Maybe Plageius did create life, just not Anakin?

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by Darth_Buddy_Lee, Jan 9, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Darth_Buddy_Lee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 30, 2004
    star 1
    I just was thinking about Sidious and how powerful he is. This is probably classified as a "whacky" idea, but what if the story Palpatine is telling Anakin at the Opera is about Palpatine himself. What if he was the one Darth Plageius created? His creation could be the reason the force was so out of balance (I mean there have been Sith for millenia, and it is stated by Mace that the Sith once ruled the galaxy ("The oppression of the Sith will not return") and just now the force is thrown out of balance). Could Anakin have been created by the force to counter the imbalance of the creation of Sidious?

    Or

    Anakin may have still been created by Plageius, but after he created Sidious. Possibly, he had perfected the technique and created a second apprentice, that was to replace Sidious?

    Thanks for your thoughts
  2. Dirty-Darth Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2004
    star 3
    YEah, I was never a fan of the idea that Plagueis created Anakin...not too sure why. Just wasn't. I like you're first idea of force creating Anakin to counter imbalance of Sidious.
  3. SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2003
    star 6
    As far as the film is concerned, it was left vague. However, the Novel, Dark Lord states clearly that Plagueis never found out the secret.
  4. YYZ-2112 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2004
    star 4
    This is the best theory I have heard so far concerning the Plageius Legend.
  5. YYZ-2112 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2004
    star 4
    Well the reason it sounds half baked is because it is. If Anyone had created Anakin (Plageuis, Sidious, whoever) they would have molded him from birth to be a Sith Lord. He would not have been randomly wandering a backwater planet forging his own destiny. Palpatine made the best of his discovery of Anakin but ideally, he would have been raised from birth in a highly coordinated military complex under intense training and study in Sith lore and combat disciplines. Even if the created life form requires a birthing host like Shmi; she would have served her purpose than been eliminated so the bond between Sith Master and Apprentice would have been stronger.

    EDITED PORTION: Also if it was intended to be known as a random creation, then that would have been included in the legend to reinforce whatever point it's supposed to make.
  6. Darth_Buddy_Lee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 30, 2004
    star 1
    I haven't read that, but isn't it considered EU?
  7. Darth_Buddy_Lee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 30, 2004
    star 1
    Unless it was the force that created Anakin to counter the imbalance of the creation of Sidious, then he would not have been trained from birth. I think that the first part of my theory is at least plausible.

    Edit: I just realized you were talking about Plageius creating Anakin and not my theory.
  8. TK9993 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 8, 2006
    I actually like your idea better.
    It explains more than "Well....I was down at Mos Espa one night and thought, wouldn't it be funny to get that slave pregnant and then just disappear?".
  9. darth_ral Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 9, 2004
    star 1
    i always thought this from the second he made the speach in ROTS. it is much more exciting and dramatic than anaking being created by evil
  10. Darth_Sideous Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2004
    star 4
    I just was thinking about Sidious and how powerful he is.

    I thought the Sidious/Yoda match was a pretty even battle. Yes, Sidios won, but not but not by a big downfall. I don't think Sidious is as powerful as we think. I mean, Mace very much seemed to have the upper hand on Sidious. Had he continued to feed the lightening back at Sidious, it would have killed Sidious.
  11. TK9993 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 8, 2006
    But I think that was a lot of acting because he knew Anakin would see that.
  12. darth_krumbum Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2004
    why can't people just accept that the sith lie? thats what they do. plagueis couldn't create life. sidious couldn't create life. anakin was concieved by the force (and lucas has explicitly stated that he did this to avoid having to explain who anakin's father was etc, although the exact opposite seems to have occured) and had no father, other than the force. he was brought into existance to bring balance to the force, and kill sidious. this isn't a hard concept to wrap around, and all this 'plaugeis created anakin, what did plaugeis know etc, is just half-baked and half-cocked ideas. the answers are all there in the story. whether you accept it or not is up to you.

    peace,
    Krumbum
  13. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    Interesting theory, not a lot of evidence.
  14. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Lucas wasn't being exactly truthful. He was holding back the revelation in ROTS that Sidious created Anakin. There was a scene where this happens, but Lucas changed his mind again.

