Mod's from other time zones in busy forums

I can honestly say that I've always been happy with British mods

And British ex-members of the AC too

Efficient bunch they are, and some of them write excellent updates, very funny ones too

 

Well, I can say I have been happy with the American, Canadian (Gandolf), Slovakian (Mar17swgirl), German (Morgaine) and Australian (Kadue) mods in addition to the ones from the UK (Oakessteve, current TPM moderator). As you can see, there is quite a diverse group here, including at least one from the UK. This is my point.

Oh, and to put your fears to rest, there is a 3SA mod on now we said would happen. As you can see, there wasn't a real need to worry. The times that there are real emergencies are realitively few and those have been delt with in just a fine manner, even with LESS mods than there are now. I don't advocate having less mods, but my point is that the mods that we do have seem to do fine. If there is a problem, I am sure that they will act on it when necessary.

So why have even more mods? So we can crack down on those poor souls who make redundent threads? That doesn't seem like a nice thing to do.

 

So we can crack down on those poor souls who make redundent threads?

Nope, so we can redirect those poor souls before the vultures get to them. The film forums can be vicious, especially to newbies.

For your info, there are no UK mods on the JC - my above post was a lighthearted bit of British humour. It was not a slight on the other mods. I have never fallen out with any JC mod and certainly have no intention of doing so.

It would benefit the MS in general if there were more mods - it would allow them to have some fun and not get bogged down by work to the point where they have to PM themselves reminders. It would also allow the ones who wish to stay spoiler free, to be certain of staying spoiler free. It would also allow the mods more time to actually post here in Coms instead of it actually being "another duty of office".

This suggestion of Sebulba's is not just about members and their irritation with redundant threads. It is meant to be a positive suggestion only, not a negative thing to be bashed at.

EDIT: typo

 

We need more Canadian mods, what with their twenty hours of continual darkness and whatnot.

 

Nope, so we can redirect those poor souls before the vultures get to them.

I looked at your posts and saw your last post in the 3SA was in October, a good 5 months ago. Sebulba_Sloan's last post in the 3SA was on Friday. If you want to help redirect the newbies, then why not help out? There are plenty of reference threads in there and I am sure the mods and newbies would welcome your help.

For your info, there are no UK mods on the JC - my above post was a lighthearted bit of British humour.

FYI, Oakessteve is a moderator again for the TPM forum. So there is at least one UK.

It is meant to be a positive suggestion only, not a negative thing to be bashed at.

I am not "bashing" his idea. I am merely expressing my opinion on his idea and presenting the proof. That isn't "bashing" an idea. You need to make the case for more mods other than "there are no mods on right now".

Charis, what proof do you have that mods are "overworked"?

If they were "overworked," as you say they are, then wouldn't they have no time to post in the regular threads?

So, if that is the case, why have dehrian and darth-sinister been participating at least at the level they were when they were normal users. What about DarthSapient, who has been participating in the discussions on an almost daily basis during the week, in addition to locking the threads that are redundent. It seems to me that the four mods in the 3SA are not overworked. There seems to be plenty of coverage, even on weekends. So what if there are redundent threads? Do they have to be locked immediately on sight? As people have pointed out, if it is an emergency any mod is willing to help out. But if it is a simple redundent thread and there happens to be no "spoiled" mod on, don't worry about it. It'll be taken care of eventually.

It would also allow the mods more time to actually post here in Coms instead of it actually being "another duty of office".

Yes, the mods as a whole don't post much in Comms, but niether does 99% of the rest of the JC. However, according to Kadue's thread that he posted today, Improving Communications, it seems like they are going to try and improve on that:

---

[blockquote][li]First and foremost, all moderators are going to do their best to engage in discussions in here that are related to forums they help moderate. This means that for anything that reaches around 50 posts about an issue, you should definitely see posts from all moderators working in a specific forum. To this end, we do have a thread dedicated in MS for this, highlighting threads that moderators should be participating in. [/li][/blockquote][hr]

Don't expect a change overnight. It is going to take a while for that to happen. Also, according to that statement above, if a thread in Comms doesn't concern a particular mod's forum, they don't necessarily have to post in that particular thread. So, there is a very likely possibility that you won't see dehrian or darth-sinister posting here in Comms if there isn't a thread about the 3SA in here.

 

I don't post on the Ep3(SA) board for various reasons which I do not wish to go into on here. However, that doesn't mean I don't lurk and read the board, especially since I spend a lot of time logged in.

Yeah, changes don't happen overnight - one can see that from the direction this thread is going in.

Like you say, there are 4 Ep3(SA) mods and only DarthSapient, who is a JC Coms regular obviously, has offered any comment. And yes, a list of mods who have no problem with Spoilers would be very handy.

