Discussion Lost in a Good Fic -- The Well of Lost Plots Social Thread

Discussion in 'Non Star Wars Fan Fiction' started by NYCitygurl, May 31, 2010.

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  1. Juliet316 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2005
    star 7
    Show Spoiler
    The way I see it, it still happened to him in another timeline, all three Doctors were still ready to do it, and even though 11 now knowns he didn't destroy Gallifrey afterall, the Doctor's before him (Hurt's, 9, and 10) don't remember that (to preserve the timeline as it stands now) and will go on assuming that they pushed the button afterall and depending on what the Doctor finds if and when he finds Gallifrey (lest we forget that when we last caught up with the Time Lords, most of them had gone insane due to the war), that guilt over what he nearly did probably isn't going to go away anytime soon. I also have mixed feelings about it, but it does open up new story possiblities and does making me excited to see how it unfolds in S8 (hopefully it doesn't derail like the latter part of S6 did post - revelation of River).


    As for Eccleston, I've seen that interview, but I do think it wouldn't have been an imposition for him to devote an hour or so filming so that
    Show Spoiler
    We could have gotten a full regeneration sequence and transition from Hurt's War Doctor to Eccleston's Nine.
    That's just my opinion and was sorely dissapointed by that.
  2. Idrelle_Miocovani Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 5, 2005
    star 6
    Maybe it's the actor in me and my own difficulties in navigating the theatre industry, but I have to respect Eccleston's decision not to return, even if it was only for a 60 second regeneration sequence. It is so difficult to stand by your own morals in TV/film/theatre and it takes a certain kind of bravery to leave a production - and once that choice is made, you have to stand by it.

    I think the fanbases of popular shows like to believe that everything is happy-go-lucky on the production side, but it's not. They can be incredibly difficult workspaces and I don't blame any actor who chooses to leave a show, even if I wanted them desperately to stay.

    Would I have liked to see Nine again at the end of the War Doctor's regeneration? Absolutely. Am I sorely disappointed that Eccleston didn't return to film it? No. Because I have to respect his decision, or else that makes me hypocritical as a theatre artist.

    In terms of Doctor Who, this isn't the first time we haven't had a previous Doctor return for a regeneration sequence. After Colin Baker was sacked, he refused to come back to film Six's regeneration, so the scene was filmed with Sylvester McCoy standing in for him while wearing a rather horrible looking wig. I just hope that in the future, Eccleston and Doctor Who's relationship can be repaired and he will be open to doing more Doctor Who things (like the audios... those audio plays are freakin' fantastic - personally, I feel that they live and breathe Doctor Who-ness than the current show itself at this point!).

    Now, 50th thoughts:

    Show Spoiler
    Even though the Doctor didn't push the button in this particular universe, I think part of him knows that he would have pushed the button in a different one. If the production/writers wanted the end result to be bringing Gallifrey - or if not Gallifrey, at least some Time Lords - back, I think they could have executed it in a different way. The Time War as a magical source of angst and drama was getting tiresome and I think the closure the 50th gave to that moment (pun not intended) in the Doctor's life is fantastic, but also I think the way they executed it was kind of shoddy. I think regardless of the explanation that "the Doctor doesn't remember he didn't do it, so he thinks that he did" does take away some of the weight of S1-7. It doesn't sit right with me.
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    I just hope that saving Gallifrey has major consequences. The 50th kind of glossed over the fact that the Time Lords were just as bad - if not worse - than the Daleks near the end of the Time War. It also glossed over the fact that for most of his life, the Doctor despised his fellow Time Lords and their society, and that he was running away from Gallifrey.

    I also have to bring up the idea/concept of the 2.7 million children on Gallifrey. Gallifreyans and Time Lords are not human. They have extremely long lives. It felt like the writing was, well, humanizing Gallifrey, making it less alien, to portray the 2.7 million children as children children. What counts as a child in Time Lord society? Someone who is eight or someone who is sixty? Someone who hasn't reached puberty yet? Time Lords are essentially immortal, so why would they have that many children? Look at other immortal peoples in other science fiction/fantasy works (like the elves in LOTR). You almost never see actual children in those societies, because why would people who are essentially immortal feel the constant need to procreate? Doctor Who seems to be making the alien cultures progressively more and more human (following our cultures (which is mainly Western culture), our ideologies, our binary gender/sexual systems...) and that just makes me shake my head. It's kind of... boring... world-building. Science fiction should take the opportunity to explore systems that are not like ours in terms of beliefs and ideologies, otherwise what's the point? To quote Jane Espenson: "You don't create new worlds to give them all the same limits as the old ones."