    "There is a hint in the movie that there was a Sith lord who had the power to create life. But it's left unsaid: Is Anakin a product of a super-Sith who influenced the Midichlorians to create him, or is he simply created by the Midichlorians to bring forth a prophecy, or was he created by the Force through the Midichlorians? It's left up to the audience to decide. How he was born ultimately has no relationship to how he dies, because in the end, the prophecy is true: Balance comes back to the Force."

    --George Lucas, Rolling Stone Magazine



    As to Dark Lord, that's not entirely true. Because the New Essential Chronology states that it's not clear if Plagueis did create Anakin or if Palpatine did it. All that's clear is that Sidious learned what Plagueis was doing and killed him in his sleep. Then Anakin was born and when Palpatine discovered his origins, he made an effort to get ahold of him.
  15. Carnage04 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2005
    star 5
    I always have held a theory similar to this with no Basis for fact, but just something to entertain me. I always thought Plageius sat around meditating, trying to perfect Midichlorian Techniques while his apprentice, Sidious was hell bent on Galactic domination. The two never really saw Eye to Eye, and Plagueis wanted a new apprentice. While Plagueis was doing his old conjuring act, Sidious got himself Darth Maul and started training him, with the intent of overthrowing his master after he found out any secrets that Plagueis had uncovered.

    One Fateful night Plagueis meets with Sidious and tells him that he has created a perfect force user....one more powerful than any before and one with unwavering loyalties to those he cares about, as not to have him become too powerful and overthrow his Master. Sidious acts full of glee and talks to his Master about when THEY are going to get him and where he is and when Plagueis is going to teach him such techniques. Plagueis laughs at him and informs him that this whole charade is an insurance policy that he has so Sidious won't betray him. He tells Sidious that he will give him the secret after he trains his creation and lives a completely full life. When he is ready to die, the secret will be passed on to Sidious. Sidious pleads to learn more information and Plagueis laughs him off and wishes him a good night. Plagueis heads to be and Sidious connects the dots. 2 Sith, no more, no less. There is Plagueis, Sidious, Maul (Unknown to Plagueis) and Vader (Whereabouts Unknown to Sidious) already. Sidious figures his master has to have information on the new powers and the new apprentice stored in Holocrons. Knowing that allowing his Master to get his creation and start training him spells a death sentence for himself, Sidious decides that his Master must die. He already had an apprentice of his own and was secretly gaining strength in the politcal arena. He kills Plagueis in his sleep and brings Darth Maul with him to pilfer through his dead master's belongings looking for information on the powers and the boy. Nothing. Plagueis left no paper trail behind. Sidious is quite angry.

    Sidious takes up the mantle of The Lord, Maul being his apprentice. He thinks about the ability to create life and perhaps cheat death and the lost secret and knows the only key could be the being that Plagueis created. Looking to the the future he Forsees "That he will come to me." Sidious keeps Maul as his apprentice for the time...untill the Chosen one arrives. He is quite delighted at the end of TPM. Although the Naboo blockade ended and he lost his apprentice, the key appeared. Anakin Skywalker was found. Now he just had to go along with his current plans and wait untill the time was right to seduce the being that was supposed to be his replacement in the Sith Line.

    Again. No basis in fact. None at all. Just something I think of. ;)

    Carnage
  16. r8hitman Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2004
    star 4
    Maybe Plageius did create life, just not Anakin?

    So what....that's nothing special??

    I've "created life" too.