I assume that you've been around JC Coms on a regular basis - you telling me that mods never post about having so much to do, having lots of hassle, etc. etc.? If I'm wrong about some of the mods being overworked, then I'm sure they can post and let us know otherwise.

 

I?ve only been on the job a week and a half, but I would hope I?ve got an idea of what being a mod is like. I mod the fanfiction forum, and it recently undertook a major change by splitting into three more forums, but I wouldn?t say I?ve been overworked. The work has been at a comfortable level, and I feel I can rely on my other fellow fanfic admins, also.

I can?t believe it when you say ?there are no mods on right now?. I?m usually on around the late hours of board time, always having JC working in the background. And I?m also one who doesn?t care about getting spoiled if it?s a big enough emergency. There is bound to be one mod on JC at all times. Promoting more moderators isn?t going to do anything, either, as you?ll have more mods, but still some users will say none of the admins are on. You need do some searching, but I guarantee you'll come up with someone.

Charis, I wouldn?t say mods constantly post about how they have to do so much work. If they were continuously bothered by that fact, they would probably resign so they could find time for activities outside of JC.

Yes, I did read the ?Improving Communications? thread, and I admit to being one of the new mods who doesn?t venture much into Communication territory. I will be trying to correct that in the coming weeks.

There is the feeling that mods don?t want to ?tread on anyone else?s toes? if the matter is small and can easily be remedied by the forum mod when he/she wakes up. But if something urgent is reported to me, I will take action. In any case, I?m here if needed.

Am

 

They have been resigning Am

OK, I've had a good think on the way into work and I've worked out what is making me post in this thread and why I feel strongly about the issue of mod coverage.

First of, for me the point of Coms I feel is for the MS to listen and acknowledge the concerns and to debate. Whether it leads to action or not is not necessarily important as long as what is being said is given consideration.

At the moment, some of us are saying that we feel that mod coverage at certain times is not adequate. There are times when there are no mods online, or very few mods in relation to the number of potential posters.

For a board claiming family friendly status where kids should be able to go through every thread and happily read the contents without the need to look over their shoulder, it is not adequate for mods not to be able to read every post.

The fact that this board relies so heavily on members to PM mods with thread problems seems contrary to the family friendly image that Joshua wants to have here.

I'm all for a family friendly board, but it needs to actually really be family friendly, not just claim to be. More mods will mean every post is read cos after all, it's the mods job to moderate, not the members. This is becoming particular relevant considering the average age of the newbies and the fact that the JC average age appears to be dropping. The very people that the mods are supposed to "protect" are being relied upon to notify you of inappropriate posts.

Am I making sense here?

And yes, the territory mentality doesn't necessarily help matters, particular between the FF and JC.

 

Charis makes a good point. If you consistently have to rely on regular members reporting infractions to non-forum mods, then you have a very weak link in a chain.

Non-forum mods wouldnt be going through threads to make sure everything is ok. Serious things can easily slip by, and members wont always alert other mods.

Hell, remember when SW Misc had a troll for, like a whole week before someone alerted the mods? People arent always quick to PM mods.

Fact is, gaps in the online times of relevant mods means that you are relying on the regular members to be more responsbile for the forum than they actually need to be.

When you have a very busy forum, you greatly increase the chance of running into trouble when there isnt adequate relevant and specific moderation.

 

Well said Darth_Dagsy. If there aren't enough Mods to be online during certains hours of the day, then what's the problem with making more?

Wstraka5, you need to look at your previous posts concerning redirecting of redundant threads.

Charis, I agree this is a family board and this requires some thought. There are some situations that need instant solving, but we can't expect a spoiler-free mod to deal with this.

To reiterate my original point, Surely all the above suggest the need for creation of Mods who can be active whilst the others aren't.

 

I find it a little hard to believe that having no mods online is a regular occurrence. I'm online pretty much every night for a few hours before now and a few hours after now, as are a number of Aussie mods. Could you provide a period of time that you've noticed no mods are on regularly?

 

HawkNC - Mainly very early morning UK time (Morgaine is usually the first to come on at about 7ish) but it does occur at various times on and off throughout the day. It may not be busy at these times and it often isn't - perhaps 2 or 3 pages of online users, but if the idea is for a family friendly board, these times require coverage.

 

They have been resigning Am

Does that imply you think they have been resigning more so than normal?

There is not a reliance on members reporting incidents to mods. Whenever I?m on, I scan the busy boards and look at the recently updated threads, just to see if anybody has stepped over the line. I?m sure several other mods undergo that same process. Dagsy, your post gives me the impression that you believe mods aren?t doing their job correctly, and often letting things easily ?slip?. No matter how many mods you appoint, you?ll find one or two things are never recognised by the admin ? we?re human, we make mistakes ? and if that happens, normal users usually take it upon themselves to report to a mod online at the time. There is no distinct reliance on regular users notifying mods.

