Mara Jade Hater Club

Discussion in 'EU Community' started by rngenzi, Apr 14, 2001.

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  1. Aunecah_Skywalker Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 25, 2002
    star 5
    OWLC :
    But I do not see anywhere in the passage I typed up earlier which
    has Mara denying Luke these feelings.


    I know. You are saying that Mara just wanted Luke to stop projecting the emotions through the Force. All I am trying to say is that by asking Luke to dampen the emotions he's projecting through the Force, she is, in effect, asking him to stop "feeling" or "lessen feeling" the emotions. If he is so depressed that he can't help projecting it through the Force, how else is he going to NOT project it through the Force than stop feeling those emotions?

    Yes, I know sometimes (esp. new parents) want to protect their son first. But what I can't get over is that when she sees Luke grieving, and feels Anakin dying (which she must have), the first thing that jumps into her mind is ... BEN!

    Actually yes I can imagine her crying, she has even done it in a book.


    I think she actually cried in VP, but I still can't imagine her crying. ;)

    But how much of these emotions did they [Jacen, Jaina, and Anakin] feel during their first two years of life when they were the most succeptible to these emotional influences projected through the force?


    I can't see how they (esp. Jaina and Jacen) can miss feeling emotions from around the galaxy even if they are sent away to a planet whose location only very few people know. The Force is everywhere, right? So, given their innate ability, they should have felt extreme disturbances. Of course, they might not have felt minor disturbances - such as anger, hatred, fear, etc. of the population of the planet because there was no population. But they would/should have felt something.

    How many of those children had force sensative parents who dealt with such an extreme emotional moment?


    Well, considering that Force runs through families, meaning that if a child is Force-sensitive then there is a good probability that one or both of the parents are Force-sensitive....

    How many of those emotions were felt via someone else projecting them thru the force?


    He might not have felt all that many emotions projected through the Force. But he is bound to have felt anger, hatred, fear, etc. Does the emotion of someone else you feel through the Force influence you more than the emotion that you, yourself, feel?

    Aunecah_Skywalker
  2. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    I agree with those that are wondering why certain posters are getting so angry and defensive simply because some of the regulars here may or may not be EU lovers. So what? Aren't they entitled to their opinions? As long as they keep it in this thread then whats the problem?

    DVader, thank you for saying that. Coming from the Grand Admiral of the EUDF makes it even better.

    Yes, I'm anti-EU, for the most part, and I mentioned this a couple of times in the thread, but it never mattered, even though we have people who like the EU, because we all hated Mara Jade. Other people on this board have had problems with that. They can't (or won't) understand that sometimes we can come together to hate a single character, whether we're purists or completists.

    To those who still come in here wanting us to justify our hate, please stop. Read the many pages we have. In between the torture/death matches(which many people didn't like), we have real reasons. Read them, don't ask us to repeat them for the upteenth time. We don't ask you to repeat over and over why you like a certain character.

    Also, though I know no one will listen to this anyway, I have to say it: Please leave us be. Many of us here are about to lose our community. Let us mourn for the loss of a great thread in peace. We're going to be closed in, what, 2 days or less? Let us die with a semblance of dignity. When the other threads closed, ATF and so on, we didn't gloat, and neither did you, I think. Give us the same consideration. You can cheer all you want after this thread is locked.

    But until it's locked, Leave us be! Let us die in some peace, please.

    On topic, Mara Jade should die! (since I can't say 'Sucks' anymore.)
    *rolls eyes*
  3. DVader316 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2000
    star 7
    Well said. I just hope people take your post to heart.
  4. Nephrite Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2002
    star 1
    Did anyone se the Force Heretic cover ? It shows Mara and some guy in the shadow (Mara's hair blocks the light so i coudn't identify him)

    Guess who will be in the center of the story in that book?

    I wonder what are Leia & Han doing?
  5. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    Once again, Tang is at the center of it all.

    How nice. [face_plain]

    And DVader, I hope so too. :)

    I doubt it, though. :(
  6. Nichos_Marr Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 26, 2001
    star 4
    Maybe Luke will shoot Mara with that blaster he has :p .

    The artistic rendition of her doesn't really make her look all that pretty. I'm not saying the artist (who I believe is the same artist that drew the Aalya Secura cover that caught George's eye) is bad, far from it. Maybe this book will describe her as actually showing some signs of aging.

