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    TCW vs. Rebels debates are not allowed in the Television forum. As in, discussions that descend into TCW/Rebels bashing/gushing will be subject to Mod action. Contrasting the themes, story lines, characters, etc. between the shows is allowed (welcomed, even). "Versus" debates/arguments, however, are a deal-breaker.
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Clone Wars Classics Micro-series vs. TCW

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Togruta, Nov 14, 2012.

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Which Clone Wars show do you like better?

  1. Clone Wars (2003)

    97 vote(s)
    35.8%
  2. The Clone Wars (2008)

    174 vote(s)
    64.2%
  1. The-Eternal-Hero

    The-Eternal-Hero Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    With this heartily disagree. The Micro-Series looked just like many things we had seen before which was it's charm. UPA, Hanna/Barbera etc. They even dropped in a homage to Scooby Doo! It was clearly inspired by Alex Toth and other 60's TV animation designers. TCW on the other hand had a rich, detailed, unique visual style that only got wilder & stranger as the series progressed. Some of the Micro-Series even looked like elaborate flash animation. No contest.


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  2. Blur

    Blur Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 1999
    OK, I stand corrected. The only 2008-2013 CW I've seen is in it's entirety is the 2008 theatrical film, which I felt was terrible. I haven't seen much of the show, and have never seen the images in the last post - these were truly amazing.

    I guess I will have to check out the 2008 CW actual TV show at some point..
     
  3. Todd the Jedi

    Todd the Jedi Mod and Soliloquist of SWTV star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 16, 2008
    No yeah, my opinion of TCW's animation definitely got better as the series progressed. Season 1's animation was definitely lacking, same with S2 a bit. But season 3 is where the quality really started to go up, and by S5 it had really come into its own as a great animation style.
     
  4. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    In other words, the animators just got better and better while the writers started to run out of ideas. :p
     
  5. Blur

    Blur Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 1999
    To add to my last post, I didn't want to give the impression that I didn't like the Micro-series animation - I do. And, as a whole, I do still think the Micro-series had better animation than the CW; it's just that the CW improved as the series progressed. At least in the case of the Micro-series, the animation was consistent throughout.
     
  6. Togruta

    Togruta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    Dude, not a good comparison. You use only one (probably fan-made) image from CW that's has other stuff pasted in, compared to four from TCW?

    TCW's 3D style wasn't really special to me. It was pretty much typical "video game" stuff. The only things that seemed to really have something stylized or uniqie to their design were.. well, mostly characters that looked heavily like the ones from CW.
     
  7. The-Eternal-Hero

    The-Eternal-Hero Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    Dude, I couldn't find any screen-caps for the MS online.
     
  8. Circular Logic

    Circular Logic SWTV Interview Host star 4 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Mar 3, 2013
    Really? A cursory Google Image search turned up plenty of screencaps; I selected a few that I found particularly memorable:

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    I will grant that the one significant advantage the microseries had over TCW was its concision, and the way it managed to depict so many different events in a short time-frame but still gave you a really good idea about what the Clone Wars were about. It also led seamlessly into RotS with its depiction of the Invasion of Coruscant (though I still like LoE's version better).
     
    eht13 and Mia Mesharad like this.
  9. Togruta

    Togruta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    ^Beat me to it. But here's a few that might capture the variety of CW more..

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    JackG and Mia Mesharad like this.
  10. The-Eternal-Hero

    The-Eternal-Hero Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    Ba-Dang!!! Don't I have egg on my face. But yeah -- flat & simple UPA style animation. It was neat for a filler between movies but doesn't hold a candle to TCW series.
     
    KenobiSkywalker likes this.
  11. JackG

    JackG Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2011
    I prefer the micro-series' animation, because it could really give an idea of the scope of the conflict; Muunilist was massive and seeing Saesee Tiin and like a hundred clones jump through space onto a Confederate cruiser was awesome. I also think that TCW's characters sometimes looked really dodgy (Mace Windu) and I liked the stylized version of the micro-series much better, mainly because it was definitely for aesthetics, and not due to constraints like in TCW.
    Here's some of my favourites.
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    (Even the derivative comics looked awesome)
     
    Mia Mesharad likes this.
  12. Togruta

    Togruta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    So much for flat and simple UPA style.
     
  13. Blur

    Blur Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 1999
    Thanks for the reminder of how cool the animation was on the Micro-series. Those screen-caps remind me of why I liked that show so much.

    Now I want to see it again. Time to dig out those old DVD's....
     
  14. Togruta

    Togruta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    Man, we never did get around to that micro-series viewing thing.
     
  15. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007

    Agreed. I really liked the look of TCW, but those images make me want to watch the CW microseries again.
     
  16. JackG

    JackG Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2011
    I love the micro-series!
    (Sorry, not sorry for all these cool pics)
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    I'm glad TCW didn't have a chance to mess up the Battle of Coruscant.
     
  17. The-Eternal-Hero

    The-Eternal-Hero Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    Nope, it's very flat looking, which was intentional. Genndy (who does 3D animation now btw) was intentionally drawing from vintage "limited" animation of the 60's in his early series, including the micro-series.

