Mara Jade, Hate her? Love her?

Mara's is the best EU character

*hides behind AG and draws her blaster, waiting for the attack of the haters*

 

Mara is the worst EU character created. *Shot aimed and deflected off the wall as to not hit AG but hits Jadie instead*.

 

Was there a reason for the necropost?

 

I'm coming here to defend those who do not like Mara, and to try to show that "conservitive Christians" can be intellectual in their thought. I'm glancing through this topic, and I noticed it somehow erupted into a fierce show down between two political views.

First I'd like to say, in the political discussion I agree and disagree with both sides. I know, shocking.

I do support Bush, and think he is trying to do what's best, but being a thinking person, I don't just follow ANYONE blindly, and disagree with some of his policys. The Patriot Act, for example, makes me.. Uneasy. No it's not Bush I'm afriad of, but the act itself could be used by a future President or goverment power to overthrow alot of our Freedoms. What maybe used today against Terrorist, could be used tomorrow against Jews? Hispanics? Christians? Anyone. It's a dangerous step, IMHO. Something meant for good, but that could be used for evil. I do not care for Ashcroft, either. I agree with his princibles, but the way he says it puts me off. And spending $8,000 just to cover a partial exposed breast on a statue? I'm sorry, but stuff like that is too "in your face".

Now, I don't see Akria or rogue_wookiee as being preachy. They stated their opinion. If you disagree, you should analyze what they said, and then break it down, in cool collective manner, explaining why you BELIEVE it is wrong. Remember, just as they can be wrong, so can you. I find your quick sarcasm at them once they mentioned they were Christians, to be out of line. You are not showing any sort of acception of their beliefs.

No, but admitting you don't know everything might help. Your belief is a belief. Common sense would override such notions but you are free to cling to what you see fit.

I'm sorry, but the above commet was very offensive. All he stated was that like his religious beliefs, he's going to stick to what he beilfs on the EU canon debate. Your flaming of an entire religous sect is wrong. It's wrong to do it to Muslims, Jews, Buduhist, etc.

Another thing. The Earth is not 6 billion years old. It's been proven, that it's not T_F. The age of the Earth is 4.6 billion years old, +/- 500 million. The sun's proto-cloud began forming arounf 5.4 billion years ago. And yes, T_F I am a Creationist.

Now... Back on topic.

Shelly... You make the most sense on Mara. She is a disgrace to the Empire and all the loyal subjects thereof. No, that was not sarcasm.

 

Wow, I just now noticed that T_F said the Earth was six billion years old. Wow. If you're going to step to the accuracy of someone else's beliefs, you might as well be right in your own...

 

Hey, Neo you hit me!
Just tell me why you don't like her. I would like to understand that. Though, it won't make change my mind: Mara is the best EU character

Edit: that's cool Callie.

 

Hate her,... Love her... *grins* guess you could call it a love hate relationship!

If Callista had never existed I'd be a total and complete Mara person... (probably cause I'm pleased by anything that pleases Luke, hehe I'm weak yeah I know.)

Years ago when I first read the stuff me and my best friend took on the alter idents of Callie and Jade. Just proves that all that animosity out there is for naught! (amazingly enough 9 years down the road my email still has Callie in it and hers still has Jade!)

I think I like Mara a lot more in the actual novels then in the fanfic I've read.. the fanfic tends to make Mara a bit on the overbearing scarey mean side and by default turns Luke into a lameduck who's pretty much whipped! But sticking to the *coughs* real world, *grins* yeah I'm totally cool with Mara. Prefer Callie being around *sniffs* but since that's not gonna happen unless I get my dark callie story finished I'd better jump on the Luke and Mara wagon!!! =)

 

I think that many people don't like Mara cause they prefer Callista... It's just a thought...

 

Well at least your in the majority and not the minority. *smiles* it's much easier to find someone who dislikes Callista than Mara.

I'd say a big reason for the split in preferences is that Callista is more of a girl's girl, while Mara is a hard hitting feminist kinda gal, she wants to be loved but she doesn't need it, she's been through the rough and she's tough now, she can take it. Callista needs to be loved. Even before Luke there was Geith, she's strong, but wants to be strong with her man loving and supporting her every step of the way.

 

Callie, that's it! You're absolutely right! I think that Mara fans like her because she's independent, among other things.

 

I think I like Mara a lot more in the actual novels then in the fanfic I've read.. the fanfic tends to make Mara a bit on the overbearing scarey mean side and by default turns Luke into a lameduck who's pretty much whipped!

