More on double standards

The JC mods normally locks topics that are off topic for a particular forum. Should we be allowed to post off topic threads and have them remain open? This is the thread I'm referring to and it seems a certain mod is having an issue with it.

 

What is off topic about that thread? Asking the members of the JC what they think about the heirarchy of this place? I think its a valid topic. The only think I could see is maybe it should have been posted here, in Comms. But in JCC more people may see it.

 

The only think I could see is maybe it should have been posted here, in Comms.

Exactly, DDH. You proved my point.

 

I said this in a PM about said thread: I want(ed) opinion from the masses. Communications does not equal the masses. The ModSquad does not equal the masses. The JCC is the only true sounding board for the general populace (or, during movie season, PSA). I know it was a tricky move and perhaps not the one most would agree on, but I think we should know what the people we volunteer our time to help think about our leadership, if it's clear or not.

If they see a unified front, if the general [populace] sees it, then perhaps it's our own petty and selfish desires that are getting in the way.

That's all I can say in my defense.

 

Actually, I was thinking of PMing you, Carter, to ask about this (dont worry, I wasnt about to bust your hump )

I can definitely see why its a Comms thread, and why you would lock it for being in the JCC.

However, at the same time, we have seen many members of the administration take threads directly to their forum to discuss policy. Its their way of avoiding the Comms politics, and getting the response from the common member.

As such, I can completely see Banes point in having the thread in the JCC.

At the same time as I see your point, Bane....I see two issues:

1) If a regular member did this, it would have been redirected.
2) The members that would really care about answering your questions are mostly the ones that come here anyway.

I think, overall, you guys need to make a decision on whether you can have threads on administrative matters in the forum of interest, or only here.

Personally, I think that you should keep them here, for exactly your reasons Carter. Perhaps a header in the forum, directing the members to the relevant Comms thread.


EDIT: You know what, I very much like you bringing this discussion here, rather than duking it out in the ModSquad. I know you guys like your 'unified front', but to see you come here and discuss issues as individuals is a good thing.

 

1) If a regular member did this, it would have been redirected.

This is the key issue. And it's strictly a matter of relevance and holding ourselves liable to things we would do to our regular members.

 

The AC members have threads scattered across the boards to talk about themselves and their role. Do those get locked and redirected to Comms?

It's for public knowledge and imput, which seems to be the same thing Bane's thread was interested in. Plus, so many people have been complaining about too strictly limiting what can or can't be posted in YJCC. It's a chance to encourage some relevent discussion. It's worked really well with the reform thread and it has the potential for good. Leave it alone.

 

Sure, Carter, but you guys definitely need to decide on what is ok to take to the forum, and what isnt.

A number of forums have had policy discussion taken directly there, so there is precedent for Bane having this thread in the JCC.

Its going to be confusing unless the administration decides whether they want to keep the mod-member discussions here or not.


EDIT: My definitive decision on this issue (unless someone can provide me with compelling evidence to make me change my mind).....Leave it.....open.

As much as I agree with your points, Carter, the potential for this thread to be a big positive far outweighs the possible negative consequences of leaving it open.

 

I think it's a perfectly fine topic, one that mods and users should have a general discussion about here in comm.

 

Well, what I'm wondering is why Carter shut it down. If it was so blatantly in the wrong forum, you don't think a JCC mod would have caught it? Just seems a bit shady to me.

EDIT: The original post was a bit cryptic. Part of me has to wonder whether or not it was shut down in a bit of a PR move. Something that says "hey, we lock mod threads too!"

 

I think the thread in JCC should remain open. It's the single largest gathering of JC regulars anywhere on the boards, a lot more people are going to see it there. While it is probably best suited to Communications, not everyone will see it here. You'll most likely only get the opinions of the people who frequent Comms. If you want the opinions of the majority of the population, you have to present the option to them where they will see it, and the best place for that is the JCC.

 

I think the admins need to see what's said in that topic (it is a good topic) and most of the roving mods check comm. more frequently than in YJCC. It's strictly a matter of relevance.