    After all, she does look a bit like Nil Spaar (from BFC) with a red-gold wig :p

    Oh and Darth Pipes...

    But Stover did say in his TF.N interview that he thought it was closer to the true nature of the Jedi. Clearly this is what he believes and that is why it's in the story.

    Yeah, I know. But the fact that Del Rey and LFL allowed him to do this seems to quell most of my worries. I mean, they wouldn't be incompetent enough to contradict what's been stated in the movies and the majority of the EU, would they? Well...I guess anything is possible in NJO if they ruined Coruscant...

    I just hope that there is a Dark Side in future EU :(
  7. Crazy_Vasey Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 8, 2001
    star 4
    No Dark Side in EU = me not buying any EU. That's going TOO far from the films as far as I'm concerned. To believe the Traitor stuff you have to believe that everyone in the films is wrong... I don't think so.
  8. Darth Pipes Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 12, 1999
    star 5
    Exactly. That's one of the big reasons I'm through with the NJO and classic trilogy EU. Too much attempted alteration of the movies to fit their own agenda.

    As for La Matress, she is one of the problems.
  9. Nephrite Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2002
    star 1
    It's probably a coincidence, but this cover shows the state of things in NJO. Everybody lives in Mara's shadow just like LEUke on this cover.

    ¤Nephrite¤
  10. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    Ah, very well said, Nephrite

    Luke isn't even in the center of things anymore. It's Tang, Tang, Tang, all the way, all the time. [face_plain]

    Mara needs to die now! :mad:
  11. LadySilver Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    I've been away from my computer lately- I have a bad sinus infection and my server decided to throw a tantrum yesterday. Looks like I missed some interesting give-and-take.

    Sorry to drag the thought train off-topic once again, [face_blush] but who is moving with the MJHC to the Haters Club? I don't want to be the only one there to defend our viewpoints. :_|

    And who's doing the next story? :D
  12. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    I'll still be here, LadySilver. As for stories...we'll see. :)

    DIE MARA!
  13. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    I know. You are saying that Mara just wanted Luke to stop projecting the emotions through the Force. All I am trying to say is that by asking Luke to dampen the emotions he's projecting through the Force, she is, in effect, asking him to stop "feeling" or "lessen feeling" the emotions. If he is so depressed that he can't help projecting it through the Force, how else is he going to NOT project it through the Force than stop feeling those emotions?

    I see where you are coming from and can understand your logic. Its a tough call to decide one way or another if dampening the force would force you to dampen your emotions too. With Luke who has such an amazing control of his force powers I think you could make arguments either way. especially with Luke who is always so open to the force normally I can understand those who can argue that he would have projected it either way or the argument you just gave.

    Yes, I know sometimes (esp. new parents) want to protect their son first. But what I can't get over is that when she sees Luke grieving, and feels Anakin dying (which she must have), the first thing that jumps into her mind is ... BEN!

    I can understand the frustration someone who is a fan of Luke thinking its wrong to bypass his emotions for Ben's. I can also see the point to where here is a woman who thought she would never have a chance to have a child with Luke and then it happens causing the preoccupation with it all. Its kinda a damned if you do it one way damned if you do it the other way.

    The whole force sensative thing as infants thing is one of those subjects I wish had never really been brought up ages ago by ole KJA. I was never a big fan of the idea back then, although I understood the logic. It still felt rather weak, so its not a topic I can see working to well any place.

    Thanks again Aunecah.

    Hey Jedi_Suzuran its been a little while. I never got a chance to see what ya thought after I typed out the one passage we had been discussing.

    OWLC

    Edit: Oh and J_S when you say you dislike the EU for the most part what do you mean by that. I am kinda curious.
  14. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    OWLC, others (Aunecah especially) have stated my views better than I could have. :)

    I appreciate the fact that you typed the quote for us. :)
  15. jewlmc Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 1999
    star 4
    I am so sorry this thread and other threads alike are being closed. I don't see what the big deal is about a thread dissing a FICTIONAL character. Now if someone had a Han haters....or Leia Haters....or Luke haters...ect...I would be a tad purturbed...BUT I would steer CLEAR of it and allow those people to have their say.

    If the mods think that a combined "haters community" will make it more peacful, they couldn't be more wrong.

    Do you know how many clashing, violent emotions will be bumping into each other in that thread? Not fun for anyone. Soon anyone wanting to truly vent will be spending less and less time on these boards and those that do stay will be warring all over the place.

