being declared an alternate universe. But if the powers-that-be continue to pick and choose like they do with The Clone Wars... ugh. Man up and go all or nothing.
    Valin__Kenobi likes this.
  15. Whuffa Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2001
    star 1
    No, I'm sort of counting they won't. Especialy Disney, I mean they're probably salivating over all the toys and kiddie merch they're going to sell, and those are bought by kids who don't have a rats ass about continuity. the books and comics are such a small precentage of what they'll earn that i really don't expect them to care. it's just sad lucas would do this, but whatever. he's proved time and again he's scrooge mcduck anyway, it's not really unexpected, just sad.
  16. Blithe Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2003
    star 4
    But, Charles, that's because you also read DC comics. :p In all seriousness, I realize that the thematic messages and style of storytelling won't necessarily change with a restructuring of continuity and canon, but there is something to be said for having an established framework that everyone has to work in and work around. Having a strict continuity can be limiting and stifle creativity, but I could just as easily argue that NOT having one can do the same. It opens the door for more half-baked story ideas and creative decisions because at any moment, it can all be neatly swept away into a parallel universe, alternate universe, pocket universe, etc. I realize that this may not be close to how things actually work in the production process, but I would like to think that working under the pretense that whatever is published is going to be set in stone for now on (for the most part) will cause those in charge to think twice before publishing new material.
    Last edited by Blithe, Oct 30, 2012
    Valin__Kenobi likes this.
  17. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    A very good point, Blithe.

    But no, seriously, look at my Top Ten list above. Some of the things may be things you like while others are things you are agree are stupid but EVERYONE is bound to have a top ten list of things they think lowers their perception of Star Wars as a whole. It's the same thing with Spiderman and Superman.

    Did you know Superman was once hypnotized into making a porno with Big Barda (a married Wonder Woman-like alien)? Did you know that Supergirl once had an affair with Lex Luthor? Did you know that Spiderman made a deal with the Devil to get rid of his marriage and accidentally aborted his unborn daughter? This is the nature of continually running serial storytelling.

    Sometimes bad ideas get through and lower the quality of the franchise as a whole. There needs to occasionally be pruning to keep things fresh and enjoyable.
    Last edited by Charlemagne19, Oct 30, 2012
  18. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2004
    star 5

    exactly my point... completists like me are most hurt by this. not the casual fans who just follow their preferred cultures, characters and such.

    I mean.. as crazy as it may sound... this news ruined my day, made me unable to sleep the german night here.. and even shellshocked me honestly. I invested so much into Star Wars that it is as if they ripped out a part of me. and I had thoughts of quitting Star Wars.. though I might only quit being a completist.. or I stick to it and completism out of curiosity and curse myself for giving them money. we'll see.

    I bet it takes weeks or months till they spill more beans and inform us what is to happen how.. probably not before Celebration Europe... or until Episode 7 is out. and if I lack one thing it is patience.

    I stuck with Star Wars when it did things not as I would have preferred.. I stayed and accepted that not I am telling the story but they do it different. I accepted errors, issues and problems and helped solve them in talks with Leeland and others even! But this feels too much. I mean, sure all could be well. But will it be? if all would be well, they'd advertise it different I think, and even then we'd not fear for the future cause we know we can trust them and know this and that. but fact is, we don't and ever since TCW we know they do not give a damn.

    they like their bootlickers who applaud them for every stupidity in their blogs or on facebook. critique is outdated and overrated and hardly accepted. authors and the nice folks of course do care and are sadly bound by contract to not voice their concerns in all honesty I believe since they have to be pro-company decisions. but those who make the decisions do care not anymore.
  19. Ordo Skirata Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 2
    Wait, where did they say the were destroying the EU? All we've got so far is that Disney has bought Star Wars and there will be a seventh movie, nothing else. You can put the pitchfork down.
    Last edited by Ordo Skirata, Oct 30, 2012
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  20. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    I value your opinion and think you're a great fan and a good internet friend, C_H.

    However, let me put this in perspective.

    Do you REALLY think it's important IG-88 as the Death Star is canon? If not, let's look at it from that perspective.

    We also don't know what Disney is going to do.

    But yes, if Disney says the Old EU is ending with Crucible....isn't that a good stopping point?
    Last edited by Charlemagne19, Oct 30, 2012
  21. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2004
    star 5

    the point is... either way one can do it right or wrong. creativity is hardly limited. we have great authors creatively building their stories with and around established material (LUCENO!) whereas others feel limited by continuity and want to overwrite some of it. it depends on the author. some are great authors but only can work with freedom, others are great authors and can work in such universes. not every great authors is made for such a universe.

    still this should not ruin continuity just because some are unfit to play with it.
  22. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    And what about the very good point some stories should flat out not be canon?

    The Happy Ending of the Big Three has already been ruined not only for the Big Three but the New Republic as a whole.
    Last edited by Charlemagne19, Oct 30, 2012
  23. Darth_Foo Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 24, 2003
    star 4
    I was done with post-Endor stories once the NJO started. After ROTS came out I severely scaled down on the toys ect. I buy and only got comics/novels that filled in gaps like LSATSOM. Honestly once the Clone War cartoon is over my time with SW will be basically over anyway.

    My problem with this whole situation is:

    1. Disney is an evil soulless corporation that will now churn out SW films from an assembly line. I don't care who they get to write or direct. I call it now: Episode 9 will end with Boba Fetts helmet falling down a hill. It lands visor up. Suddenly Buzz Lightyears arm reaches out of the sand and pulls it in ala the ending of Jason Goes to Hell. Next will be the SW/ Toy Story crossover.

    2. They really won't care about the EU. "We felt we needed to start fresh" or something like that.

    3. They don't need to make Ep 7-9 because the best case scenario has already been done, Heir to the Empire, Dark Force Rising, and The Last Command.
  24. Skywalker_T-65 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2009
    star 6
    Never underestimate the power of doom and gloom...

    Seriously though, they may keep the EU, they may not. We won't know for at least a year.
  25. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    I suspect, in all likelihood, Lucasfilm will continue to exist as an independent sub-corporation.

    It's what Marvel did.

    Disney is a bit like the Empire over Bakura, you pay the Emperor's taxes and he leaves you alone. Expect an Imperial Governor installed, though.
    Valin__Kenobi likes this.