Music for the ANH Old Ben/Vader duel

the star wars films are timeless. they do not reflect the times in which they were made.



the music fits the scene. even unedited, badly layered, it fits thematically. imagine if they reshot the fight and rescored the entire scene using a slower version of the theme.


if you'd open your mind and stop trying to make the trilogies different, you'd see that it works.

 

I think in a way the silence in that scene (and others throughout the saga) gives it some realism too.
To me the score is one of the most important catalysts' for the emotional expierience that the SW films relay to us.
As I'm sure most everyone here will agree, hence all the passionate disscussion! But to keep it from becoming unintetionaly 'jokey' (for lack of a better term) it needs balance.

In ESB The Imperial March is predominant. Every little time you see Vader (or anything Imperial) his theme is heard at some point. And it works, and it's great!
But, by ROTJ it would seem 'jokey' or.... more fantastical then it's supposed to be to hear it every time we see that character. Fortunatly John Williams is the man and realized exactly that. Vader's theme is heard, mostly incomplete, in few and short statements. Keeping it repectful in a way.

I personally don't think the emotion that "Battle of The Heroes' conveyed in ROTS is right for this scene. I'm not talking about the speed of the sequence vs. the music either. Even if the scene was re-shot to be an energetic PT style battle, the conflict in the characters is not the same. It's gone. There are no reservations about killing one another this time. Ben knows that the friend, brother etc. that he did'nt want to kill before is absolutly no more. And naturally, for 20+ years Vader has thought about little else than Obi-Wan handing him his ***, removing 3 limbs, lecturing him instead of finding water, and overall diminishing his power and potential by at least half.
There is no love in this one.
To me BOTH isn't just about the action of the scene, but the emotional conflict in the characters as well.


Anyway I'm done rambling on.
I just like the scene the way it is.

 

Well said. I agree.

 

so what do you suggest? a new theme? something more like duel of the fates, with lots of imperial march and force theme? leave battle of heroes for episode 6?

 

if you'd open your mind and stop trying to make the trilogies different, you'd see that it works.


WE didn't make the trilogies different; Lucas did. It's not our fault that he made two trilogies that really don't work together as a solitary saga; and don't get mad at those who think it would be a bad idea to change the superior trilogy to make it fit with the inferior one instead of vice-versa.

 

how sad.

 

Stop the personal attacks now.

 

personal attacks?

 

As in "open your mind" and "how sad". We don't need snide remarks like that about others' opinions.

 

Now, I mean this as politely as possible, but Neomp5, I think you'd enjoy this thread:

Should the OT be remade?

 

Shouldn't that thread be re-named "Should the OT be changed again?" After all, after the SE and the DVDs, the question as it stands is kind of moot...

 

"Remade" is different from "changed".

 

eerrrrr...

prince : diamond and pearls.... but if not that, then no music ....

 

Did you read and/or comprehend what I wrote??
If you had I don't think you'd ask this.

 

i understood what you said. you don't want the evil prequels to pervert the sacred perfect trilogy. i'm asking you to be reasonable.

 

*SIGH*

Neo, what he said was that there are thematic reasons why BOTH wouldn't be appropriate, and stylistic reasons why silence is quite possibly best. Isn't it possible, OT vs. PT completely asside, that the story and the moment just don't need music?

 

no. have you seen how awkward the fight is now? the fight it's self is desperately in need of fixing. and the silence is just wrong for the scene, especially considering it's significance in the overall saga, and even more if they fixed the fight.



you're just trying to rationalise the position you've already taken. that's called backwards reasoning. conclusion first, rationale for it second

 

Actually, I'm talking JMN77's point- mine is completely different. Yes, I agree that the fight isn't GOOD right now. I think it may work the best that it can right now, though- I don't know. But I don't think adding any of the other faster-paced music from the PT will help. Maybe a new composition designed for the scene specifically- but not BOTH.

 

that's why i said a SLOW battle of heroes. SLOOOOOOOW.

 

Personally I like the PT more.
You understood what I said like a fish understands Japanese.
You sir, are far from reasonable.
Stop feeling attacked and READ what people write for once.

 

you are trying to put a dividing line where there isn't one

 

What??

I'm done with you.
Good luck with everything you do.

 

good riddance

 

neo_mp5, the point of a discussion isn't for everybody to just give up and agree with you. We're allowed to have differing points of view.

 

Neo, how is "Good riddance" helpful in the slightest? As far as I can see, at least he was trying to have a rational, levelheaded discussion. You're not winning any PT fans this way...

So, you have strong beliefs about SW music. So do we. Can't you at least accept that we have our reasons, we strongly believe in them, and we're sticking to them unless something extremely persuasive- and specific, a response to the point we made, not a general accusation of hating the PT, convinces us otherwise? Especially as long as you continue to act and believe the exact same way, just with the opposite viewpoint? After all, only the Music Forum members deal in absolutes!

BTW- I don't suppose you happen to be a poster on www.nitcentral.com/discus, do you? You remind me of my old debate foes there... I could never win an argument there, either.