Amph Mankind's Greatest Ongoing Adventure: Stargate SG-1 (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Community' started by Jedi Merkurian, Feb 10, 2006.

  1. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    hypocritical puritanical BS!
    There was nothing lude, anti-woman, or other actual reason to cut/trim/edit/alter that scene. Just parents who don't want to have to explain body hair to minors.
  2. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    The producers just wanted it to be more family friendly fare and have long said they regretted the COTG shot, that it was more of a Showtime decision and felt out of place with the rest of the series' tone and content. So, it's removal from the Final Cut of COTG isn't surprising.
  3. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    It may have been a showtime executive decision, but the way it was filmed turned the money-shot into a scene that showed just how fully invasive and humiliating the Goa'uld posession/invasion was. It made for a well-shot not-quite-subtle analogy between the taking of a host and rape. An invasion of mind and body. To remove that after the fact the way they did strips away the value of the whole scene. If they didn't like it, they should NEVER have included it. Period. And never leaked it either. And what's not family-friendly about body hair? If the kiddies need an explanation, just tell them it's part of the difference between children and adults or men and women, and leave it at that. Wow. Problem solved!

    One of the things that greatly annoyed me about the Batman Beyond:Return of the Joker was the leaking of all the changes made by the censorship. Yes, it was better the original way, but the leaking just turned into the eventual marketing gimmic for releasing a special edition/original version.
  4. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Well, regardless of one's opinions of nudity, it's certainly easy to understand how something without nudity would be seen as more family friendly than something with nudity.

    They also hated the female incubation pouch stomach effect used in that scene (IIRC, they still keep in their offices as a reminder of how bad things can get), which I believe was cut around/replaced with CGI for the Final Cut version too, so that scene was doomed from the start to be altered ;).


    I'm just glad we got the BB:ROTJ director's cut- it really doesn't matter what marketing forces were behind it's release so long as people are able to see it now, because it's just a superior film.
  5. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    "Family is just a dirty word for censorship!" --Honey (Cecil B Demented)
    On the other hand, if they replaced the cheezy prosthetic with a CGI model more consistent with the later versions, that would be better for continuity.
  6. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    So long as it's done with the work's creators consent (or if they claim it's their intent), I don't see an issue with it. It's not like that horrible place out in Utah that was chopping stuff outta video releases of movies like Titanic to censor them, with no input or approval by either the artists involved or even the studios.


    The SG producers did have a few interesting revisions in The Final Cut- some just tighter editing, new music, alternate takes or revised CGI (most notably in the establishing shots of Chulak and that weird mutant-deathglider from the original at the end replaced by an Alkesh flanked by two real Deathgliders (both of which are now involved with the battle).

    Best change though was they had Judge re-record his lines so Teal'c sounds more like Teal'c and is able to give a more capable of performance (the original's delivery was hampered by freezing conditions on location due to the weather). It really improves some of the seemingly-flatter moments quite a bit.

    I went into more detail about other changes in my post on 7/21/09 if you want to skim back.
  7. JEDI-SOLO Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 12, 2002
    star 5
    I just thought that chick was on of Tealc's race incubating the gou ald cause the queens body died?
  8. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    What about his nasal-labial folds? (The lines from the sides of the nose that run vertically to the sides of the lips) In the first season, those or really heavy and dark, making him much more menacing in an odd way. Just watched the season5ep2 rite of Mal-shor'an episode where it shows the flashbacks to the events of Tea'lc's life, and they are only there in the break-out scene.
  9. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    They just hated the effect.
  10. Daramin_of_The_Way Jedi Master

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    Oct 30, 2004
    star 4
    I honestly liked the idea of going back and reediting COTG. I am not usually a fan of reedits due to the fact that people often take too many liberties with technology, and I am sure people can think of several examples.

    It is obvious to me after watching the original cut, during my last run through SG-1, that it needed it. It is distinctly apart from the tone of the series due to being the pilot on Showtime, before Sci-fi picked it up. I think the TOS pilot "The Cage" is another good example of different tone from the series eventually being. Nimoy and Judge are very similar in that they were trying to define an alien character and eventually came into their own. I am sure if Nimoy had is way he would go back and redo "The Cage" too.


    I personally have not seen the reedit, but I am looking forward to it, and when I collect all of SG-1 it will be apart of that collection. I like the use of the Alkesh and gliders, as well as Judge having the familiar Teal'c cadence. Seeing more of Chulak is a good idea since the planet figures so heavily in the rest of the series, and gives more background to Teal'c.

    As far as editing out the nudity part, again it is all a part of creating the tone. The producers and director both talked about it that even though they did not have an issue with nudity, the tone of the show they wanted did not fit into having such a shot. Showtime wanted it in there for a more adult audience.
    The producers wanted a more family type show and were able to do so on Sci-Fi. The evidence is pretty clear-ten seasons indicate the show found a good audience.

    On a side note about the queen emerging from the pocket, Peter Deluis, a director/producer, still has the body cast double for the lady in his office. Kind of creepy looking, but it was such an interesting effect in the show. The Jaffa's reaction to the Goa'uld coming out is different than in the rest of the show.

    Anyway, sorry for the long post.
  11. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    The Final Cut is certainly a better introduction to the series, matching it's tone better. Only oddity now is that, since they wanted TFC to function as a stand-alone movie enticement to the series, the cliffhanger subplot with the symbiote attaching itself to Kowalski was removed, so it doesn't set up the next episode as well (since i think that footage is used in the recap montage of that episode).

    However, the happier ending does fit the series much better.