    Seeing the Time War was exciting at first, but then the more I thought about it, the more I disliked what I saw. It just felt so... dull. Uninspired. Laser beams and explosions. I've seen that in Star Trek, I've seen that in Star Wars. I imagined the Time War being fought with weapons that are so unfathomable that it would be almost impossible to execute it on screen - things like weapons that erase timelines, stop planets from forming, delete people from ever existing.

    Of course genocide is incredibly difficult to talk about and tackle. I don't blame Steven Moffat and the producers for questioning the Doctor's destruction of Gallifrey "because of the children". But what if there weren't any children to being with? What if all the inhabitants were full-fledged Time Lords, with their own guilt and blood-soaked hands? That was the implication I got during S1-7. It was an extremely heart-wrenching character point for the Doctor - that he was someone who was a good person who had to choose the lesser of two evils (the destruction of your people, or the destruction of the entire universe), someone who had to live with the consequences of his actions. I feel that is now taken away from the current Doctor. He always saves the day. He doesn't have to deal with consequences, or if there are consequences, they're forgotten about by the next episode.

    It's become almost impossible for the Doctor to fail. To make mistakes. He always comes up with a way to circumvent the situation, to take a third option. And that's fine, when it's only once in a while, but when it's the norm, that's just poor character development, IMO.


    Sorry, that became much more of a ramble than I thought. :p
    Last edited by Idrelle_Miocovani, Nov 30, 2013
  3. mrjop2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2007
    star 4
    Went to see Frozen for the second time today. It is, by far, the best disney animated musical to date. I loved the music so much, I just bought the sound track! The actress who did the Voice of Elsa made her acting debut at the debut of the musical Wicked, and wow... her voice is something else! I'm currently listening to her sing the song Let it Go now. That song better win an Oscar! You can expect a fan fic of Frozen at any time... maybe even today!
  4. Idrelle_Miocovani Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 5, 2005
    star 6
    Actually, Idina Menzel's Broadway debut was as Maureen in Rent, quite a few years before Wicked. But yes, she does have a fantastic, very distinctive voice. I haven't seen Frozen yet (probably won't until it comes out on DVD), but I'm glad you had fun. :) I've been hearing that it's a pretty decent film.
  5. mrjop2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2007
    star 4
    Oh yeah, you're right. My bad. The movie is FANTASTIC! Best Disney feature ever!
  6. mrjop2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2007
    star 4
    R.I.P Paul Walker! You will be missed.
  7. Master_Jaina1011 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 20, 2002
    star 4
    I was skeptical but man.... RIP Paul Walker.
  8. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
    I loved Frozen! I won't go so far as to say it's the best, but I really enjoyed it and am looking forward to the DVD. I might have to start actually buying these Disney movies so I can have my own copies :p
  9. mrjop2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2007
    star 4
    I can't stop raving about the movie. It was my favorite of all Disney movies. By far, this was the best casting Disney has ever done for their animated movies, despite on Kristen Bell being really the only well known actress in the movie. Idina Menzel just ripped it when she belted out that song Let it Go. I'm still listening to that song even now from the soundtrack. I actually like her rendition of the song in the movie better than the singer who wrote and performed the single of the song: Demi Lovato. Demi is a good singer, but Idina... WOW! I don't think anyone can do that song justice other than her.
  10. Mira_Jade The NSWFF Manager With The Cape

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    star 4
    I can't wait to see Frozen - especially since you guys say it was so good. :D Idina Menzel has been a favourite of mine for a long time, and I am stoked to hear some new pieces from her. [face_love] (I will check out that fic of yours, too, mrjop, after I see it. :D)
    NYCitygurl likes this.
  11. Juliet316 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2005
    star 7
    Everybody seems to be raving about this movie, I'll have to check it out if I get the chance (and the money).

    In other news, I've managed to commit fic this weekend. I placed a couple of short pieces up on the boards (one SW, the other DW). Happy to actually be able to write a little again.
    NYCitygurl likes this.
  12. mrjop2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2007
    star 4
    cool!

