Lit Moving forwards, what should be done with the Legends Material?

It's a broad universe - there's plenty of room for other genre's in it than "space fantasy".

 

If your talking about the Hero's Journey scenario I think that is what every single trilogy we get in Star Wars is going to be about. Each trilogy will likely introduce new characters to us. Those new characters will face an intense challenge and they will either succeed or fail at that challenge.

If that type of thing doesn't interest you then you will likely be a bigger fan of the spinoffs.

 

Well, no. It's whether another mythology can sit with space fantasy properly. Military? Sure, but it should feel less like the US Navy (boo) and more like the Royal Navy (yay!) during the age of sail.

Kenobi gets cited; I haven't read it but I found the modern world stuff in New Dawn problematic (A management consultant? Jesus, why not throw in other 90s/early 00s stuff like "Coruscant Online" or "MyForce"?). Regardless it's a Western, no?

And what is the Western if not America's mythology?

 

We already had image consultants in the Black Fleet Crisis trilogy.

"mythology" is relevant - but that doesn't mean modern world stuff doesn't have its place as well.

 

I just want an ending to the EU. That's the conclusion I've come to. As sad as I am that the EU is over, I think I would be fine with it being done if we had at least been given a satisfying ending. Give us one more book to close off the story. Then I can accept the EU being replaced. Right now it's just like there's a giant cliffhanger that will never be resolved. I want one final story that gives the EU a sense of closure.

 

Really, when I read Star Wars I read it for it's vast universe. Yes, the origin story had to do with space fantasy/myth and Joseph Campbell's Hero's Journey, but it doesn't necessarily mean that all stories within such a vast universe have to go that way. You can have politics, you can have Force Users, you can have mercenaries, crime lords, corporate leaders, military commanders and the soldiers under them. You can have literally any story told in it, because it's such a vast universe. Giving us -two- timelines Legends and Canon could only make this better. Disney want to make money? Then restore Legends and have proper authors carry it out of the mess that was LOTF/FOTJ. Here, I can agree with Ender Sai; I wouldn't even mind some war on terror references if they weren't so hamfisted and directly obvious as Traviss made them out to be, and I don't even dislike Traviss all that much.

 

You would be only slightly more likely to get that than you would to get one more day with a dead loved one.

I disagree. Our world is not black and white. There are no heroes and villains, just shades of ********s. The binary nature of Star Wars, its struggle of good (Rebels, the Force) against evil (Imperials, Dark Side) is wholly at odds with our world that it's perfect escapist. I know there's a bunch of GenY want-it-all types who want there to be good Sith and good Imps, but we should ignore them as they are silly. But yeah, it needs to be juxtaposed to our world to be enticing, and that's why it worked.

 

Good Sith and good Imps are things which should exist, IMHO.

It's just that we should never pretend they're not the exception.

I also think our world is black and white....it's just a spectrum with a 99.9 palette of grays.

 

Yeah Troy Denning should write it

 

Didn't a lot of people say that DS9's "shades of grey" was a vast improvement on the black-and-white of TOS and early-TNG?

Star Trek is just as escapist as Star Wars - but that didn't stop shades of grey from entering it.

 

Shades of gray existed in Star Wars.

Han Solo was one, for example, as was Lando.

The fact is Star Wars just said you can't keep that when you face true evil. Either you let it happen or become evil yourself and fight it and become good.

For better or worse, the Prequels are NOTHING BUT shades of gray and one pure darkside black hole.

 

I was thinking more of the Jedi Order - the PT and TCW especially, did to the Jedi Order what DS9 did to the Federation. Still good guys - but with their flaws "highlighted".

 

I'm torn because a flawed Jedi Order is more believable but I can't help but think it's nice to have people you can look up and say are genuinely wise as well as good.

I miss having those as an adult.

 

Wise is a spectrum - it's always possible to get wiser.

Regarding the Legendsverse - it's like the upcoming Alienverse reboot.

There will be people who hate the idea of Alien Resurrection being decanonized, people who love Alien 3, hate Alien Resurrection, and think that "the baby is being thrown out with the bathwater" by rebooting from right after Aliens - and there'll be people who hate both and gloat over the "decanonization of the post-Aliens Alienverse".

 

I tend to think you need to start from the beginning.

Superman Returns was a horrible, horrible idea.

You can't start from "just after Superman 2 because I liked Superman and Superman 2 but hated 3 and IV."

 

Again in that case you will probably be more of a fan of the spinoffs. The trilogy concept really is tailor made for the Hero's Journey anyways. You meet a set of main characters. They face a great challenge and they either overcome that challenge or they do not.

 

Haha. Actually, even though Matthew Stover is always my number one pick, I think it would be amazing to get a conclusion novel from Timothy Zahn.

 

I do find the term 'shades of grey' lazy, empty, inaccurate and, for practical use in a discussion, useless! All that's ever meant by it is a mix of good and evil, pro and con, positive and negative, yin and yang but few bother to consider the mix. Is it 50/50, 60/40, 29/71?

What tends to be meant by the term is moral complexity so why not use that instead of that nebulous rubbish?

Ahem... Both Trek and Wars have demonstrated they can do moral complexity just fine, despite the accusation they can't.

As to the limits of the space opera, there certainly are limits and, to me, it's not a good idea to go past them.

The biggest problem I have had with SW for the last 15 years is its crippling identity and confidence crisis, which saw it look everywhere for inspiration and ideas to emulate except in itself! 5-year arc (Babylon 5), both sides are right (new BSG), voxyn (aliens + predator + Vornskr). It's no surprise that 1993-2005 saw a ton of excellent SF TV that really moved things forward, but instead of being inspired by that to trail blaze its own path SW shrank and followed others. Lucas' dithering and PT/TCW didn't help either.

 

I couldn't get into new BSG because of all of the changes from what I grew up with in marathons on Thanksgiving, though had I known space sci-fi would be reduced to just Defiance, which I am watching, I would have giving it more of a chance.

 

You still can - DVDs, streaming etc - the first 2 seasons are superb, after that it wobbles quite a bit.

 

I don't have time for that, I don't even have complete series of anything, including SG-1 and Atlantis, and I actually loved those.

 

Logical to set the sequel to ROTJ in a galaxy where the following has happened offscreen: Han, Leia and Luke marrying and having children; the Empire's slow crumble and defeat; an extragalactic invasion taking 365 trillion lives; Waru; Chewie's death; Anakin's death? Wouldn't that be pretty confusing?

 

Well, besides Firefly and Serenity, but that is a very special case, since it barely got a season and a sequel film.

No, but then again I read virtually all of that stuff. The first two are pretty much expected to happen anyway, which is why I was willing to see a different take on the NJO timeframe, but without at least the story through Survivor's Quest, I just don't care.

 

Not any more confusing than starting your entire film saga with the fourth episode in my opinion...