As stated earlier on in this thread, mods cannot be plucked out of thin air, or chosen because of his/her online times. A bad mod will not help matters, no matter what time he/she is on.

You keep saying the moderation is not adequate enough, how did you decide that? If something small happens in a forum late at night and no mods pick it up, one of the original mods for that forum will notice it when they come online. However, if the situation is bigger and calls for immediate moderation, a mod scanning that forum is quite likely to notice it and correct the problem. Just because you can?t see mods patrolling doesn?t mean they aren?t. Some users feel trapped, as if the mods are constantly keeping an eye on them, and suddenly we?ve become this big force not to be reckoned with. You can?t see the air, but you know it?s there.

Am

 

Hmm...I usually log off around 1 or 2 AM GMT. However, a few of the US mods often log in around this time, since it's morning for them I think. Either way, the only way to guarantee cover for that timezone is to promote someone who would be awake at that time, and a timezone isn't the sole reason to promote someone. Despite popular opinion, the MS is rather picky about who they promote.

 

Alas AM, I do get the impression that a lot of mods have resigned over the last few months and that retaining mods has been a problem, but that is perhaps a different topic and something for the MS. I am just giving an observation.

Ok, if someone posts a pornographic link or uses inappropriate language in one of the forums where a mod is currently not online, who is there to spot it? The mods that are busy covering their own forums, or the members who end up having to PM a non-forum mod.

YodaJeff earlier in this thread, when he was the only mod online, stated that there were no emergencies in Ep3(SA) because he had not received any PMs - one would presume those would have to come from the members. To me, that adds up to mods relying on members.

You mods do a great job, but you can't be everywhere at all times so there has to be enough of you to cover everywhere at all times.

 

Dagsy, your post gives me the impression that you believe mods aren?t doing their job correctly, and often letting things easily ?slip?.

Not in the slightest. Its about the right availability of forum specific mods.

What I'm saying is that it isnt the job of the RPG mod to keep a close eye on the 3SA forum. It isnt the role of the Fan Fic mods to keep a close eye on the JCC. Looking at as many posts as possible, keeping a close eye on what happens in each thread.

When there are no forum specific mods online, there is an ability for posts go unnoticed until the forum specific mod picks up on it whenever they arrive on the scene. Could be minutes, could be hours.

Its just a break in the chain. Not a slip up. Not doing a poor job. Just not a relevant mod online.

If members see something wrong and tell an online mod, great. I just did that tonight. But it isnt their job to do that. We have had instances where mods havent been alerted to major issues for a week.

The less chances for the system to be reliant on enterprising regular members, the better. If there are relevant, forum specific mods keeping a close eye on threads, then there is much less chance of trouble.

 

I think the question here is if it is realistic to expect all the major forums to have 24/7 coverage by dedicated mods. I regularly check 3NS, Games, Comms and JCC as well as all my FF forums, but we can't expect all mods to do the same. To be frank, I don't think it would kill anyone if a flame existed for a couple of hours before a mod found it. Extreme situations like massive amounts of spam or pornographic material are rare enough that it's hopefully not so much of an issue.

 

Ok, if someone posts a pornographic link or uses inappropriate language in one of the forums where a mod is currently not online, who is there to spot it? The mods that are busy covering their own forums, or the members who end up having to PM a non-forum mod.

I wouldn?t say a mod?s own forum keeps them busy 24/7. Just a few moments ago I did a scan of the YJCC and warned someone for their behaviour. It wasn?t absolutely serious and didn?t need immediate attention. There is bound to be a gap in the field for an hour or so once in a blue moon. That example you mentioned is likely a very rare occurrence.

Hmm, Dagsy, a mod is a mod. We help keep this site family-friendly, and just because we have a little title underneath our username stating which forum we mainly moderate doesn?t mean that is our only responsibility. As a moderator, we represent the administration in every forum, and it is our job to edit inappropriate material wherever it is. Why do you need more forum specific moderators when you have other mods circulating around the boards, doing their job like they should be? Are forum specific mods a better quality than mods from other forums?

I don?t keep just solely to my own forum ? I have other interests. I often visit the Amphitheatre and Music forums, and often I can?t think of anything intelligent to say . I don?t want to post something which equates to spam, but I do keep a close eye on other forums.

Am

 

I'll reply to a lot of the rest of the points brought up hopefully tomorrow, but I just want to say this.

With a lot of the new choices in moderators we are making for secondary or further moderators, we are taking into account the times that we are lacking coverage in, and are attempting to cover those when we can.

