London Shootings - Breaking News!!!

So you want to live in a police state and be paranoid about everything?

 

I already feel like that sometimes.
I hope it doesn't get worse.

 

What a sad end
I am sorry for the guy, but also for the police - they had to make a snap decision and now they have to live with getting it wrong. Like I said above, Why did the guy run????, and then leap over a barricade???

I can only think -
1) his English was poor
2) He had noticed he was being watched from the previous day, got scared and ran like a muppet
3) Did have something to hide?
4) Not got a clue but you can't blame the heroic actions of the police to stop what looked like a terrorist charging a tube train.

I go with #4

Also, someone please tell me how the key witness who said about the 5 bullets describes him as "Asian" - I am sorry, but I saw pics and there is no way. Latino - yes. Asian - No way in any lifetime. So you see, the witness of 5 bullets got a basic observation wrong.

Sad situation, but every Londoner (whether guilty of something other than terrorism) has to act according to the times, and just follow instructions patiently and let the police do their jobs. Problem with so many non-English speaking people down in London though. But just don't run from a person who identifies themself as police or this may happen again.

 

I ddont think its that hard to tell who a Police officer is, they do have distinctive uniforms
And even plain-clothed officers have badges that clearly state who they are

@ Happy Ninja

 

Also, someone please tell me how the key witness who said about the 5 bullets describes him as "Asian" - I am sorry, but I saw pics and there is no way. Latino - yes. Asian - No way in any lifetime. So you see, the witness of 5 bullets got a basic observation wrong.

Probably because of lack of interaction between members of the public, and the nationality in question. Let's be honest, you don't see that many Latino people in the UK - I meant Latino, as in South American, not the Spanish who are mediterranian and aren't quite are darkly skinned as Latino's. When people see a dark skinned person, they immediately assume it's Asian as people in the UK have frequent interactions with Asian people.

But that's only a theory, though.

 

::tchh::

der posters who found der police with der guns exciting three days ago when it was a terrorist mit bullet holes in his head still make excuses for der police when an innocent young man lies dead ! hunbelievable.

that dead body could be you, your brother, your friend !

Facts corroborated by multiple witnesses (and even dose who cannot tell Latino from Asian can count to '5' I think)
? der police were not in uniform
? der police were seen putting on der marked 'police' baseball caps AFTER the chase had begun
? der was a failure to verbally identify themseves as police.

the man, it is widely believed, thought he was being mugged.

armed police with a mandate to kill on suspicion is der HUGE change for the vurse in all our civil rights, and it is himplicitly racist to tolerate dis development because ve know that der targets, this time, vill be dark-skinned.

a very bad precedent is being set.

and please, don't waste yir breath talking about how we can't afford to be soft on terrorists etc etc ad nauseum
ve get quite henuff of that already from Mr Bush .... I don't need to hear it recycled by people whose comprehension of this situation is apparently gleaned from Der Sun's editorial column......

:: tchh::

 

According to the guy's family, his English was excellent. He knew what the police were saying to him.

 

:: tchh::

once more, with feeling

? der police were not in uniform
? der police were seen putting on der marked 'police' baseball caps AFTER the chase had begun
? der was a failure to verbally identify themselves as police.

what was shouted?

eyewitnesses say "get down" adn "get down now" was all they heard before the shots.

vell Halibut, himagine you are working in Brazil.....the capital Brasilia......you can speak the language quite well, but you are clearly an outsider and prefer to keep yourself to yourself ...... then a stranger in civilian clothes follows you into a tube station and abruptly shouts at you to get down... then pulls a gun.......

 

News just in. Apparently this guy's Visa had expired.

So, occam's razor suggests that he knew they were police, and he knew they wanted him. However he probably thought they were after him because he had no right to be in the country.

 

translation for the unpretentious: 'occam's razor' = the bleeding obvious

so his Visa had expired, yah? so it was OK to shoot him then?

 

I failed to comment on your previous post, for which I apologise. I shall do so now

"der police were not in uniform"

agreed.


"der police were seen putting on der marked 'police' baseball caps AFTER the chase had begun"

I had not heard this. Can you verify this?


"der was a failure to verbally identify themselves as police.
what was shouted?
eyewitnesses say "get down" adn "get down now" was all they heard before the shots."

Now this is rubbish. The chase was going on well before he entered the tube station. They identified themselves before he started running, and as he did. Once it was clear he was not going to stop, there was no need to keep stating who they were. The entrance into the train when they shouted "get down" was only the end of the chase

"you can speak the language quite well"

He didn't speak English "quite well". He was "excellent"

"then a stranger in civilian clothes follows you into a tube station and abruptly shouts at you to get down... then pulls a gun......."

Again, this is not what happened. They identified themselves BEFORE he started running. He knew who is was running from, and it seems now we know WHY he ran. Expired Visa or not, you don't run from armed police the day after a terrorist attack - and you certainly don't run into a tube, where we had 2 attacks in 2 weeks.

"so it was OK to shoot him then?"

Yes it was. I agree it was a tragedy, but he left them with no option.

 

I ham sorry

I had no idea that you vere actually there.

I am just being relyink on der BBC news website for my hinformation.


for many years, this country has jealously guarded the principle that even those accused of the worst crimes imaginable be given a fair trial
? this is a vital safeguard in case the police get it wrong and it protects us all.

some of the arguments I see here defending shoot-to-kill are horrifying in their ignorance of where all this could lead.

 

There was no choice.