 

Who do we want to see these threads, the mods or the general users? You're going to get more feedback in the JCC, it's as simple as that IMHO. Heck, it's even partially relevant there.

 

Carter, I think that Bane has a point. He was just trying to educate the members that post at the YJCC about the hierarchy. Most of the members don't even venture to Comms. Heck, most of them don't even know that there is a Comms forum. I think that it was a good way to inform some of the members that don't know how everything works here.

In regards to the double standards. Well, its going to exist for a mod regardless. I don't think that a mod could really do their job without that double standard in place.

 

If we get more feedback there, then what is the point of comm?

 

That's a good question. Comms is ineffective if nobody knows it's here. That could be a good thing to bring up in Bane's topic, you know.

 

Well, Comms is a place where people can keep up to date on the day by days of this place. But Bane's post was to start a dialogue of the general workings of the boards, which I think more people need to understand. Reaching out to the YJCC was a good idea, IMO.

I don't think that any mod, admin, etc.. should abuse this working double standard. But I don't think that Bane was abusing it at all. The "abuse" of this double standard should be the real issue.

 

Comms seems to be where the regs come to bring things to the attention of the mods. It doesn't necessarily work both ways. Plenty of people consider it a board where regs bring up their issues with something on the JC and not so much a place where the mods come to talk to the general poulation.

 

It took me a year on the JC before I discovered Comms. I'm sure there are many people on the boards who don't know Comms exists or who just don't visit regularly.

While I can see how it would be better suited for Comms, I don't see a problem with Lord Bane's thread being in the YJCC. Yes, it would get locked and redirected if a regular user posted this, but I don't have a problem with this.

As a mod, Lord Bane is seeking administrative information that he can directly bring to the Mod Squad and apply. A regular user couldn't do that. People also view mods and regular users differently no matter how much we try eradicate it. Users who respond to a mod will more likely be more thoughtful because they know there's an administrative purpose for it. Depending on which regular user posts the thread, it might just turn into a love fest. (or it might not, depends on the user and how the thread is handled. And with a mod, it can still turn into a love fest).

 

I like all the responses in this thread. There's great communication happening.

 

The topic may technically be more suited to Coms, but there are a lot of people who avoid this forum because of the drama.

It appears that Lord Bane is trying to get the view of the average JCer and that will not be accomplished by having that thread in Coms so, IMHO, it should be reopened and allowed to run it's course. It will enable the less confident poster have a say.

 

That's only because we'll get banned otherwise.


I think Comms' profile needs to be re-evaluated as well. It's become a place where a minority of users bring up issues that the majority of users never even know about. If it were possible to make Communications better known throughout the JC, just as the AC is making themselves known, better two-way communication would be able to happen here, instead of debating whether or not it should stay in the JCC.

 

Comms has always been the place to talk about administrative issues, general mod/user relations, policy wide forum announcements, etc.

I think a lot of people know about comm, they'd just as soon avoid it altogether knowing its potential for drama.

I have listened to your thoughtful and intelligent responses and reopened the thread.

 

Bane's thread, whilst a good idea, probably needed to be cleared by "The Mod Squad" first, IMHO. As a one off, unusual "Census" type topic, it would be/will be great, as long as it is made clear that this is a special exception to try and get a fresh feel of what a lot of members think. In that way it would work. As it was though, it would have been a little cheeky to leave it open and then lock other "JCPolitick" threads. The AC put everything they did about there threads past the Mods to make sure that what was done was acceptable.

This topic actually fits well into the "Communal responsibility" thread in the AC. If this had gone past everyone first, then it would be fine, but as a spur of the moment thing, it may be more difficult to justify. (especially with Carters and Banes differing views on it.)

But, be careful. A lot of member's don't come to Comms because they are not interested or mature enough for the discussions. If you start asking a lot of people who are mainly ambivalent to the subject you could get a lot of spurious ideas and answers back, (e.g. democratically elected Mods), and once you ask for everyone's opinion, it's difficult to then put the "Genie back in the bottle" and ignore their requests.

UKS

 

I don't think JCC regulars are interested in the politics of the JC hierarchy, but we'll see. I still think we'd get better responses here.