 

HawkNC - you think we are self-promoting? Well, if that was the case, we wouldn't be here arguing the point, we'd be agreeing with you

Surely it would not be unreasonable for the MS to research the issue of mod coverage and then you can confirm for yourselves where the gaps are? Is it too much to ask that the MS organises itself so that there is reasonable coverage of all forums at all time? That doesn't necessarily mean dedicated mods, but just that enough mods are online to keep a tabs on all the forums.

EDIT: Just seen Kadue's post above. Thanks

 

Surely it would not be unreasonable for the MS to research the issue of mod coverage and then you can confirm for yourselves where the gaps are? Is it too much to ask that the MS organises itself so that there is reasonable coverage of all forums at all time? That doesn't necessarily mean dedicated mods, but just that enough mods are online to keep a tabs on all the forums.

As Kadue basically said, we?ll look into the matter further. If there are gaps, and they need to be filled with more moderators, we?ll be sure to locate them. Thanks.

Am

 

Like you say, there are 4 Ep3(SA) mods and only DarthSapient, who is a JC Coms regular obviously, has offered any comment.

Charis, that is because this doesn't concern the 3SA. Also, as I have stated over and over, the 3SA is well covered. Why have more mods cover an already well-covered forum?

And yes, a list of mods who have no problem with Spoilers would be very handy.

As we know, DS was going to be working on this, so give hime a chance.

I assume that you've been around JC Coms on a regular basis - you telling me that mods never post about having so much to do, having lots of hassle, etc. etc.? If I'm wrong about some of the mods being overworked, then I'm sure they can post and let us know otherwise.

Again, I ask, why should they post in a thread that doesn't concern them? Does this thread DIRECTLY concern the 3SA? No, it concerns all forums. That is why the Admins, who are in charge of all of the forums need to comment.

They have been resigning Am

What proof do you have of that? There have been some mods who's REAL LIFE obligations have made it so that they can't effectively mod. I'll give the example of G-S. He is "on-vacation" because he is currently deployed to Kuwait. He can't effectively moderate the 3SA and upload icons while firing an M-16 and leading his soldiers, can he? So, he resigned temporarily.

Wstraka5, you need to look at your previous posts concerning redirecting of redundant threads.

Sebulba_Sloan, I hope that wasn't implying that I don't help out. I did for quite a while, but I haven't done it as much recently. If you want proof, I am sure that I can get you some.

Ok, if someone posts a pornographic link or uses inappropriate language in one of the forums where a mod is currently not online, who is there to spot it?

The users, who are at least kind enough to help the mods out.

To me, that adds up to mods relying on members.

Is it really such a bad thing for the mods to ask for the help of the users? You would need an infinte number of mods to keep track of every thread in every forum 24/7/365, since most people have real lives. Speaking of which, I have to get to mine.

 

I think we've covered these points sufficiently and I'm happy knowing that Kadue and the MS is considering the "time gap" issue.

I do frequent 3(SA) a lot, just that I don't post. Lurkers are entitled to opinions. This thread has moved on a bit to include not just that forum, but others as well. It applies to the whole JC especially the busy forums.

If you want to debate the nitty gritty of my opinions, please feel free to PM me, but at the moment, I have nothing more to say and shall patiently await Kadue's reply as and when he has is able to give one.

 

The 3SA is running as smoothly as I've ever seen it. I include in that observation my tenure as the spoiler mod for AotC. Just because once in a while someone isn't online when you see a problem doesn't mean it should get blown up to these proportions.

You see, the moderators and users are in a symbiotic relationship. If the issue you found in the 3SA is redundancy, big deal if we're not on. Seriously, it can wait. But if it's trolling, flaming, or something along those lines, we're not online, but you saw it and didn't make any attempt whatsoever to get help, you're moreso to blame because you could have done something.

I still feel we're covered quite well. There are like 2-3 spoilers total out there right now. If you see a problem, report it. And I'm on 10 1/2 hours each weekday and here and there on the weekends. But when I go home at night and when I'm at home on the weekends, the boards take a backseat. I have a nearly 3 year old son, a wife, grad school, a house to take care of, family, and another baby due in two weeks. Sorry if I'm not as concerned about the messageboards. But one can hardly complain about the coverage when I'm online.

What I honestly see here is a case where someone saw a problem, we weren't on, and blew it way, way, way out of proportion. I'll do my part and get the 3SA thread out today that lists all the mods who are going spoiled. You do your part and accept some responsibility instead of saying, "Aha! No 3SA coverage. You guys aren't dedicated and should be on all the time." There is nothing that happens in there that any other mod couldn't handle when it comes to things like cursing, flaming, and trolling.

 

The mods on all forums do a great job and any emergencies are always handled by well any mod whether it's their forum or not but maybe to handle redundancy, flaming and other less urgent problems, reliable users (if there is such a thing ) should be given limited authority in a certain forum to lock or edit topics when mods aren't around. sort of like the AC but with immediate action