Imagine if he WAS a suicide bomber, the police didn't shoot, and hundreds of people died. Everyone would be asking why the police didn't take the shot and save lives. They would be
criticising the security.

The family of this man is now suing.

I cannot imagine what they must be feeling but what if this man was a passenger and someone ran aboard and detonated? They would be blaming the police. What if someone ran aboard and the police killed him, therefore saving their son? They would be praising the police.

The police are not gun crazed killers. The shooter has to live with the decision for ever. On this occasion they were wrong. But what if they were right?

We can make it easy for them. We can prevent this happening again. We can support these men:

DO NOT RUN FROM ARMED POLICE.

 

What I dont understand is why MrDankDonk keeps using this Vlad-the-Inhaler ID instead of just his usual one?

 

"On this occasion they were wrong. But what if they were right? "

an argument that could be used to justify anything, therefore not an argument at all.
"My fellow amercans, today we nuked russia because we mistakenly thought they had launched a preemptive strike aganst us. We were wrong this time ? but what if we had been right.....??"

ridiculous. the police have a mandate from the public to protect us, but they also have a duty of responsibly using this power we have given them, and in this case they clearly did not.

and, as I seem to be doomed to repeat, this man may not have known that these were armed police ? and anyone that wants to argue differently better be able to provide a cut-n-paste eyewitness account from a reliable news source, cos all the ones that I've read highlight that no-one knew who these guys with guns were till they put there police caps back on, by which time our man was scared and running.

this was a ****-up.
and the guy's family deserve compensation.

the issue of the visa? UK authorities are entirely complicit in a grey economy where quasi-illegal immigrants work for low wages in the service sector.
if they suddenly want to make it an executable offence, they should, at the very least, have put out some TV adverts making this change of policy clear.

 

because i find der constant effort to phonetically emulate han eastern european wampyr entertaining...

this is a place of make-believe, yah? mr stormtrooper?

 

and the burdz like the accent, don't they, Vlad ya old dog.......

 

burdz?

// eyebrows

 

Ok Vlad.

If you were the police, what would you have done?


He knew who they were, they always shout "Armed Police". He ran because he was dodgy.

 

He was stupid for running away from Armed Police. His family are even more stupid for possibly sueing people for doing their jobs.

 

However, the victim's cousin, Alex Pereira, who is based in London, said: "[The police] have to pay for [Friday's killing] in many ways, because if they do not, they are going to kill many people, they are going to kill thousands of people.


"They just kill the first person they see, that's what they did.

"They killed my cousin, they could kill anyone."


Either:

A. That is the grief talking.

B. This man is an idiot.

C. He sees the opportunity to make some good money.

 

Or Option D (which I believe is the correct one):
All of the Above.

 

Mr Vlad, may I be the first to say "Go to hell you ******* ********". This guy's family don't deserve compensation. Unfortunately, in a tragic set of circumstances, he got shot. From what I hear, several factors where involved:


He was seen leaving a house which Police had been watching after they followed several terrorist suspects there.

He was wearing a large, thick, duffle coat in summer.

Police followed him, and upon seeing he was heading to a tube station approached him and told him to stop.

He ran into a tube station.


Then he was shot.


Now I'm sorry, but speaking to people I know who just happen to be current, or former armed policemen (I worked with a couple a year or so back, they were stationed at the NT centre here in Formby), these guys did everything by the book. They don't identify themselves as Police till they get very close so as not to give the suspect time to run, as if he is dangerous this would put more people at risk. These guys have been in situations where less than a second can mean the difference between life and death, one of them asked to leave the Armed Response unit after the pressure they got put under by the attention they get when they do make a mistake (which is only human nature). He said that they have to be so careful now it actually impeeds their job, which leads to more pressure and ironically, more mistakes. Lawyers who ring up people who get shot by these units (and who, 9 times out of 10, are gun weilding crooks who deserve what they get) and try to find a case to sue for make this even worse. Apparently it is getting to the point now where the Police themselves have to put themselves at even greater risk to satisfy these regulations, trying to stop criminals (who don't need to wait for Fire orders, arn't restricted by ROE Orders, don't need to be 225% certain that the person in their sights is a threat, don't need to tell the difference between criminals and people caught in the middle, and don't have to worry about being sued if they shoot someone in the leg to prevent a known, armed and violent criminal from getting away) from being a danger to us all.

Yes it was a tragedy, but he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Now, leave those Policemen alone, as I said before, would you have the balls to chase someone who is believed to be a suicide bomber and tackle them?

But the key thing now is, this all happened because a few weeks ago several people blew up several tube trains and a bus, and now the Police have no choice but to shoot to kill else giving a bomber the time he needs to set off the bomb, or set off the explosives with a bullet.




So, get on side, and stop chatting **** else be quiet. I don't know where you're from, but if you are from the UK you should be ashamed of yourself. I hope you speak to someone who was there a few weeks ago, and has seen what we're facing, and I hope they are as offended by your crap as I am, and knock some sense into you as I would like to.

 

? "they always shout "Armed Police"."

it is alleged that , in this instance, dey did not properly do so

? 'suing people for doing their jobs"

shooting der wrong person is der job?

? 'he was dodgy'

show me the statute where 'being dodgy' carried a death sentence

an innocent young electrician, who very much liked Britain apparently, was shot in the head for wearing a large jacket and not renewing his student visa promptly.
and you dare suggest his family, today, three days after their son died, are mentally counting the compensation cash?

God spare you from anything so horrible ever happening to you or your family, cos you've clearly not got any idea what it would feel like.

 

I wish to make it clear I was applauding Dickie.