    Also, slight correction on my part- it's a new cargo ship, not an Alkesh, used to ring Apophis and company down at the end. in place of the hybrid glider oddity.
  12. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    Rewatched CotG a couple weeks ago. I remember thinking that it could benefit from some speeding up. But so could the original movie!
    Does the new edit use new video footage of the gliders? most of season 1 seems to be cut shots from the movie spliced in (budget constraints).
    Not sure I agree with removing the Kawolski infection from the end. without it, the menace of the Goa'uld that was running throughout the first season is diminished.
  13. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Yeah, the Kowalsky thing is a strange situation- it both makes sense for the movie but doesn't link to the series.


    For TFC, all the glider shots are new CGI footage (or new CGI elements inserted into the original background plates).

    They do pick the pacing up- there are a few scenes and shots dropped along the way (one of the harem cutaways, for example), though they also add back in a few more character moments/dialogue for the mains too.
  14. Jedi Merkurian Episode VII Thread-Reaper

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    Oh, c'mon! Everybody knows rock beats laser. [face_mischief]
  15. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    A couple of corrections to an earlier post of mine:

    One of the latter seasons (7? 8?)Actually, it was in season 5 had the best explanation for why Earth kept defeating the Goa'uld when vastly inferior technology.
    O'Niell points to a staff. "This is a weapon of Terror. It is made to /intimidate/ the enemy."
    Grabs his the P90. "This is a weapon of War. It is made to /kill/ your enemies."
  16. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    So, I've made it to 1/2 way through season 8. It's probablly not very original to say, but season 7 blew. There was maybe 1 or 2 good episodes, but most of it just stunk.
    Season 8 is a major improvement, but not as good.
    I remember 9 & 10 being OK.
    This is a show that definately lasted longer than it should have. The end of season 6 was a perfect stopping point. Same with the end of season 3 of both Buffy and Highlander.

    Sadly, the money people don't have the taste or sense to care.
  17. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Season 7 was definitely the filler season. They were supposed to go from Season 6's finale into an SG-1 theatrical film (essentially "Lost City") that would then launch/set the stage for the Alantis spin-off.

    But Season 6 proved more successful than they anticipated, so they had to stretch things out- which is why they had to destroy Anubis's mothership at the start of Season 7, only for him to get another by Season's end.

    And then Season 7 proved successful, so we got Season 8- which required them to retool the concept for Atlantis (which is why they don't find Atlantis in Lost City, even though that would seem to be the natural conclusion it was building towards) to place it in another galaxy so that there wouldn't be two shows based off of Earth running at the same time.

    But, while we got super-filler like Space Race, we also got some of the best episodes of the series out of that season (Orpheus, Evolution 1/2, Heroes 1/2, Lost City 1/2) and a couple great Carter episodes (Grace & Death Knell). So it was about a 50/50 season (a figure much lower than most seasons).
  18. JEDI-SOLO Force Ghost

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    Feb 12, 2002
    star 5
    Space Race so stupid....
  19. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Yeah, I think, even beyond the silly race premise, the "hi-tech society untouched by Goa'uld that comes outta nowhere" bit really pushes it beyond limits.

    However, the one bit with Teal'c in the hangar almost makes it worth it [face_laugh]
  20. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    Space Race is probablly the worst episode of all 3 shows. Just plain stupid.
    Lifeboat is pretty weak too.
    Birthright opens up one of the weaker jaffa threads
    Grace is awful
    Fallout was "The Core" revised for SGC (and actually better than that horrible movie).
    Chimera openned up Carter's outside romance thread, which was also poorly executed
    Death Knell... it's like they completely forgot the episode the season before when the ashrak was playing divide&conquer in the camp.
    And Heroes... Painfully bad. Not as bad as Space Race, but almost.
    Resurrection breaks one of my rules: it's been over 50 years (at that point) since the fall of the Third Reich Nazi government. Unless you are making a period drama, no more Nazis as villains. Just doesn't hold sway any more. Neo-Nazis, sure--but even they are pretty pathetic if you think about it.
    And then we get Inauguration and Lost City drawing it all out.

    From the rushed beginning of trying to hit Daniel Jackson's reset button and get rid of Jonas, nothing felt right about the season. In fact, I think Evolution was the only really good part of the season. Fragile Balance with Kid O'Niell was amusing and enjoyable as a comedy relief episode.
  21. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Well, I definitely disagree about Heroes.

    However, while Space Race is silly and empty, it's not completely unwatchable.

    Worst episode of the series still goes to Season 1's Emancipation. It's the only episode I skipped over when marathon viewing the franchise with friends to get them hooked on the series. Not even Shang Tsung could salvage that wreck.
  22. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    I see that one as "they had to do it sooner or later:better sooner so they can get it out of their systems and move on." I skip the Nox episode when watching season 1.
  23. JEDI-SOLO Force Ghost

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    Feb 12, 2002
    star 5
    The Nox are superbadass! lol

    Just for a note: I thought Showtime was just playing Children of the Gods the other day when I said it in this thread but they ve been playing the whole season out.
  24. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    I don't mind the Nox- it has a decent premise/concept. I only dislike Apophis in the episode- not only because I don't like Apophis in general, but here his costume looks even cheesier and cheaper than it normally does and just brings the quality of the episode down the moment he's trotting through the woods.
  25. JEDI-SOLO Force Ghost

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    Feb 12, 2002
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    ScyFy is playing SG-1 right now everynight at 1am Central. I forget what season this is but it is starting with Ben Browder trying to get SG-1 back as a team, Beau Bridges as the Gen, Vala in guest form and not a member yet. So S8 or S9 I think?