    Yeah, I'm still listening to Idina's song. I can probably recite the whole song word for word. To me, that is probably the best song of any Disney animated feature. Up to this point, my favorite Disney animated song was You'll be in My Heart by Phil Collins from Tarzan.

    The only problem with Frozen was that they really didn't market the movie as they should have. It's a whole lot better than how little they've marketed it. I mean, it received a 85 % positive reviews by Rotten Tomatoes, so even the critics are loving it.

    But then it again, It still broke Harry Potters record for biggest Thanksgiving week opening along with Catching Fire.

    Anyway, that movie opened a floodgate of fan fiction ideas, including the two one-shots I did, and I'm even researching and story boarding a full length fan fiction which deals with the origins of Elsa's powers.
    Last edited by mrjop2, Dec 3, 2013
  13. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
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  14. Mira_Jade The NSWFF Manager With The Cape

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    star 4
    Yeesssssss!! Give in to your muses, people! You will have teammates cheering you on. :D [face_dancing]
  15. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    Noooooooooooooooo!

    I really, really don't have time for this. At all.
    And now I really want to do it.

    Why, boards, why?!?
  16. Mira_Jade The NSWFF Manager With The Cape

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    star 4
    @Random Comments

    [face_batting]

    [face_batting]

    *Jedi mind trick* You wiiiiiill give in to the Diary . . . You wiiiiiiiiiill . . . */Jedi mind trick*

    ;)

    [:D]

    What were you thinking about (not) writing? :D
    Last edited by Mira_Jade, Dec 5, 2013
  17. Master_Jaina1011 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 20, 2002
    star 4
    I might. If I can find the inspiration.

    On another sad sad sad note, RIP Nelson Mandela.
  18. Mira_Jade The NSWFF Manager With The Cape

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    star 4
    @Master_Jaina1011 - Oh, but that would be wonderful! I have missed fic from you - if it is the Diary Challenge or anything. [face_love][:D]

    And oh my, but that is a sad note. RIP Nelson Mandela. A star went out there. :(
    Random Comments likes this.
  19. Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2010
    star 5
    Hi. I've never been here before.

    Yeah, I'm considering doing my first NSWFF as a River Song diary for the 2014 DDC. IF I can outline it I might do it, I'm done my semester as of Monday, so I have plenty of time to outline. But it's way out of my comfort zone (I'm all about Star Wars AU).

    Wow. Rest in peace Nelson Mandela.
    Random Comments likes this.
  20. Master_Jaina1011 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 20, 2002
    star 4
    BRIANNAKIN!!!!!

    I got way too excited about that.

    and @Mira_Jade. I might continue my old diary for Star Trek. We will see what the muse wants.
  21. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
    That's why I tagged you! Hi :p And welcome! You should come hang out :D NSW fics are super fun!

    Master_Jaina (by the way, if I've never asked, what's your preferred nickname?), you totally should! They're allowing resurrected diaries as long as there are 24 new posts this year [face_batting]

    And wow, I hadn't heard about Mandela! RIP :(
  22. Juliet316 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2005
    star 7
    Hi @Briannakin!

    I'm toying with doing one with Clara if I can remember to it. Either for one of her past lives or for another epic fic idea I have rolling around in my head.

    RIP Nelson Mandela. We shall never see a man the likes of him again.@};-
    Last edited by Juliet316, Dec 6, 2013
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  23. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    Well, I'd only just seen the post, but my mind immediately went to doing the Doctor's "2000-Year Diary," and tying it in to my ongoing unposted FF. but I'm not sure if I'd have the time.


    Ooooohhhhhh....[face_hypnotized]

    Oooooooooohhhhhhh....[face_hypnotized]


    Well, regardless of whether or not I do one, I'll certainly be reading them. No pressure or anything. :p
    NYCitygurl likes this.
  24. Mira_Jade The NSWFF Manager With The Cape

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2004
    star 4
    I am loving all of these Doctor Who diary ideas. :D The 2000-year diary sounds AWESOME, @Random Comments, if that is the way your muse goes. [face_love]
    Juliet316 likes this.
  25. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    Who stories tend to be where I go with things most often, and I've tried a bit from his prespective before...I'm just not sure I'd be able to actually write that much that regularly. So...much...schoolwork...
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