    It's a shame.
  16. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    OWLC, I only read Jedi Apprentice and Jedi Quest, which is the only EU I don't hate.
    As for why I hate the rest, the reasons are too numerous to get into in this thread. Suffice it to say that I have reasons. :)
  17. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    OWLC, I only read Jedi Apprentice and Jedi Quest, which is the only EU I don't hate.
    As for why I hate the rest, the reasons are too numerous to get into in this thread. Suffice it to say that I have reasons.


    I understand you not wishing to mention them, but I am curious if you dislike it mainly, how many EU threads do you post in? I also would still love to hear your thoughts, I love getting as many views as possible

    OWLC
  18. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    About the only EU thread I post in is the Gaeriel Captison Fan Club. She was a good character, who I like. :)
  19. Sreya Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2000
    star 2
    Page 94... come one, people, PLEASE, let's get this up to 100!!!

    Okay, time to rant... here's the quote in which Mara is equated to Vader (or, should I say, Vader is slimed down to her level):

    Vision of the Future
    pg 427
    Paperback edition
    Mara swallowed. That name {Kinman Doriana} she most certainly did recognize. He'd been Palpatine's right-hand man, supposedly one of the grand architects of his rise to power. "I've heard of it, yes," she said.

    "I thought you would have," Parck said, nodding. "Very much a shadow adviser -- few people ever even heard his name, let alone knew his true position and power. But among those who did it was sometimes speculated that his untimely death left a gap which Palpatine ultimately tried to fill with three other people: Darth Vader, Grand Admiral Thrawn --" He smile again. "And you."

    "You're too kind," Mara said evenly, not even a whisper of pride rising within her at such a statement. So she had indeed had position and authority in Palpatine's eyes, perhaps more than even she had realized.

    But it didn't matter. That part of her life had died, unmourned, a long time ago.


    First, let me please go find some alkaseltzer. Ugh.

    Next... what the heck, no pride at that statement. That's why she's marvelling at the power she supposedly held in Palpatine's esteem.

    Sorry, she should have felt REGRET at that statement. Embarrassment. SOMETHING other than what ended up coming across as a smug self-satisfaction. Blech.

    I'm not even going to comment on her being raised to the same level as Vader... sheesh.

    Talk about ego-stroking.

    Sreya

    EDIT: I forgot to comment on "unmourned". Yeah, that's why she spent FIVE YEARS hunting down Luke Skywalker with murderous intent.

    Riiiiiight....
  20. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    Ah yes, that quote.

    The idea that she's that important to the God Palpy is laughable, and that's being kind.

    Palpy trusted no one, of course, but he sure as hell gave whatever little power he wanted to Vader, his apprentice. Rule of two, rule of two.

    Mara Jade shouldn't be portrayed (or even hinted at, in veiled statements by 3rd parties) that she was at the same level as the Chosen One. [face_plain]
  21. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    There is another possibility about this statement. Although I also happen to agree with you Zahn went overboard with the statement. Part of me also thought, perhaps the statement was made to try and entice Mara. Make her think she was bigger and more powerful than she actually was. Its a statement I have pondered many times. Does he say it to flatter her, inform her, impress her, or perhaps just lure her? Although I do miss her "marveling" at the statement though. Although that can just be a perception thingy. Oh and JS? You are a fan of a former almost flame of Luke's eh? :p Interesting. :D

    OWLC
  22. Jedi_Suzuran Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 5
    Oh, I'm sure it was said with equal parts lure and information. The information part is what's wrong with that quote, IMO.

    To my mind, she is nowhere near being put near the same pedestal as the Chosen One. Being an Anakin fan that I am, this is one of the reasons why I hate Tang.

    And yes, OWLC, it's interesting that I like an old flame of Luke's. ;)
    I kinda liked Callista too, in COTJ. It sucked that Gaeriel died. :mad:

    Before you ask, I did like Mara, for quite a long time, until I changed my mind. :)
  23. Darth Pipes Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 12, 1999
    star 5
    Mara's a Mary Sue. Mary Sues don't have things like regret.
  24. Obi_Wans_love_child Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 4
    Mara's a Mary Sue. Mary Sues don't have things like regret.

    You may be surprised, by who has regret when all things are said and done.

    OWLC
  25. Darth Pipes Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 12, 1999
    star 5
    It was once La Matress started showing her more of her Mary Sue qualities in VOTF and the NJO that she truly became the character we all hate today.
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