Callie, you definitely have not been reading the same L/M fanfics that I have.

AG88

 

88 got any particulars you'd suggest to slowly wean me onto a positive Mara outlook? =)

 

I PMed you my recommendations Callie.

AG88

 

Mara is the worst EU character created.

Worse than even...Waru? Or Akanah?

 

Good point, Geith.

 

Well, I don't like Callista.

I don't mind tough chicks either. I think Ventress is awesome. Uncomprimsing and a bad ass worth her salt. And she never goes around saying how she's so tough, and she's so bad. She don't talk. She shows it. She doesn't threaten, she comes on like a freight train from the shadows. She don't posture, she wins.

Mara is more talk than action. She just loves hearing herself dispense all kinds of hypocritical, uneeded, unheeded (evidently) advice to people that outrank the crap out of her. Only Luke asks for permission to sneze. Everyone else avoids her. The way she treated the Ferroans is the epitome of how I see the character.

What I don't like are hypocrites. You, know, holier than thou people that do exactly WHAT THEY CRITICIZE OTHERS FOR DOING. Oh lapdog of the Emperor that *hates* the other lapdogs, because she thought she was the only special poodle. So much so that she can't stop grandstanding and self congratulating herself some 30 years later.

The equivalent would be Luke talking about threading the needle or blowing up the DS1. Luke: Back when I gloriously blew up the renegade DS, starting a chain of events that would bring the criminal Empire to it's knees.......
Would Luke ever do this? no, because he's moved on, and has become even better.
But Mara's every other sentence is "Back when I was the Emperor's Hand, in case No one KNOWS, I was the Emperor's Hand, Like your hand is to you, that's how close I was to the Emperor, never mind that he destroyed everyone' lives in this room, well, my life was completely destroyed too, for all time, because my position was eliminated... Yeah, blah blah blah, get over it.......


(I wonder how long it takes for the room to clear when she starts? My guess is 12 seconds, except for Luke who sits there vapidly grinning like an idiot, enveloping redgold babbler with his enabling love.)

 

Love Mara!

Espallicly how sarcastic she was to Luke in the beginning (since I'm not a big Luke fan )

 

Good post, Tiershon.

Mara's is the best EU character

Even if she is, that's not saying much.

Shelly... You make the most sense on Mara. She is a disgrace to the Empire and all the loyal subjects thereof. No, that was not sarcasm.

Thanks, I think.

By the way, I think the political stuff is best discussed in the appropriate JCC thread or via PMs.

I think that many people don't like Mara cause they prefer Callista... It's just a thought...

I doubt it. Callista was no prize either, IMO.

IMO, Mara is not a strong woman; being a rhymes-with-witch and having a bad temper does not equal strength to me. As for her speaking her mind -- that's fine, but one should also know when to keep one's mouth shut. She doesn't. She has the tact and sensitivity of a bull alligator. IMO it takes more strength to be compassionate and caring toward others than it does to kill people.

I think I like Mara a lot more in the actual novels then in the fanfic I've read.. the fanfic tends to make Mara a bit on the overbearing scarey mean side and by default turns Luke into a lameduck who's pretty much whipped!

You sure you're talking about the fanfic and not the profic?

 

Personally I liked Callista and still do and was sad that she was writen out. I thought Luke and Callista were a FAR better match then Luke and Mara can ever hope to be. I also like how Callista and Leia got along as well. Children of the Jedi is actually one of my favorite novels since I love the interaction between Luke and Callista.

Its one of the very few Star Wars novels I have left and make sure I don't lose.

Though that isn't why I dislike Mara and even hate her at times. In fact I think I've stated my reasons for my dislike quite a few times already, even in this thread.

IMO, Mara is not a strong woman; being a rhymes-with-witch and having a bad temper does not equal strength to me. As for her speaking her mind -- that's fine, but one should also know when to keep one's mouth shut. She doesn't. She has the tact and sensitivity of a bull alligator. IMO it takes more strength to be compassionate and caring toward others than it does to kill people.

I agree completely Shelley and that's basicly what I feel.

For the one that made the comment about people might not like Mara cause they might not like strong women or hinted at that. I can't tell you how much comments like that piss me off. It's crap like that that just keeps my dislike and hate for Mara alive everytime I hear and read that. Sorry but acting like a bitch does not equal strong in my eyes. I've said before that I like strong and independent female characters yet those that act in the manner Mara acts I don't. Its also how other characters are writen when they are around her that really gets to me. Leia thinking that Mara is braver then her or wishing she was as brave as Mara. What kind of pure grade A crap is that?