    I'm not dumping on it, I like the micro-series, I appreciate what it was doing. But it's nowhere near as ambitious, complex or rich as the TCW.I don't think the 120 minutes of the micro-series even comes close to the depth of the best Filoni/Lucas episodes, like Ambush, Landing At Point Rain, Citadel Rescue, Carnage of Krell or The Wrong Jedi.
     
  18. FRAGWAGON

    FRAGWAGON Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    I loved the Micro-series....it's comparing apples and oranges, though. I love 'em both. Genndy captured that cool Nelvana look of the Boba Fett and Droids cartoons.
     
  19. JackG

    JackG Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2011
    I'll take this over TCW's "depth", anyday.
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    Togruta and Mia Mesharad like this.
  20. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    I like the microseries' animation, but one thing I can't deny is that TCW's animation was groundbreaking (at least for a TV show). This is more true of the latter seasons.

    As for the above GIF, that is precisely why I was advocating a 2D show for Rebels when it was first announced. For a fraction of the cost of making a show in 3D, they could have made something that still looks beautiful, but doesn't have the limitations of making a really expensive 3D show that is constantly trying to push the limit.

    Yeah, I think TCW should be applauded for its animation, but there were also so many short cuts that had to be taken, such as copying and pasting the same background characters over and over; avoiding the use of full length robes for the longest time, until the TCW crew could figure out how to animate them; or how we never got to see characters like Oppo Rancicis, because it takes 5 seasons to get a model for him approved (only for him never to show up due to cancellation).

    I think the microseries played it relatively safe and still was a great looking show. TCW reached for the stars as far as animation goes, but they had to make compromises to get there that gets in the way of the scope of stories and what can be visually represented.
     
    AshiusX, Lord_Stalker and Sable_Hart like this.
  21. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2011
    If anything a Rebels show is much more suited to expensive 3D than TCW was.

    TCW was supposed to portray the Clone War, a war featuring the industrial juggernaut CIS, which depends on an endless number of battle droids and droid starfighters attacking en masse against the Galactic Republic's Jedi led mook army in huge set piece battles. It's a big war with big numbers and those numbers are expensive to animate. Early in TCW we got battles with Venators carrying one or two squadrons against a few squadrons of Vultures. Space looked empty. Battles with perhaps 100 B1 battle droids, not enough to form an impressive formation, against a single squad of clone troopers.

    I haven't bothered learning what Rebels is about. I'm assuming it's somewhere in the Dark Times and it's Rebels vs Empire. The Rebellion is supposed to be a relatively disorganized, under-equipped (despite the quote from ANH), underfunded ragtag group engaging in small hit and run raids against Imperial shipping, allowing their people to gain experience and confidence while waiting for a chance to strike a truly meaningful, war winning blow. The Rebels were trying to avoid major Imperial forces, no point in fighting an Imperial task force if they have hundreds (perhaps thousands) more, while one major loss for the Rebellion can cripple or even destroy it. The Rebels are looking for the Battle of Endor: big risk, big reward. Until they get it, they'll settle for commerce raiding just to be a pain in the Empire's ass. The Rebellion is guerrilla warfare in space, which means small, mobile units which are less expensive to animate.

    I imagine Rebels being smaller in most respects, including the cast of characters, the size of the locations, the number of locations, the population of locations, etc.

    Of course, I imagined a lot of things about TCW.
     
    KenobiSkywalker likes this.
  22. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    I don't think anyone at Disney has really said what Rebels is supposed to be about other than it's supposed to feature a "band of teens," whatever the hell the implications of that might be, and it takes place in the Dark Times. I would also assume a smaller cast of characters though, especially given that TCW started by trying to feature a lot of characters that didn't get movie screen time (and then very quickly started featuring the same characters all the time, not because no other characters got animated but because Filoni had favorites, but anyway...).

    The show could easily have these kids trying to start their own rebellion on one planet and then spread out to 2-3 others later. It'll be Felucia, borrowed from TCW animations; I called it. :p But yeah, fewer locations is a safe bet.

    Looking at all these .gifs makes me want to watch the micro series. And damn you, TCW, five seasons of half-naked Ahsoka and you couldn't animate shirtless Anakin even once.
     
  23. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2011
    Or a shirtless Ventress. What the hell, TCW?

    Disney will probably be smart and feature more shirtless characters.
     
  24. Heero_Yuy

    Heero_Yuy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    One thing to consider as far as animation goes is that the main issue with 3D animation (and CGI in general) is it never holds up well. TCWs animation looks impressive now, but it'll look worse and worse as the years go by. The first season or so already looks pretty poor these days. However, high quality 2D animation will look excellent now or 10 years from now.
     
  25. GrimStride

    GrimStride Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2013
    Even though i enjoy both , i'd have to say i prefer the micro-series.

    Mainly because 3d animation just doesn't do it for me . I find the characters blocky and lacking in charm (visually). . But thats just my opinion