    Quite a few times.:p
  17. jedi_jacks Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 17, 2005
    star 4
    darth-sinister
    As to Dark Lord, that's not entirely true. Because the New Essential Chronology states that it's not clear if Plagueis did create Anakin or if Palpatine did it. All that's clear is that Sidious learned what Plagueis was doing and killed him in his sleep. Then Anakin was born and when Palpatine discovered his origins, he made an effort to get ahold of him.


    Wouldn't it be cool if Plagueis *did* create an uber-sith, but it wasn't Anakin. Maybe he got lost in the shuffle and is on his own. That would be cool for a story.

    Personally, i hate to think Anakin was created by a sith, although the door is left wide open, i know. If i thought anakin was created to be a sith, that would completely change my sympathy for him.
  18. Squishy_Vic Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 18, 2004
    star 4
    Me neither, but in the New essential guide to star wars chronology, it states that Plagueis did create Anakin.... which is kinda stupid, but it's been made canon now. Damn. :(
  19. Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2003
    star 6
    It doesn't state it as truth. It states that it was a rumor, an in-universe story.
  20. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    If you mean that you can't sympathize with him, why? It's not his fault that he was created by a monster. Is it any different if you are the offspring of say, Ted Bundy or Adolf Hitler? Look at Luke. He's the son of a man turned into a monster, but Luke isn't a monster.
  21. Dags Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 3, 2000
    star 3
    Who said that the Essential Guide to SW Chronology is canon? If it ain't on a cinema screen, it ain't canon.

    Besides, logically it would make sense that Palpatine created Anakin for a three reasons:
    1) Palpatine refers to Anakin as "son", that can't be a coincidence
    2) SW is all about family. Luke/Leia are related to Vader, therefore to keep the circle going, it makes sense that Vader/Anakin would be related to Palpatine.
    3) In the making of ROTS coffee table book, there is clear evidence that in an earlier version of the screenplay, Palpatine admits to creating Anakin and being his father.

    In the grand scheme of things, the Anakin/Palpatine relationship just makes sense. The whole premise of the Sith is to rule the galaxy as a family - father and son - and therein lies the answer.

  22. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    It contains canon facts. All are official.

    The late Ronald Regean would call US troops, "son" a lot. A lot of men in their 50's and 60's call younger guys "son", even if they're not related to them at all.

    It could, but then it doesn't have to be. It could've been Plaugeis. In which case his dad is already dead. Or maybe the Force did create him?

    Which Lucas cut from the film to make it rather vague.

    The premise is that two Sith work together. Master and Apprentice. Blood relations aren't important.
  23. jedi_jacks Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 17, 2005
    star 4
    darth-sinister

    jedi_jacks posted:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Wouldn't it be cool if Plagueis *did* create an uber-sith, but it wasn't Anakin. Maybe he got lost in the shuffle and is on his own. That would be cool for a story.

    Personally, i hate to think Anakin was created by a sith, although the door is left wide open, i know. If i thought anakin was created to be a sith, that would completely change my sympathy for him.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    If you mean that you can't sympathize with him, why? It's not his fault that he was created by a monster. Is it any different if you are the offspring of say, Ted Bundy or Adolf Hitler? Look at Luke. He's the son of a man turned into a monster, but Luke isn't a monster.




    it's just a gut reaction (just like leia's in RotJ when she finds out who luke's father is - she looks at luke with disgust). i lose my sympathy for anakin if he was created to be an uber-sith. his talent seems tainted, he seems really spoiled to me then. if you have un-natural talent, you should at least be humble about it, have a little shame about it (even if you don't know you're un-natural). it's completely disturbing to think about anakin that way.
  24. Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2003
    star 6
    Or how about thinking it like this: the Force was using the Sith!

    [face_thinking]
  25. Winston_Sith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 8, 2004
    star 4
    Yeah, exactly.

    And if some Sith (I don't know who created him, but I would think it was Palps) didn't create Anakin, then why all the *blatant *Frankensteinian themes (such as "the creature turning on the creator") present in Anakin's story?
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.