 

*grins at Tiershon_Fett* I'd never say it, but I'm glad you did! Nice rant there =)


and erm NeoStar when I said feminist, that whole bitchy attitude was supposed to be implied. *ducks for cover* Some of my best friends are feminists, *coughs* but if I ever have to take the course in politics again my head is gonna explode.

I just finished reading COTJ again and Callie is definitely strong, I mean she stayed on the ship, gave up her whole life when Geith wanted to split and go for help, just so she could protect the galaxy from the Eye, that is by no means weak to me! She's just not 'in your face' with her strength like erm others.

Did Leia really say she wanted to be brave like Mara? Really she said that? *aghast* that's the stoopidest thing ever. Leia was the ORIGINAL brave star wars tough chick. =)

 

Did Leia really say she wanted to be brave like Mara?

She told Mara: "You're a braver person than I am."

Later, Anakin wished his dad, Han, could be strong like Aunt Mara.

Just one of the many examples in the NJO of Mara being treated like an ideal to which all the other characters are measured, and found wanting. It's really nauseating.

Really she said that? *aghast* that's the stoopidest thing ever. Leia was the ORIGINAL brave star wars tough chick. =)

Yep. When "Alien" was re-released a couple of years ago, some journalist claimed that Ripley was the original tough sci-fi heroine. Er...no. Leia was. Ripley was originally created as a male character, but after the success of SW, Ridley Scott, et al realized that audiences would accept a tough, weapon-wielding female protagonist in a sci-fi movie.

For the one that made the comment about people might not like Mara cause they might not like strong women or hinted at that. I can't tell you how much comments like that piss me off. It's crap like that that just keeps my dislike and hate for Mara alive everytime I hear and read that. Sorry but acting like a bitch does not equal strong in my eyes. I've said before that I like strong and independent female characters yet those that act in the manner Mara acts I don't. Its also how other characters are writen when they are around her that really gets to me. Leia thinking that Mara is braver then her or wishing she was as brave as Mara. What kind of pure grade A crap is that?

Couldn't agree more, Neo.

 

Neither hate, nor love.

 

I completely hate Mara Jade. Her marriage to Luke marks the end of all that I enjoyed in the books. Enter the NJO and the total destruction of anything resembling Star Wars. I will give her some credit though. She's not as much of a loser as some would say. After all, she DID manage to kill Luke Skywalker after all.

 

I thought this died after it became "R_W, Hate him? Love him?"

I don't mind tough chicks either. I think Ventress is awesome. Uncomprimsing and a bad ass worth her salt. And she never goes around saying how she's so tough, and she's so bad. She don't talk. She shows it. She doesn't threaten, she comes on like a freight train from the shadows. She don't posture, she wins.

Have you read Clone Wars 5? She is a weak pathetic person. Her strength is only skin deep. She thinks she is tough and strong. But she isn't. She talks big. But she gets pwned by Obi-Wan. I don't find anything about her to be "awesome". Just an empty shell of rage. Worse than GG. At least he was forced that way. She is pathetic of her own free will. Dooku reflects on her in either LoE or DR. I can't remember which.

Mara is more talk than action.

You really need to hunt down a copy of By the Emperor's Hand. Most of your complaints about Mara are silenced by it. She is all action and little talk. Most of the talk is her thoughts.

Only Luke asks for permission to sneze. Everyone else avoids her.

Not true.

The way she treated the Ferroans is the epitome of how I see the character.

Where was this?

 

I like Mara most of the time. True, she can be a b*%$#, but most of the time it's to people who deserve it. One of the things I like most about her is that, unlike a lot of the other characters, she's only nice to people who she thinks have earned it, which is more believable for me. She's practical, fiercely loyal and intelligent.

The times I don't like Mara are mostly when she starts getting arrogant. More than any other character besides Anakin Solo or Kyp (or Anakin Skywalker, but I'm just talking EU here), Mara is prone to delusions of grandeur, based mostly on the fact that she was the Emperor's Hand. It's understandable, but after all this time you'd think she'd have gotten over it. Also I am a strong Luke supporter, and I dislike it when plots are written where any EU character apparently knows more about the Force, after little or no training, than Luke. So that's Mara and Corran right there.

But overall, I think she makes a good match for Luke. I liked Callista okay, but most of the time I like Mara's character better.